Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Aug 20, 2017 19:33:21 GMT
No, its not complicated. I am asking what your personal experiences have been. You two are simply the best at arguing without the rest of us knowing what about. Ha ha, so true. It's a personal thing😂
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Aug 20, 2017 19:49:09 GMT
I don't even understand the question. Why would I keep company with people I don't share common ground with? Or are you saying that what I'm seeing is just some celebrity game that doesn't exist in real life? If so, you've just defeated your own argument, haven't you? No, its not complicated. I am asking what your personal experiences have been. I've lived under racist EU laws, and heard people scream with rage that my views in wanting people to be allowed here based on merit are racist, does that count?
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Aug 20, 2017 19:50:09 GMT
No, its not complicated. I am asking what your personal experiences have been. You two are simply the best at arguing without the rest of us knowing what about. What makes you think I have any idea what's going on?
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Aug 20, 2017 20:58:37 GMT
So called clever people on here trying to politicise racism. Its nothing to do with left wing or right wing politics is about not discriminating or abusing people because of there colour/race/religion etc. When people rant about a "pc mad society" they are simply repeating what others were saying years ago when it was suggested that maybe throwing bananas on the pitch or making monkey chants wasnt such a great thing?
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kingswood Polak
Without music life would be a mistake
Joined: May 2014
Posts: 10,263
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Post by kingswood Polak on Aug 21, 2017 2:53:38 GMT
How I wish you could have been there and seen the tears of anger in the Indian blokes eyes, when the Lino was getting the racist abuse. Imagine him trying to explain that to his son who was with him. It may well be PC horse crap to you but it wasn't to him and his boy. It was horrible to witness & be around. I've never had a sheep mentality and it's made life difficult for me where I live. It would be so much easier for me to say nothing but you know the old saying that evil succeeds when good people do nothing. I'd rather be unpopular & have the occasional dig on social media that be that person who does nothing I can remember at Eastvile the abuse hurled at many players and was sickening. I just think these initiatives however well meaning just have the opposite effect. Just because an individual doesn't want to wear a 'Let's Kick Racism Out Of Football' badge, doesn't make that person a racist! I didn't say that though and each to their own. I just think some healthy debate wouldn't go amiss but it seems to degenerate into anger and then go south.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Aug 21, 2017 6:21:20 GMT
No, its not complicated. I am asking what your personal experiences have been. I've lived under racist EU laws, and heard people scream with rage that my views in wanting people to be allowed here based on merit are racist, does that count? Not sure. What are the EU racist laws you refer to?
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Post by alloutofgas on Aug 21, 2017 6:25:23 GMT
So called clever people on here trying to politicise racism. Its nothing to do with left wing or right wing politics is about not discriminating or abusing people because of there colour/race/religion etc. When people rant about a "pc mad society" they are simply repeating what others were saying years ago when it was suggested that maybe throwing bananas on the pitch or making monkey chants wasnt such a great thing? You really are a sanctimonious bore aren't you? What utter nonsense. You are comparing outright moronic racism with people having an issue with 'gender fluid' or the Underground in London no longer addressing the travelling public as 'ladies and gentlemen'.
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Post by alloutofgas on Aug 21, 2017 6:30:21 GMT
I can remember at Eastvile the abuse hurled at many players and was sickening. I just think these initiatives however well meaning just have the opposite effect. Just because an individual doesn't want to wear a 'Let's Kick Racism Out Of Football' badge, doesn't make that person a racist! I didn't say that though and each to their own. I just think some healthy debate wouldn't go amiss but it seems to degenerate into anger and then go south. Always up for healthy debate, it tends to drop through the floor after 'racist' is thrown about!
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Aug 21, 2017 6:34:50 GMT
So called clever people on here trying to politicise racism. Its nothing to do with left wing or right wing politics is about not discriminating or abusing people because of there colour/race/religion etc. When people rant about a "pc mad society" they are simply repeating what others were saying years ago when it was suggested that maybe throwing bananas on the pitch or making monkey chants wasnt such a great thing? You really are a sanctimonious bore aren't you? What utter nonsense. You are comparing outright moronic racism with people having an issue with 'gender fluid' or the Underground in London no longer addressing the travelling public as 'ladies and gentlemen'. Not quite and no need for the aggression. There is a tenancy for some to fall into accusations of 'left/right wing" when pointing fingers on this topic, which is lazy. Plus, to get laws onto the statute book which addresses these issues is political, in the round. But for the life of me, I cannot understand why you would get so heated over announcements on a transport system or personal decisions on gender?
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Post by CountyGroundHotel on Aug 21, 2017 7:48:56 GMT
i agree and [ i think] all others on this thread do whats your thoughts on filling quotas in respect of skin colour/cultures at football ? Never heard of quotas. Never heard of affirmative action in football. As for expanding our customer base, totally for it. Well people have been proposing implementing some form of the 'Rooney' regulation in football. Of course that would be positive discrimination which falls under the old saying of 2 wrongs make a right.
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Post by alloutofgas on Aug 21, 2017 7:53:45 GMT
You really are a sanctimonious bore aren't you? What utter nonsense. You are comparing outright moronic racism with people having an issue with 'gender fluid' or the Underground in London no longer addressing the travelling public as 'ladies and gentlemen'. Not quite and no need for the aggression. There is a tenancy for some to fall into accusations of 'left/right wing" when pointing fingers on this topic, which is lazy. Plus, to get laws onto the statute book which addresses these issues is political, in the round. But for the life of me, I cannot understand why you would get so heated over announcements on a transport system or personal decisions on gender? Hi Oldie, it's the underlying implication that if somehow you don't quite buy into the whole pc agenda then by some peoples opinion you are obviously a racist. I was using the Underground as an example of pc.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Aug 21, 2017 8:02:52 GMT
Never heard of quotas. Never heard of affirmative action in football. As for expanding our customer base, totally for it. Well people have been proposing implementing some form of the 'Rooney' regulation in football. Of course that would be positive discrimination which falls under the old saying of 2 wrongs make a right. Really? Never heard of it
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Aug 21, 2017 8:04:32 GMT
Not quite and no need for the aggression. There is a tenancy for some to fall into accusations of 'left/right wing" when pointing fingers on this topic, which is lazy. Plus, to get laws onto the statute book which addresses these issues is political, in the round. But for the life of me, I cannot understand why you would get so heated over announcements on a transport system or personal decisions on gender? Hi Oldie, it's the underlying implication that if somehow you don't quite buy into the whole pc agenda then by some peoples opinion you are obviously a racist. I was using the Underground as an example of pc. Hi there. To be honest I think the whole argument is media hysteria desperately trying to create stories. Most of us don't read it
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Aug 21, 2017 8:56:33 GMT
I've lived under racist EU laws, and heard people scream with rage that my views in wanting people to be allowed here based on merit are racist, does that count? Not sure. What are the EU racist laws you refer to? Had you made it to the end of my single sentence post you would have seen the topic mentioned, free movement and EU employment laws, different for people from countries that are not member states. Protectionist at the expense of our economy, and discriminatory based on nationality (that's racist in modern speak). No, I don't want a debate about the EU referendum, the point is that during the run up to the vote any attempt to discuss this was shouted down on the basis that if you don't think free movement was a good thing you were racist, there, that's an example for you. This type of nonsense, as you say, crying Wolf, isn't helpful.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Aug 21, 2017 9:13:50 GMT
Not sure. What are the EU racist laws you refer to? Had you made it to the end of my single sentence post you would have seen the topic mentioned, free movement and EU employment laws, different for people from countries that are not member states. Protectionist at the expense of our economy, and discriminatory based on nationality (that's racist in modern speak). No, I don't want a debate about the EU referendum, the point is that during the run up to the vote any attempt to discuss this was shouted down on the basis that if you don't think free movement was a good thing you were racist, there, that's an example for you. This type of nonsense, as you say, crying Wolf, isn't helpful. I think you are bringing your own political frustrations into play. However I have some sympathy for your viewpoint as you may recall I do believe that labour should have the same degree of free movement as capital. I believe you ridiculed this viewpoint, but now appear to be advocating it? Where this will lead is of course is to the acceptance of the abuse of labour for profit. Denial of access through statute is part of that process, and the promotion of fear and loathing through the media is what helps maintain acquiescence. What this debate is about is the consequence of that.
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topman
Joined: June 2014
Posts: 187
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Post by topman on Aug 21, 2017 9:41:18 GMT
I cant believe how much space has been taken up since the original post - so I will add to it!!
Probably too old but in terms of increasing our support from a wider population surely it is simple? Anyone living in Bristol will be aware of professional football and if it is something they are interested in they go along and watch either Rovers or City
I have not been aware of any direct abuse of a non white supporter in the games I have attended and if so I would try to do something to stop it - that also applies to our players or the opposition
The problem with some of these areas is the over positive discrimination in favour of 'minority' groups to the extend that it annoys many with too much PC involvement and imo actually works against what people are trying to achieve by a more low key approach
It is also extends to not been able to act where action should be taken but authorities shy away for example Rotherham and Rochdale - even now people have to tip toe around the subject for fear of being called racist
Re the EU I voted out not because of 'foreigners' - I have been lucky enough to have travelled to different parts of the world and have nothing but respect for other countries and their people My vote for out was because we are already an over populated island and you cannot fit two pints into a pint pot (France same population but twice the geographical size for example) AND more importantly I dont want our country to be run by un elected gravy train civil servants who have changed the EU from a free market into a federal state and cant even sign off their own financial accounts
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Aug 21, 2017 10:10:24 GMT
Had you made it to the end of my single sentence post you would have seen the topic mentioned, free movement and EU employment laws, different for people from countries that are not member states. Protectionist at the expense of our economy, and discriminatory based on nationality (that's racist in modern speak). No, I don't want a debate about the EU referendum, the point is that during the run up to the vote any attempt to discuss this was shouted down on the basis that if you don't think free movement was a good thing you were racist, there, that's an example for you. This type of nonsense, as you say, crying Wolf, isn't helpful. I think you are bringing your own political frustrations into play. However I have some sympathy for your viewpoint as you may recall I do believe that labour should have the same degree of free movement as capital. I believe you ridiculed this viewpoint, but now appear to be advocating it? Where this will lead is of course is to the acceptance of the abuse of labour for profit. Denial of access through statute is part of that process, and the promotion of fear and loathing through the media is what helps maintain acquiescence. What this debate is about is the consequence of that. Not intending to introduce any political bias, just a comment, this throwing around of labels is a tactic which I've observed is used by left wing commentators, and in the same way that using expletives becomes the norm, if you accuse everybody who you disagree with of being a racist / homophobe etc then you muddy the waters, that's all. No, I don't think there should be free movement of labour, the host country should be free to decide who, where, when, shouldn't they? Hey, I see your old buddy Minford has surfaced again, this time saying we should take the short term hit and abandon our outdated manufacturing industries. Whatever next, he'll be saying we should stop using 5 year olds as mule scavengers, the brute! He's probably just ageist
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Post by alloutofgas on Aug 21, 2017 10:14:04 GMT
I cant believe how much space has been taken up since the original post - so I will add to it!! Probably too old but in terms of increasing our support from a wider population surely it is simple? Anyone living in Bristol will be aware of professional football and if it is something they are interested in they go along and watch either Rovers or City I have not been aware of any direct abuse of a non white supporter in the games I have attended and if so I would try to do something to stop it - that also applies to our players or the opposition The problem with some of these areas is the over positive discrimination in favour of 'minority' groups to the extend that it annoys many with too much PC involvement and imo actually works against what people are trying to achieve by a more low key approach It is also extends to not been able to act where action should be taken but authorities shy away for example Rotherham and Rochdale - even now people have to tip toe around the subject for fear of being called racist Re the EU I voted out not because of 'foreigners' - I have been lucky enough to have travelled to different parts of the world and have nothing but respect for other countries and their people My vote for out was because we are already an over populated island and you cannot fit two pints into a pint pot (France same population but twice the geographical size for example) AND more importantly I dont want our country to be run by un elected gravy train civil servants who have changed the EU from a free market into a federal state and cant even sign off their own financial accounts [ Typical f**king racist nazi little Englander. Been practicing your goose stepping??? My comment is a joke incidentally, there will be loads on here thinking that. I voted leave for exactly the same reasons as you my friend.
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strung out
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Paul Hardyman
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Post by strung out on Aug 21, 2017 10:14:39 GMT
This thread is veeringly worryingly away from Diversity at the Mem...
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Aug 21, 2017 10:32:49 GMT
This thread is veeringly worryingly away from Diversity at the Mem... Progressing, if you view events at football games as a microcosm of much larger issues
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