Rex
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Post by Rex on Apr 6, 2020 11:52:47 GMT
Bring in a new temporary income tax on earners above a specific amount. You could probably even - initially- make it voluntary. We already have that. Anybody can send any %, over and above the legally required sum of their income to HMRC. Publicise that fact then.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 6, 2020 11:54:14 GMT
Footballers wages are just a reflection of modern society. Instead of top sportsman,business and CEO's etc etc making really good money as they used to they actually make millions. Its vulgar but its not just footballers.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 6, 2020 11:58:39 GMT
We already have that. Anybody can send any %, over and above the legally required sum of their income to HMRC. Publicise that fact then. That sounds desperate. If you wanted to do something like that you would soon find out.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 6, 2020 12:01:51 GMT
Your just stereotyping them as if somehow all footballers behave in the same way. Total nonsense. Stereotyping is generally lazy and inaccurate. But with premiership footballers (with very few exceptions) - I'm perfectly happy with the stereotype. I'm not suggesting that every premiership footballer taking a 50% pay cut is fair and equitable. But I would suggest that (say) a 75% tax payable directly to the NHS starting at a threshhold of (say) £0.5mil a year would make 'the noise' go away. (£0.5mil pa = £9,615.38 a WEEK). At the moment football is in the middle of an almighty marketing disaster. It deserves the media attention because it is the national game. All this comment about "the media picking on working class lads" is total b*llsh*t. They can be educated at their local comprehensive, Eton or Harrow. Don't care. Not relevant. All sports 'stars' should be treated the same. Motor racing drivers, tennis players, golfers, cricketers... you name it. Cross that threshhold - get your cheque book out. They play the sport they love and are paid obscene amount of money for the privilege. Time to give some back. What would your solution be vertigo? Do nothing? My point is that its silly to pick on footballers,why not just very wealthy people? Like i said before they are easy targets.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 6, 2020 12:02:46 GMT
Footballers wages are just a reflection of modern society. Instead of top sportsman,business and CEO's etc etc making really good money as they used to they actually make millions. Its vulgar but its not just footballers. Again, this has come to a head because 5 clubs are dipping their hands into public funds whilst still paying these players a huge wage. In principle though, I agree. Wonder what Lewis Hamilton is doing today to help? Last I heard from him he had run away to a private villa to make sure that he was safe. He loves to wave The Union Flag and talk about being from Stevenage, his basic wage is £800,000 a week, and he doesn't even pay tax here. So he probably deserves some scrutiny around about now as well.
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Rex
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Post by Rex on Apr 6, 2020 12:12:12 GMT
Publicise that fact then. That sounds desperate.If you wanted to do something like that you would soon find out. Desperate times.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 6, 2020 12:24:35 GMT
That sounds desperate.If you wanted to do something like that you would soon find out. Desperate times. The thing is, people have no difficulty finding out that in some circumstances they can put in a few fuel receipts, or a receipt for the shoes they need for work, that type of thing, so the information is there, if someone is motivated to look for it.
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irishrover
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Post by irishrover on Apr 6, 2020 12:33:40 GMT
Stereotyping is generally lazy and inaccurate. But with premiership footballers (with very few exceptions) - I'm perfectly happy with the stereotype. I'm not suggesting that every premiership footballer taking a 50% pay cut is fair and equitable. But I would suggest that (say) a 75% tax payable directly to the NHS starting at a threshhold of (say) £0.5mil a year would make 'the noise' go away. (£0.5mil pa = £9,615.38 a WEEK). At the moment football is in the middle of an almighty marketing disaster. It deserves the media attention because it is the national game. All this comment about "the media picking on working class lads" is total b*llsh*t. They can be educated at their local comprehensive, Eton or Harrow. Don't care. Not relevant. All sports 'stars' should be treated the same. Motor racing drivers, tennis players, golfers, cricketers... you name it. Cross that threshhold - get your cheque book out. They play the sport they love and are paid obscene amount of money for the privilege. Time to give some back. What would your solution be vertigo? Do nothing? My point is that its silly to pick on footballers,why not just very wealthy people? Like i said before they are easy targets. I agree - footballers seem to be getting a disproportionate amount of stick here compared with other wealthy groups who are in the same boat.
It's understandable why they're cautious in publicising what they do sometimes. Raheem Sterling gets all kinds of abuse in the English press for being the definition of a stereotype playboy footballer but around my area he's hugely respected for the effort and money he puts into the community. He funds lots of local projects and supports, both through his charitable donations and his time, to a number of organisations and causes. The one time he tried to publicise any of this the Sun and Social Media jumped down his throat for virtue signalling because people don't want to let him out of the 'arrogant playboy footballer' box. It does seem like they can't win sometimes. These aren't politicians or campaigners, they're just people whop have a made a lot of money playing football so I'm not surprised they occasionally go 'F this' if that's the response they get.
There are a lot of stories like that out there and there are lot of stories of footballers getting badly ripped off by agents, accountants, charities, investment schemes, hangers on etc. A depressing number end up broke. You have to think that footballers themselves are constantly discussing these kind of horror stories with each other. So I'm not surprised that some of them are naturally a bit cautious and look for an overall credible scheme to be set-up they can back.
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Rex
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Post by Rex on Apr 6, 2020 12:39:24 GMT
The thing is, people have no difficulty finding out that in some circumstances they can put in a few fuel receipts, or a receipt for the shoes they need for work, that type of thing, so the information is there, if someone is motivated to look for it. While that is true, the footballers are under a bit of fire at the moment so I think the solution would be to publicise things, maybe some sort of register that celebs could sign up to 'I've made the NHS tax pledge' kind of thing. That should get the media off their back and raise funds.
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kingswood Polak
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Post by kingswood Polak on Apr 6, 2020 12:39:43 GMT
Liverpool and tottingham can also now be added to that list. Liverpool made profits of over 500 million last year ! What a bunch of Counts But thats how capitalism works is it not? Is it just bad if football clubs make profit but ok for other companies? I just mentioned it in the context that a club making such profits could, easily, have paid the wages. It really is obscene to expect the taxpayer to pay the wages in such circumstances and I believe the premiership clubs should be excluded from such schemes as I also think certain multi billionaires be excluded from such schemes. It’s crazy to have such wealth yet look for handouts. It truly sickens me but it’s no a shock. These people get wealthy by using loopholes and tax avoiding accountants yet have the gall to expect the working classes to pay them
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 6, 2020 12:42:19 GMT
The thing is, people have no difficulty finding out that in some circumstances they can put in a few fuel receipts, or a receipt for the shoes they need for work, that type of thing, so the information is there, if someone is motivated to look for it. While that is true, the footballers are under a bit of fire at the moment so I think the solution would be to publicise things, maybe some sort of register that celebs could sign up to 'I've made the NHS tax pledge' kind of thing. That should get the media off their back and raise funds. Sure, that sounds fair. I think also that whilst probably a lot of these guys do charity work and already support causes and don't want publicity for it, now would be a good time for them to go public and let us know who they've been helping in the past.
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kingswood Polak
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Post by kingswood Polak on Apr 6, 2020 12:45:47 GMT
My point is that its silly to pick on footballers,why not just very wealthy people? Like i said before they are easy targets. I agree - footballers seem to be getting a disproportionate amount of stick here compared with other wealthy groups who are in the same boat.
It's understandable why they're cautious in publicising what they do sometimes. Raheem Sterling gets all kinds of abuse in the English press for being the definition of a stereotype playboy footballer but around my area he's hugely respected for the effort and money he puts into the community. He funds lots of local projects and supports, both through his charitable donations and his time, to a number of organisations and causes. The one time he tried to publicise any of this the Sun and Social Media jumped down his throat for virtue signalling because people don't want to let him out of the 'arrogant playboy footballer' box. It does seem like they can't win sometimes. These aren't politicians or campaigners, they're just people whop have a made a lot of money playing football so I'm not surprised they occasionally go 'F this' if that's the response they get.
There are a lot of stories like that out there and there are lot of stories of footballers getting badly ripped off by agents, accountants, charities, investment schemes, hangers on etc. A depressing number end up broke. You have to think that footballers themselves are constantly discussing these kind of horror stories with each other. So I'm not surprised that some of them are naturally a bit cautious and look for an overall credible scheme to be set-up they can back.
I really took a shine to Mario Balotelli and long before this. He would rock up to a petrol station, at random times, and stay for 2 hours and pay for everyone’s fuel. When police asked him why he had 5K on him, in cash, he replied because I am rich. Now that is exactly the sort of thing that I’d love to do. He is not your usual player though. It cheered me up when I read about it
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warehamgas
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Post by warehamgas on Apr 6, 2020 18:36:12 GMT
Now that Liverpool have reversed their former position of furloughing staff, just announced, it will probably be quite influential in other people’s thinking. They are obviously very aware of what their fans think. UTG! www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/52191140
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eppinggas
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Post by eppinggas on Apr 6, 2020 20:23:00 GMT
Now that Liverpool have reversed their former position of furloughing staff, just announced, it will probably be quite influential in other people’s thinking. They are obviously very aware of what their fans think. UTG! www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/52191140This is fantastic news. This is what happens when supporters stick together and make their feelings known when principles are being sacrificed by a Football Club in pursuit of profit. I think they also had a minor rebellion over ticket prices, that they also won. I applaud the Liverpool fans. We need to be more like them. Respect to the scousers. (Rex and vertigo - I'll get back to you). UTG.
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eppinggas
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Post by eppinggas on Apr 6, 2020 20:56:11 GMT
Let me know what statement I have made that you would like me to back up. At worst I'll concede it's my opinion rather than 'fact' (whatever a fact is these days of fake news...). Anyway - back to the case in point - what would your solution be Rex? Do nothing?Bring in a new temporary income tax on earners above a specific amount. You could probably even - initially- make it voluntary. I think we need to separate out "Sport" (not just footballers) from the wider economy. Though as I said earlier - I don't mind debating the wider economy elsewhere. Your plan is not a bad plan Sir. Make it voluntary and publicise every single sportsman who signs up to it. Shame the others into signing up. Fine by me. Strange times Rex. Here is the irony. My politics are right of centre (quite a long way right of centre from an economic/financial perspective to be honest). And I'm proposing Government intervention and higher taxes (in sport). I would imagine you are left of centre (please correct me if I'm wrong). Sounds a bit like you are advocating footballers have every right to retain 100% of their exorbitant salary (should they so wish) in a time of a national crisis? Is this because uncontrolled capitalism is great? Note. As long as we can discuss 'politics' politely and do not resort to mud-slinging and name calling, I am happy for it to continue. I actually quite like to hear the 'other side of the debate'. But any derogatory language and it won't continue. As long as we are polite to each other and respect each others opinion (quite possibly through gritted teeth) - fine by me. Mods - please add comment if necessary.
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eppinggas
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Post by eppinggas on Apr 6, 2020 21:10:33 GMT
Stereotyping is generally lazy and inaccurate. But with premiership footballers (with very few exceptions) - I'm perfectly happy with the stereotype. I'm not suggesting that every premiership footballer taking a 50% pay cut is fair and equitable. But I would suggest that (say) a 75% tax payable directly to the NHS starting at a threshhold of (say) £0.5mil a year would make 'the noise' go away. (£0.5mil pa = £9,615.38 a WEEK). At the moment football is in the middle of an almighty marketing disaster. It deserves the media attention because it is the national game. All this comment about "the media picking on working class lads" is total b*llsh*t. They can be educated at their local comprehensive, Eton or Harrow. Don't care. Not relevant. All sports 'stars' should be treated the same. Motor racing drivers, tennis players, golfers, cricketers... you name it. Cross that threshhold - get your cheque book out. They play the sport they love and are paid obscene amount of money for the privilege. Time to give some back. What would your solution be vertigo? Do nothing? My point is that its silly to pick on footballers,why not just very wealthy people? Like i said before they are easy targets. I would say because the debate here is focused on football (and the wider world of sport). There is a good reason why they are easy (and thoroughly worthy) targets. It is our national sport. Our national obsession. They don't work excessive hours. They are idolised. People hang on their every "tweet". It is debatable how much they actually contribute to their Club's bottom line. Sanchez at Man Utd? £500k a week? Get the f*ck out of here (not you personally). Not having it.
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Rex
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Post by Rex on Apr 6, 2020 21:37:26 GMT
Bring in a new temporary income tax on earners above a specific amount. You could probably even - initially- make it voluntary. I think we need to separate out "Sport" (not just footballers) from the wider economy. Though as I said earlier - I don't mind debating the wider economy elsewhere. Your plan is not a bad plan Sir. Make it voluntary and publicise every single sportsman who signs up to it. Shame the others into signing up. Fine by me. Strange times Rex. Here is the irony. My politics are right of centre (quite a long way right of centre from an economic/financial perspective to be honest). And I'm proposing Government intervention and higher taxes (in sport). I would imagine you are left of centre (please correct me if I'm wrong). Sounds a bit like you are advocating footballers have every right to retain 100% of their exorbitant salary (should they so wish) in a time of a national crisis? Is this because uncontrolled capitalism is great? Note. As long as we can discuss 'politics' politely and do not resort to mud-slinging and name calling, I am happy for it to continue. I actually quite like to hear the 'other side of the debate'. But any derogatory language and it won't continue. As long as we are polite to each other and respect each others opinion (quite possibly through gritted teeth) - fine by me. Mods - please add comment if necessary. Well obviously they have the right as does anyone, I would like to see them help financially but no more than I would like to see eg Jacob Rees Mogg help out. I cannot see why you think footballers should be treated differently to any other super rich person. I don't think uncontrolled capitalism is great, it just happens to be the way of the world and I suspect it always will be.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 6, 2020 21:55:44 GMT
But thats how capitalism works is it not? Is it just bad if football clubs make profit but ok for other companies? I just mentioned it in the context that a club making such profits could, easily, have paid the wages. It really is obscene to expect the taxpayer to pay the wages in such circumstances and I believe the premiership clubs should be excluded from such schemes as I also think certain multi billionaires be excluded from such schemes. It’s crazy to have such wealth yet look for handouts. It truly sickens me but it’s no a shock. These people get wealthy by using loopholes and tax avoiding accountants yet have the gall to expect the working classes to pay them There has been a backlash on this subject and i noticed liverpool have done a complete u-turn and are now continuing to pay non playing staff. You could argue that other companies have made shed loads of money before the crisis but are still using the 80% scheme. The thing that stands out and looks bad at football clubs is that the players are getting their £600k per month but their laying off their near minimum wage employees and using the government scheme. That is a PR disaster for certain.
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warehamgas
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Post by warehamgas on Apr 6, 2020 22:35:56 GMT
Stereotyping is generally lazy and inaccurate. But with premiership footballers (with very few exceptions) - I'm perfectly happy with the stereotype. I'm not suggesting that every premiership footballer taking a 50% pay cut is fair and equitable. But I would suggest that (say) a 75% tax payable directly to the NHS starting at a threshhold of (say) £0.5mil a year would make 'the noise' go away. (£0.5mil pa = £9,615.38 a WEEK). At the moment football is in the middle of an almighty marketing disaster. It deserves the media attention because it is the national game. All this comment about "the media picking on working class lads" is total b*llsh*t. They can be educated at their local comprehensive, Eton or Harrow. Don't care. Not relevant. All sports 'stars' should be treated the same. Motor racing drivers, tennis players, golfers, cricketers... you name it. Cross that threshhold - get your cheque book out. They play the sport they love and are paid obscene amount of money for the privilege. Time to give some back. What would your solution be vertigo? Do nothing? My point is that its silly to pick on footballers,why not just very wealthy people? Like i said before they are easy targets. Agree with this about wealthy people generally but I guess a big difference is that perhaps some of the very wealthy people aren’t employed by companies (PL clubs) who are furloughing non-playing staff and applying to get government money to pay the clubs’ staffs. I think it is the hypocrisy of very, very wealthy clubs using a scheme (which I dont think was meant for them but other non football companies) to get out of their own problems, get out of their responsibilities when they are very wealthy clubs. Pretty sure tax payers should not be funding PL clubs or any football club for that matter when “stars” are being paid the salaries they are. Whilst that is not necessarily the fault of the players but in this current situation the players can’t really pretend or think they are an easy target. They are very, very wealthy people who may well be keeping their salaries whilst other club workers are put on furlough and the clubs are expecting the government to pick up the tab. Total hypocrisy and in the present situation totally unacceptable. By all means think of ways of getting wealthy people to pay more but that is unlikely to happen. Whilst I don’t like the PL stars paying the huge wages they do I understand why but when the clubs have a problem over cash flow etc then they shouldn’t turn round and expect the government to pick up the tab on their lowest paid employees. They can’t have it both ways. I think the issue is clouded by the individual action by some last week which just highlighted the whole issue and now they are trying to consider collective action which is a clearly more difficult to achieve and is coming over as a responsive action not a proactive one. They’ve been forced into considering it not initiating it. Football and footballers, mainly the PL, but not exclusively, have placed themselves and assumed a privileged position and have over a very long period of time taken financial advantage of the cash-cow football has become. The clubs have been happy to pay these contracts thinking it would go on and on. Well, now the situation has come to an abrupt end, albeit temporarily, and they are now attempting to portray themselves in a better light and are all running around firing off on twitter and trying to sound earnest and upright. Its a bit like the story of the Emperor’s New Clothes, alternatively it’s a load of total bo****. Keep safe. UTG!
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 6, 2020 23:57:01 GMT
My point is that its silly to pick on footballers,why not just very wealthy people? Like i said before they are easy targets. Agree with this about wealthy people generally but I guess a big difference is that perhaps some of the very wealthy people aren’t employed by companies (PL clubs) who are furloughing non-playing staff and applying to get government money to pay the clubs’ staffs. I think it is the hypocrisy of very, very wealthy clubs using a scheme (which I dont think was meant for them but other non football companies) to get out of their own problems, get out of their responsibilities when they are very wealthy clubs. Pretty sure tax payers should not be funding PL clubs or any football club for that matter when “stars” are being paid the salaries they are. Whilst that is not necessarily the fault of the players but in this current situation the players can’t really pretend or think they are an easy target. They are very, very wealthy people who may well be keeping their salaries whilst other club workers are put on furlough and the clubs are expecting the government to pick up the tab. Total hypocrisy and in the present situation totally unacceptable. By all means think of ways of getting wealthy people to pay more but that is unlikely to happen. Whilst I don’t like the PL stars paying the huge wages they do I understand why but when the clubs have a problem over cash flow etc then they shouldn’t turn round and expect the government to pick up the tab on their lowest paid employees. They can’t have it both ways. I think the issue is clouded by the individual action by some last week which just highlighted the whole issue and now they are trying to consider collective action which is a clearly more difficult to achieve and is coming over as a responsive action not a proactive one. They’ve been forced into considering it not initiating it. Football and footballers, mainly the PL, but not exclusively, have placed themselves and assumed a privileged position and have over a very long period of time taken financial advantage of the cash-cow football has become. The clubs have been happy to pay these contracts thinking it would go on and on. Well, now the situation has come to an abrupt end, albeit temporarily, and they are now attempting to portray themselves in a better light and are all running around firing off on twitter and trying to sound earnest and upright. Its a bit like the story of the Emperor’s New Clothes, alternatively it’s a load of total bo****. Keep safe. UTG! My original point is about people lashing out at the actual players not the clubs. Plenty of very wealthy top staff at currently redundant businesses are not being a target for critical comment. To me the idea of getting better contribution during the crisis from wealthy people is nothing to do with football but an theory that individuals earning a certain amount of money maybe could help more during the crisis. How can it be right to lash out at raheem sterling while not bothering at all with richard branson or jacob rees-mogg?
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