Deleted
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Post by Deleted on May 20, 2018 9:57:19 GMT
I haven’t actually gone away Shoveler but I’ve realised that a lot of my postings are not of much interest to the majority of fans and in fact they upset quite a few. Being of the same generation as KP I understand how he feels and it is very frustrating to find so many Rovers fans are completely content with mediocrity. Back in the day we used to sing “we hate Aston Villa, we hate Fulham too” and now I guess we would sing “we hate Wycombe Wanderers we hate Fleetwood too”. I can understand that thousands of fans are still having fun watching Rovers and following the team around the country just as I did. But when you start to accept second best and go out of your way to convince yourself everything is well, despite all the evidence to the contrary, I think you are on a slippery slope. My view of the Dwane Sports regime is very similar to the one I had of the Higgs regime which is that if there truly was a vision and a plan we would be getting the message loud and clear. When business owners are on top of their game they want to share their vision and plans because that’s part of the thrill of owning a business. Some fans say Dwane Sports don’t communicate because they are cautious bankers and private people but to me that doesn't stack up because in 2016 Wael was all over the media telling us his life story and what his plans were for Rovers. The reality is that when things are not going well behind those famous scenes we find that business owners start to contradict themselves, get irritable with critics and eventually cease communication altogether which is what seems to be happening now. A friend told me recently that he was absolutely delighted with the polished and professional event management at the Players Awards Evening which is something we have been yearning for at Rovers for many years. But, as a businessman, he cannot bring himself to hide away from the underlying negative outlook in terms of finance and lack of leadership. I have never claimed to be ITK but, like KP, the snippets of information I do get point to a situation which, if left unchecked, will completely overwhelm the positive cosmetic changes and the feel good factor which Darrell Clarke has managed to induce at the club. This is why my great hope is that Dwane Sports are actively seeking to attract new investment into Rovers and will be willing, if necessary, to capitalise their loan and relinquish their majority stake in order to secure it. Heresy! Burn the witch! Some very valid points. Keep posting. Regarding the bit in bold. They have stated that that they are not looking for out-side investment. And at that point - I scratch my head. Unless they are truly happy to write off £2mil a year in perpetuity on a dilapidated stadium and some tents in a crappy bit of north east Bristol. In fairness, what they said they didn't want to discuss was some nebulous 'pub talk' plan which Vaughan was told time after time to go away, put together as a proper structured proposal, with some financial commitment from backers and take back to them. He didn't do that.
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kingswood Polak
Without music life would be a mistake
Joined: May 2014
Posts: 10,278
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Post by kingswood Polak on May 20, 2018 12:10:11 GMT
Ah, ok, maybe I’ve got it wrong then. If so then I apologise unreservedly as it was that article that I read it from. Note to other posters. When you post something that is incorrect or has been mis-interpreted - it is perfectly acceptable to issue something called "an apology". Keep posting KP. Hope you're feeling better. UTG. Thanks eppinggas. I have never had a problem in giving an apology when I’ve been proved wrong and I’ve done so on a fair few occasions. In honesty, I don’t care what certain people think of me. I’ve never hidden my identity and have sent my personal details to certain posters in the hope that maybe they would maybe either have a meet up or say what they say but to my face and no, not meant in any threatening manner. My home and kettle are open to anyone who would maybe prefer to talk in person than in cyberspace. Sadly, the majority would not ever do that and are much happier sniping from behind a keyboard. I have always said that what I write on here, I would repeat in reality and that includes any apologies. Thanks for asking about the health crap. As it happens, I am really not well and the drug is not yet working and my ex is busy trying to make life difficult. I just take it in my stride now, life has a way of balancing things up. The absolute truth is that I’m considering telling the specialists to stop treating me and let nature run it’s course but maybe that’s a bit of depression talking but we shall see. The hardest part, believe it or not, is that I am not allowed in direct sunlight and that is upsetting me the most. I then ask myself what is the point of living when you are basically tied to your house or, if out, I have to seek shade ? Wishing you and your son a great summer.
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kingswood Polak
Without music life would be a mistake
Joined: May 2014
Posts: 10,278
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Post by kingswood Polak on May 20, 2018 12:19:53 GMT
Bring back KS/RR/CIS/NQSS. Bring back SWISS. Bring back INTERCEPTOR. Bring back ASTAVJEVS. Cheer up KP. You could be KD. I really am not upset. This is just a football forum and I have much more on my plate that makes this place feel very easy upon me. It’s just words on a page and we are all entitled to write them. If posting on here did upset me then I’d be so very disappointed in myself. Thank you though, I do appreciate the kind thoughts
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kingswood Polak
Without music life would be a mistake
Joined: May 2014
Posts: 10,278
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Post by kingswood Polak on May 20, 2018 12:23:03 GMT
Nothing is “OURS” o2, it’s all owned by the family. Given that our previous owners and chairmen were gas then we could claim it was still ours even if not technically true but the facts are the the family and their company, Dwane sports, own all of what we play in and use. We just have to hope that Wael can bring his sibling to be as enthused as him. The potential is huge but we need a significant investment to make that potential a reality In other words, our ownership system is exactly the same as Bristol City's which you keep praising. Go figure. We are owned by Dwayne Sports and they are owned by Bristol Sports. They just happen to be a few years ahead of us - I don't know for sure if we will catch up, but from every discussion I've had and everything I've read about the Al-Qadi family, they are totally committed to BRFC - why do you think Wael has decided to concentrate only on BRFC? It's funny how they were everyones favourite people in the world until they canned the UWE Stadium then suddenly all the conspiracy theorists came back out of the woodwork under which they had been hiding until last August. We all have our own opinions and I'd suggest the middle ground is the best place to be - I'm not 100% convinced the new stadium will materialise, but am 100% convinced the training ground will. The difference being that their owner will always find a way and has proved his value to that club whereas we get promises that never materialise.
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kingswood Polak
Without music life would be a mistake
Joined: May 2014
Posts: 10,278
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Post by kingswood Polak on May 20, 2018 12:28:41 GMT
Bring back KS/RR/CIS/NQSS. Bring back SWISS. Bring back INTERCEPTOR. Bring back ASTAVJEVS. Cheer up KP. You could be KD. I haven’t actually gone away Shoveler but I’ve realised that a lot of my postings are not of much interest to the majority of fans and in fact they upset quite a few. Being of the same generation as KP I understand how he feels and it is very frustrating to find so many Rovers fans are completely content with mediocrity. Back in the day we used to sing “we hate Aston Villa, we hate Fulham too” and now I guess we would sing “we hate Wycombe Wanderers we hate Fleetwood too”. I can understand that thousands of fans are still having fun watching Rovers and following the team around the country just as I did. But when you start to accept second best and go out of your way to convince yourself everything is well, despite all the evidence to the contrary, I think you are on a slippery slope. My view of the Dwane Sports regime is very similar to the one I had of the Higgs regime which is that if there truly was a vision and a plan we would be getting the message loud and clear. When business owners are on top of their game they want to share their vision and plans because that’s part of the thrill of owning a business. Some fans say Dwane Sports don’t communicate because they are cautious bankers and private people but to me that doesn't stack up because in 2016 Wael was all over the media telling us his life story and what his plans were for Rovers. The reality is that when things are not going well behind those famous scenes we find that business owners start to contradict themselves, get irritable with critics and eventually cease communication altogether which is what seems to be happening now. A friend told me recently that he was absolutely delighted with the polished and professional event management at the Players Awards Evening which is something we have been yearning for at Rovers for many years. But, as a businessman, he cannot bring himself to hide away from the underlying negative outlook in terms of finance and lack of leadership. I have never claimed to be ITK but, like KP, the snippets of information I do get point to a situation which, if left unchecked, will completely overwhelm the positive cosmetic changes and the feel good factor which Darrell Clarke has managed to induce at the club. This is why my great hope is that Dwane Sports are actively seeking to attract new investment into Rovers and will be willing, if necessary, to capitalise their loan and relinquish their majority stake in order to secure it. Nail on the head. Great to see you posting again swissgas. I thought maybe you were one of the group that took a collective decision to leave this forum. Great to see you back
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kingswood Polak
Without music life would be a mistake
Joined: May 2014
Posts: 10,278
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Post by kingswood Polak on May 20, 2018 12:54:57 GMT
I’ve realised that a lot of my postings are not of much interest to the majority of fans and in fact they upset quite a few. I am certain you are wrong about interest in your writing. Whether we agree or disagree, I hope and believe most of us want to hear the whole breadth of analysis and opinion from all who care about Rovers. That needs to include the writing of people who know more than ducks about running football clubs and other business. On people getting upset, perhaps they could consider reserving their upset for those in life who might actually abuse or injure them. We, as a society, need to stop getting so upset that we read facts or opinions that do not support our own viewpoint. It's embarrassing. It's babyish. We can disagree. Stop getting upset, people. @shoveller. We live in a society now where people choose to be offended. I’ve said this before, on here, that being offended is a choice and this forum is still much better than many other social media outlets. If you want to see how being offended has been taken to another level then go onto gaschat. I occasionally pop on over to there and just for the comedy value. What really gets my goat is the fact that the majority of our fanbase would seemingly prefer to keep the blinkers on than look at the reality of the information we have had, such as the most recent books and the publishing of where we stand in budgets for players plus the few outbursts DC aired, before something happened to stop that. There is a fair bit that just doesn’t pan out when put under scrutiny but the majority are just happy just as long as they can get plastered and sometimes pay attention to a football match that they have paid to watch. I don’t know why I feel a need to say this first part but there are a fair few of us that don’t have the luxury of time to carry on waiting and no, I’m not looking for pity nor even understanding but, if I was, it would not be on here. You only have to look at the UWE debacle to see things are not right. The owners commission a feasibility study and that comes back showing in the positive yet we just then back out of it. My own personal feeling is that the UWE was the best ever chance we had to progress the club but I need to now put that to bed. Catch you later my feathered friend. It’s people like you & eppinggas that keep me coming back but I am also delighted that swissgas has posted again.
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kingswood Polak
Without music life would be a mistake
Joined: May 2014
Posts: 10,278
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Post by kingswood Polak on May 20, 2018 13:10:06 GMT
What reason would I have to do that. If I felt like that then I wouldn’t bother going let alone get involved in any forum talk. I’ve invested over 40 plus years in supporting the club. I could write an essay after reading that but basically I will just say that all I want is for the good of the club and hope that we have ambition enough to better our position. I’m just not one of those people who will stay quiet when things are not looking good is all. We seem to have a fanbase that are happy enough with staying as we are and I will never understand that Firstly, can I just say that I have never, and will never be, part of a ‘clique’. These days I just go to games with a couple of people on here (won’t embarrass them by naming them), enjoy the game and go home, a little sad or (usually) a little bit happier than before. And that’s it, I’m not going to let Rovers dominate my life other than work as it has done in the past. The reason that I get hacked off with the sort of comments like your original one is that for many people it is a trait that has only happened in the past couple of years, when these same people were telling people like myself who weren’t silent to do the same when Higgs and, yes, Geoff Dunford were running the club as what seemed to be a personal fiefdom. Some of the Facebook comments especially have started to become beyond vile from a few people. The biggest irony for me is that football wise the last couple of years have been amonst the best in my 40 years of going, especially with regards to the style of football. To me it all seems like rank hypocrisy as the Al Qadis and board are trying to turn the club from a corner shop operation into a structure fit for purpose in the 21st Century, and in the space of about 26 months. Yes, the UWE stadium collapsing was a body blow to us all, but none of us have real information as to the reasons why, so just make up our own conjecture. There are two sides to every story and I’m inclined to believe that there probably wasn’t enough non matchday earning potential and that we would have ended up with a scenario similar to Eastville, where UWE would have trousered any income from hospitality during the week and the like. You only have to see how much Ashton Gate makes through this nowadays to realise that this is a valuable income stream to be successful. Do I think that the current regime are perfect? Far from it, but there have been enough ‘marginal gains’ to keep me happy for now. Putting a proper seated facility in for families falls under this category. Along with other acquaintances I will give them another year to deliver something tangible in terms of stadium development, as without that progression will ultimately be non existent. But I’m not going to start sniping because of something that is ultimately a good thing in the here and now. Fair comment although I am not one of those that has been venting, just in the last couple of years. I’ve been a constant asker of questions and sent many letters, handwritten, to 3 of our chairmen and el presidente. I’m just not one to start bragging, like many did, when we got the planning for UWE and when the AQ family took over. I really am not up to trawling this forum for examples right now but Angas knows I was asking people to be en guarde when we did get bought out. Here’s a little piece of information for you. Nick Higgs has not renewed his box for next season and has, instead, bought some 8-10 ST’s for the Dribuild. I only wish I could say much more of what I know to be true but I have realised that this is not the place to do so. The fact remains, we cannot keep over achieving and the owners will definitely not continue to haemorrhage 2 million + per season. Like Swiss, my hope is that we maybe do get different people run the club and people who truly know football. Anyway, my shoulder is hurting so badly that I have to end this visit. UTG
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on May 20, 2018 13:12:28 GMT
In other words, our ownership system is exactly the same as Bristol City's which you keep praising. Go figure. We are owned by Dwayne Sports and they are owned by Bristol Sports. They just happen to be a few years ahead of us - I don't know for sure if we will catch up, but from every discussion I've had and everything I've read about the Al-Qadi family, they are totally committed to BRFC - why do you think Wael has decided to concentrate only on BRFC? It's funny how they were everyones favourite people in the world until they canned the UWE Stadium then suddenly all the conspiracy theorists came back out of the woodwork under which they had been hiding until last August. We all have our own opinions and I'd suggest the middle ground is the best place to be - I'm not 100% convinced the new stadium will materialise, but am 100% convinced the training ground will. The difference being that their owner will always find a way and has proved his value to that club whereas we get promises that never materialise. Haven't double checked, but from memory, I think it's now the same length of time since UWE fell out of bed as elapsed between 1982's new stadium being abandoned and Lansdown announcing that he was investing £45m into redeveloping the existing ground. Wael is right, these things do take time, Lansdown showed us exactly how much time. Our latest announcement is something about a tent and a few ironing boards for families to sit on
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kingswood Polak
Without music life would be a mistake
Joined: May 2014
Posts: 10,278
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Post by kingswood Polak on May 20, 2018 13:20:13 GMT
The difference being that their owner will always find a way and has proved his value to that club whereas we get promises that never materialise. Haven't double checked, but from memory, I think it's now the same length of time since UWE fell out of bed as elapsed between 1982's new stadium being abandoned and Lansdown announcing that he was investing £45m into redeveloping the existing ground. Wael is right, these things do take time, Lansdown showed us exactly how much time. Our latest announcement is something about a tent and a few ironing boards for families to sit on I will private message you @bambergasgroin
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Deleted
Joined: January 1970
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Post by Deleted on May 20, 2018 14:06:17 GMT
Must admit to not knowing about any cliques KP. I guess some have entrenched views one way or the other. Some of us are ambivalent. It's just opinions though. Good health to you and everyone on this site, even the reds.
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Deleted
Joined: January 1970
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Post by Deleted on May 20, 2018 14:11:58 GMT
Looks like we're adding tents as opposed to taking them away as part of the memorial stadium upgrade. In all fairness to wael etc this still equates to mega bucks for a Jordanian business man. Just not what we were hoping for let's hope I'm wrong and the bulldozers move in some time soon.
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vaughan
Joined: June 2014
Posts: 1,237
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Post by vaughan on May 20, 2018 14:34:04 GMT
BG
I did not create a plan in a pub. Please don't be rude. I wrote to the Chairman about options that clubs bigger the ours were using to fund capital investments. These are options that the AlQs do not wish to pursue, which is entirely their prerogative.
I am always interested in Swiss' views as he has a brain, articulates his views well and has no axe to grind.
The new owners have raised the bar in terms of professionalism. Their is a rationale behind the approach, but there needs to be a revolution for us to contemplate any longevity in The Championship.
More importantly, we are a happy football club in the context of football in 2018.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on May 20, 2018 14:48:48 GMT
BG I did not create a plan in a pub. Please don't be rude. I wrote to the Chairman about options that clubs bigger the ours were using to fund capital investments. These are options that the AlQs do not wish to pursue, which is entirely their prerogative. I am always interested in Swiss' views as he has a brain, articulates his views well and has no axe to grind. The new owners have raised the bar in terms of professionalism. Their is a rationale behind the approach, but there needs to be a revolution for us to contemplate any longevity in The Championship. More importantly, we are a happy football club in the context of football in 2018. Sorry Vaughan, but I didn't say you came up with a plan in a pub, what I accused you of was 'Pub Talk', and what I meant by that was talking with no serious intention of seeing the plan through. Of course I can't demonstrate that was the case, but without wishing to offend you by sounding 'rude', that's how it looked to me. You fell at the very first hurdle. Unless there was more that you didn't tell us at the time, and given what I was saying to you it may have been timely to have mentioned it then, you had no structure, no team, no money, it sounded like you just had some stuff that you had maybe copied and pasted. What response did you expect to get? Let's just sit back and see how this 'They aren't interested in any outside investment' plays out shall we? I think, as you rightly say, Swiss is one smart cookie and he's given us a big clue.
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vaughan
Joined: June 2014
Posts: 1,237
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Post by vaughan on May 20, 2018 15:02:42 GMT
BG
With hindsight, it probably explains why the courteous and erudite Steve Hamer wrote back to me with
"That's a Dog and Duck of an idea. Please come back when you can show real commitments on funding."
I thought it was a bit abrupt...but now..
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Deleted
Joined: January 1970
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Post by Deleted on May 20, 2018 15:14:23 GMT
Well done for starting this thread KP,you might have got one thing wrong but in general I agree these owners are embarrassing,since that first cringeworthy shirt kiss,still at least the even more cringeworthy interviews have stopped. Swiss upsets some people,thats probably true as some people don't want to hear anything that disturbs their little dream world.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on May 20, 2018 16:06:55 GMT
BG With hindsight, it probably explains why the courteous and erudite Steve Hamer wrote back to me with "That's a Dog and Duck of an idea. Please come back when you can show real commitments on funding." I thought it was a bit abrupt...but now.. Not being funny, but if you didn't come with a real plan in the first place that maybe gave an idea of what was going to follow....... But whatever, who cares. I know what I think I saw, the reaction from the club was consistent with that, you think differently, we certainly aren't going to fall out over it. In your defence, I would say, if the experience of Masters and Seymour-Smith is what they based their opinions of supporter involvement on then I personally don't blame them for giving your proposal a wide berth, but again, you should have seen that coming and had a team assembled that they could have taken seriously before approaching them, in my opinion. As said above, watch this space for either change of ownership or outside investment. Back in the real world, nice outside, isn't it
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Rex
Predictions League
Joined: June 2014
Posts: 3,287
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Post by Rex on May 20, 2018 16:17:55 GMT
For the avoidance of any doubt, my decision to stop posting is purely part of me taking a step back and getting out of the mindset of a "diehard" supporter as parental responsibility kicks in. It's not a permanent thing, not part of any coordinated action and purely a personal and individual decision. When the football starts again I'm sure I'll be back. Astafjevs WYHHB?
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kingswood Polak
Without music life would be a mistake
Joined: May 2014
Posts: 10,278
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Post by kingswood Polak on May 20, 2018 16:32:15 GMT
Heresy! Burn the witch! Some very valid points. Keep posting. Regarding the bit in bold. They have stated that that they are not looking for out-side investment. And at that point - I scratch my head. Unless they are truly happy to write off £2mil a year in perpetuity on a dilapidated stadium and some tents in a crappy bit of north east Bristol. In fairness, what they said they didn't want to discuss was some nebulous 'pub talk' plan which Vaughan was told time after time to go away, put together as a proper structured proposal, with some financial commitment from backers and take back to them. He didn't do that. I’ve actually not seen vaughan post since that period. Are you there mucker and if so drop in a line or two please. I always enjoyed your posts
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vaughan
Joined: June 2014
Posts: 1,237
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Post by vaughan on May 20, 2018 17:22:47 GMT
I have not posted because there has been nothing to moan about.
Young Mr Grace.
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Post by a more piratey game on May 20, 2018 17:22:58 GMT
The hardest part, believe it or not, is that I am not allowed in direct sunlight and that is upsetting me the most. I then ask myself what is the point of living when you are basically tied to your house or, if out, I have to seek shade ? I don't know if this will cheer you up just a little, but..... I have a friend who goes to the Caribbean for a week or so every year. And every year, he lies in the shade reading books all week. Fellow Brits, who are all bathing in the sunshine, look on him as a bit of an oddity until the end of the holiday when, as he says, 'I usually ruin their holiday for them' He says that as the week goes on people start to drop their British reserve, and start talking to each other. They discuss what their jobs are etc, and eventually they get round to including him. When he responds, quite honestly, 'I'm a skin cancer doctor', it tends to take the shine off things pretty sharpish
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