|
Post by Curly Wurly on Dec 9, 2020 13:48:01 GMT
Soooo.... Orient and Rovers players took the knee tonight. And were give a standing ovation. Pretty sure the Orient fan base is WWC, so it must be a Millwall thing.
|
|
Deleted
Joined: January 1970
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Dec 9, 2020 14:03:12 GMT
Not the "type" you had in mind (guessing) But a bit lacking in lateral thinking. I remember now, I met him once, years ago at an away game I think. In the bar... most of my meetings have been in the bar🤔🤣 Then I would be amazed if we haven't bumped into each other at some point! I bet we have.
|
|
eppinggas
Administrator
Ian Alexander
Don't care
Joined: June 2014
Posts: 8,173
|
Post by eppinggas on Dec 9, 2020 15:07:25 GMT
I think Millwall have set a great example here of how to move forward. Taking the knee gives racists a chance to boo and disrespect the anti-racism message - because they can claim (rightly or not, doesn't matter) that they are actually protesting against BLM. They can claim (rightly or wrongly, doesn't matter) that BLM is associated with Marxism. So Millwall introduced a unique, and different way of sending out the anti-racism message. And it worked. And the supporters backed it. So stop taking the knee. As Les Ferdinand himself said - the anti-racism message has become diluted. And it has actually divided, not unified supporters. UTG.
|
|
Deleted
Joined: January 1970
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Dec 9, 2020 16:31:54 GMT
Les Ferdinand.
|
|
Deleted
Joined: January 1970
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Dec 9, 2020 17:29:14 GMT
. Kegan. Please think before you hit the send button. Thanks.
|
|
kingswood Polak
Without music life would be a mistake
Joined: May 2014
Posts: 10,263
|
Post by kingswood Polak on Dec 9, 2020 17:37:07 GMT
Stunned at your righteousness. Just bloody wow. You are very welcome SMH in utter disbelief. Nevermind
|
|
Deleted
Joined: January 1970
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Dec 9, 2020 18:29:03 GMT
SMH in utter disbelief. Nevermind Outraged of Tonbridge Wells?
|
|
kingswood Polak
Without music life would be a mistake
Joined: May 2014
Posts: 10,263
|
Post by kingswood Polak on Dec 9, 2020 18:55:15 GMT
SMH in utter disbelief. Nevermind Outraged of Tonbridge Wells? More like tranquilsed sadness. I know it’s a forum so I don’t let anger in. Each has their own view but sometimes I just get a brain zap, when I read certain things. I just let it go.
|
|
Deleted
Joined: January 1970
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Dec 9, 2020 19:55:24 GMT
Outraged of Tonbridge Wells? More like tranquilsed sadness. I know it’s a forum so I don’t let anger in. Each has their own view but sometimes I just get a brain zap, when I read certain things. I just let it go. Quite right. There are things to get angry over, but probably not productive on a footie forum. I might suggest labelling booing racists idiots is not one of them.
|
|
Deleted
Joined: January 1970
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Dec 9, 2020 22:49:58 GMT
Yet in the 1970s and 80s we were all out for our neighbours and equality too? I think not. We're better off now, that was my point. We had the last vestiges of the post war consensus in the 70s, when Labour and Tories (regardless of politics) were both committed to providing a basic standard of living to push society forward for the better. Free market neo-liberalism was also considered a wacky ideology. Then Thatcher arrived, the consensus went out the window and looking after number one became the whole of the law. As a result the political ideology of this country has shifted rightwards massively to the point where the notion of socialism is now the wacky ideology. So I wouldn’t say we are better off because the selfishness of today’s society is going to cause social and economic problems further down the line that are going under the radar at the moment. Young people are being marginalised because the security that a lot of people had in previous years (in terms of jobs for life, housing, final salary pension etc) just isn’t there any more and the wealth isn’t trickling down either to address the incessant rise in housing costs. In fact the state is subsiding cheap labour for business through the minimum wage which is having the effect of just suppressing wages and increasing the 12 billion thst the tax payer gives every to private landlords because people can’t afford housing on low wages. That’s all creating a bubble and in 20 years time that bubble is going to pop and it ain’t gonna be pretty. That’s before you even factor in the problems that Brexit is going to bring. I wouldn’t want to be a young person now if you paid me so no, I don’t think we’ve got it better compared to the opportunities that those in the 80’s had with free university education, right to buy and final salary pensions. It’s also backed up in fact as a google will show you data that indicates that the millennials are the first generation in a long time to have materially less than the generation before.
|
|
|
Post by emperorsuperbus on Dec 9, 2020 23:49:32 GMT
"Booing" seems a bit silly. Same as "booing" your own team when they are playing badly. It's just a bit crass. Me, personally... when I'm back at the Mem and 'if' both teams are required to 'take the knee'. I think I'll just turn my back for 30 seconds. I don't think anyone should be forced to 'take a knee' for a Marxist led organisation (or for that matter, a Fascist led organisation). I hate political extremism. But that's just me. Everyone play nicely. UTG. The f*ckwits and racists seemed to have recently received Facebook medicine degrees, followed in days with virology and epidemiology doctorates from Google, and give the impression they have received all four volumes of Das Kapital in their cornflakes today. I'll wager my pocket-money that the majority of those booing at Millwall, have no evidence that BLM is Marxist-led, and could not define (without Googling) Marxism. I'll start: Very basically ( I can get much, much more Daedalian with regard to Marxism), and over-simplifying Marxism, it usually means analyzing social change through an economic lens, with the assumption that the rich and the poor should become more equal; oh, and plenty of booing footballers who kneel for a couple of seconds before a football match to show support for "black lives" - all very straightforward, really. Old Trot/Marxist here...#UTG I’m not a fan of Marxism. In practice just simplistic blend of capitalism and nationalism for nihilists. Appreciate root is nationalism, and bud capitalism on route to the fruit. But in ignorance of localism the fruit was always to be unattainable in a Kafkaesque way. Care to see “my critique” before commenting on this statement? I’m confident I will convince and entertain you. 🙂
|
|
|
Post by Mrs V Smegma on Dec 10, 2020 1:52:25 GMT
I beg to differ. I've lived in 3 different countries and spent time in about 50. We wouldn't make the top ten for inclusivity amongst those. Little Britain likes to think it is a tolerant country but we are a very divided Nation where 50% of the population has embraced nationalist and isolationist populism. To genuinely ask and be educated, not to be facetious or antagonistic, which countries have you lived in and which would you say are more inclusive than the UK? Mrs V. Well only my opinion, and others who have lived overseas likely will have different experience and views: I lived in Germany for 4 years - light years ahead of us in terms of inclusivity. Merkel sets the tone for them here. They treat asylum seekers much better than we do even though there are often integration issues that need to be resolved I lived in the US for 4 years - I think it depends on where you live as each state varies and some are more inclusive than others. We lived in northern Virginia just outside the beltway. Much more inclusive than here and very cosmopolitan. A good illustration of this is when my eldest boy's school ran an international evening where people from each nation at the school brought food and items of their culture in. Fantastic evening, with 64 different nations represented. His school here in Bristol would have struggled to get above 3. Priceless seeing Kazakhs, Ukrainians, Peruvians, Koreans, Vietnamese tucking into home made cornish pasties and Chicken Ham and Leek pie. Other states can live up to the stereotypes of backwater USA. The more tolerant ones tend to be Democrat states rather than republican, so the way people are behaving in response to Trump's election defeat is no surprise to me. Of Countries I have spent less time in, and that I would consider to be more inclusive than us I would include Canada, Australia, Belgium, Spain, Portugal, Italy, Switzerland, Ireland, Sweden, Ecuador, Peru, Bolivia, Uruguay, Korea, Japan, Greece, Austria, Czech Republic and Slovakia in that category. It's a huge generalisation though, and as I say based on my experience.
|
|
|
Post by mangogas15 on Dec 10, 2020 8:29:26 GMT
To genuinely ask and be educated, not to be facetious or antagonistic, which countries have you lived in and which would you say are more inclusive than the UK? Mrs V. Well only my opinion, and others who have lived overseas likely will have different experience and views: I lived in Germany for 4 years - light years ahead of us in terms of inclusivity. Merkel sets the tone for them here. They treat asylum seekers much better than we do even though there are often integration issues that need to be resolved I lived in the US for 4 years - I think it depends on where you live as each state varies and some are more inclusive than others. We lived in northern Virginia just outside the beltway. Much more inclusive than here and very cosmopolitan. A good illustration of this is when my eldest boy's school ran an international evening where people from each nation at the school brought food and items of their culture in. Fantastic evening, with 64 different nations represented. His school here in Bristol would have struggled to get above 3. Priceless seeing Kazakhs, Ukrainians, Peruvians, Koreans, Vietnamese tucking into home made cornish pasties and Chicken Ham and Leek pie. Other states can live up to the stereotypes of backwater USA. The more tolerant ones tend to be Democrat states rather than republican, so the way people are behaving in response to Trump's election defeat is no surprise to me. Of Countries I have spent less time in, and that I would consider to be more inclusive than us I would include Canada, Australia, Belgium, Spain, Portugal, Italy, Switzerland, Ireland, Sweden, Ecuador, Peru, Bolivia, Uruguay, Korea, Japan, Greece, Austria, Czech Republic and Slovakia in that category. It's a huge generalisation though, and as I say based on my experience. Wonderful, a real eye opener, thank you. Again, as you say, I think there are different parts of the UK like US that are more tolerant than others, add to that different parts of Bristol, etc etc. Opinions can only be backed up by your level of experience so I value yours on this subject more than most. I love that about the food, let me know when the next night is, I will bring some Welsh Cakes 🙂
|
|
eppinggas
Administrator
Ian Alexander
Don't care
Joined: June 2014
Posts: 8,173
|
Post by eppinggas on Dec 10, 2020 16:58:17 GMT
To genuinely ask and be educated, not to be facetious or antagonistic, which countries have you lived in and which would you say are more inclusive than the UK? Mrs V. Well only my opinion, and others who have lived overseas likely will have different experience and views: I lived in Germany for 4 years - light years ahead of us in terms of inclusivity. Merkel sets the tone for them here. They treat asylum seekers much better than we do even though there are often integration issues that need to be resolved I lived in the US for 4 years - I think it depends on where you live as each state varies and some are more inclusive than others. We lived in northern Virginia just outside the beltway. Much more inclusive than here and very cosmopolitan. A good illustration of this is when my eldest boy's school ran an international evening where people from each nation at the school brought food and items of their culture in. Fantastic evening, with 64 different nations represented. His school here in Bristol would have struggled to get above 3. Priceless seeing Kazakhs, Ukrainians, Peruvians, Koreans, Vietnamese tucking into home made cornish pasties and Chicken Ham and Leek pie. Other states can live up to the stereotypes of backwater USA. The more tolerant ones tend to be Democrat states rather than republican, so the way people are behaving in response to Trump's election defeat is no surprise to me. Of Countries I have spent less time in, and that I would consider to be more inclusive than us I would include Canada, Australia, Belgium, Spain, Portugal, Italy, Switzerland, Ireland, Sweden, Ecuador, Peru, Bolivia, Uruguay, Korea, Japan, Greece, Austria, Czech Republic and Slovakia in that category. It's a huge generalisation though, and as I say based on my experience. I'm obviously not as well travelled as you... But in defence of the UK we seem to do pretty well for inclusivity according to belonging.berkeley.edu/inclusivenessindexShame it's not a bit more granular, and I would concede that we are not as inclusive as the Scandinavian countries. I'd be interested if there are any other trustworthy sites to compare. Lies, damned lies and statistics...
|
|
|
Post by Mrs V Smegma on Dec 10, 2020 21:59:49 GMT
Well only my opinion, and others who have lived overseas likely will have different experience and views: I lived in Germany for 4 years - light years ahead of us in terms of inclusivity. Merkel sets the tone for them here. They treat asylum seekers much better than we do even though there are often integration issues that need to be resolved I lived in the US for 4 years - I think it depends on where you live as each state varies and some are more inclusive than others. We lived in northern Virginia just outside the beltway. Much more inclusive than here and very cosmopolitan. A good illustration of this is when my eldest boy's school ran an international evening where people from each nation at the school brought food and items of their culture in. Fantastic evening, with 64 different nations represented. His school here in Bristol would have struggled to get above 3. Priceless seeing Kazakhs, Ukrainians, Peruvians, Koreans, Vietnamese tucking into home made cornish pasties and Chicken Ham and Leek pie. Other states can live up to the stereotypes of backwater USA. The more tolerant ones tend to be Democrat states rather than republican, so the way people are behaving in response to Trump's election defeat is no surprise to me. Of Countries I have spent less time in, and that I would consider to be more inclusive than us I would include Canada, Australia, Belgium, Spain, Portugal, Italy, Switzerland, Ireland, Sweden, Ecuador, Peru, Bolivia, Uruguay, Korea, Japan, Greece, Austria, Czech Republic and Slovakia in that category. It's a huge generalisation though, and as I say based on my experience. Wonderful, a real eye opener, thank you. Again, as you say, I think there are different parts of the UK like US that are more tolerant than others, add to that different parts of Bristol, etc etc. Opinions can only be backed up by your level of experience so I value yours on this subject more than most. I love that about the food, let me know when the next night is, I will bring some Welsh Cakes 🙂 Welsh cakes would have been wonderful, as would a steaming hot bowl of cawl. I get really annoyed when I hear people say that British food is crap. how anyone could dislike welsh cakes is beyond me - unless they dislike dried fruit, in which case substitute with chocolate chips (I know not traditional, but also delicious). Someone else on the Brit table brought home made scones in which also went down well - sadly no clotted cream as we couldn't get that in VA. Inclusivity is a difficult thing to measure I think. It is an abstract concept rather than something more tangible, and you will feel it if it is there, and also if it is absent. I don't attach any store to indices that attempt to measure it. For me it is about being free to be who you are without having to conform to cultural norms (without causing intentional harm to others). All too often in the UK I hear things like "they should speak English over here" or " they should behave in this way in this country" which leads me to conclude that Britain being an inclusive nation is as much of a myth as British "exceptionalism". I passionately despise the rampant populism/nationalism that is sweeping through much of the western world at present. It is isolationist rather than inclusive in nature and is IMHO is responsible for many of the ills and the hatred in the world. Much better to be open and try to see the world through other people's eyes than build barriers in my opinion, and the funny thing is, by being inclusive towards others, my experience has been that it gets reciprocated. Maybe it is why I've been so lucky to experience inclusivity in so many different nations. Favourite tactic of the populists - divide and conquer to deliberately pit people against each other, usually by generating envy that one group gets something that another doesn't. A surprisingly wise person (Jimmy Carr) came out with a really simple saying that I think is profound, and which I try to keep at the front of my mind - "Comparison is the thief of joy". WM Gas' analogy that Brits would rather have a fiver if no-one else got one than everyone gets a tenner resonates with me. Whilst I know bad things do happen in other countries there have been some incidents in the UK that leave me really ashamed to be British. These include the two lesbians beaten up on a bus in London, the French boy kicked to a pulp on the downs and the black rapper who thugs drove a car into whilst he was sat on a wall in Southmead. These sort of incidents really make me think we are not an inclusive nation. Shamefully I missed Chile off my inclusive Nations list. My experience there was of really wonderful people who were so proud of their country that they were determined that you would have the best time possible. All the Chileans I have met in my life have been exceptionally nice people.
|
|
|
Post by Mrs V Smegma on Dec 11, 2020 0:19:22 GMT
I'm obviously not as well travelled as you... But in defence of the UK we seem to do pretty well for inclusivity according to belonging.berkeley.edu/inclusivenessindexShame it's not a bit more granular, and I would concede that we are not as inclusive as the Scandinavian countries. I'd be interested if there are any other trustworthy sites to compare. Lies, damned lies and statistics... Interesting report there Epping, which does seem to align with my experience in the US, and not as closely with my experience of the rest of the world. Some of the countries I spent time in quite some time ago so things may well be different now to when I was there. The bit on political backsliding particularly struck a chord with me. The report identifies a huge amount of gerrymandering to return election results in complete disproportion to the recorded vote. The irony that this happened under the orange w**kpuffin's administration does not escape me and looks like much stronger evidence of a stolen election than anything he and his acolytes have produced for this election. lucky our electoral system can't be rigged in that way isn't it?
|
|
|
Post by mangogas15 on Dec 11, 2020 7:55:50 GMT
Wonderful, a real eye opener, thank you. Again, as you say, I think there are different parts of the UK like US that are more tolerant than others, add to that different parts of Bristol, etc etc. Opinions can only be backed up by your level of experience so I value yours on this subject more than most. I love that about the food, let me know when the next night is, I will bring some Welsh Cakes 🙂 Welsh cakes would have been wonderful, as would a steaming hot bowl of cawl. I get really annoyed when I hear people say that British food is crap. how anyone could dislike welsh cakes is beyond me - unless they dislike dried fruit, in which case substitute with chocolate chips (I know not traditional, but also delicious). Someone else on the Brit table brought home made scones in which also went down well - sadly no clotted cream as we couldn't get that in VA. Inclusivity is a difficult thing to measure I think. It is an abstract concept rather than something more tangible, and you will feel it if it is there, and also if it is absent. I don't attach any store to indices that attempt to measure it. For me it is about being free to be who you are without having to conform to cultural norms (without causing intentional harm to others). All too often in the UK I hear things like "they should speak English over here" or " they should behave in this way in this country" which leads me to conclude that Britain being an inclusive nation is as much of a myth as British "exceptionalism". I passionately despise the rampant populism/nationalism that is sweeping through much of the western world at present. It is isolationist rather than inclusive in nature and is IMHO is responsible for many of the ills and the hatred in the world. Much better to be open and try to see the world through other people's eyes than build barriers in my opinion, and the funny thing is, by being inclusive towards others, my experience has been that it gets reciprocated. Maybe it is why I've been so lucky to experience inclusivity in so many different nations. Favourite tactic of the populists - divide and conquer to deliberately pit people against each other, usually by generating envy that one group gets something that another doesn't. A surprisingly wise person (Jimmy Carr) came out with a really simple saying that I think is profound, and which I try to keep at the front of my mind - "Comparison is the thief of joy". WM Gas' analogy that Brits would rather have a fiver if no-one else got one than everyone gets a tenner resonates with me. Whilst I know bad things do happen in other countries there have been some incidents in the UK that leave me really ashamed to be British. These include the two lesbians beaten up on a bus in London, the French boy kicked to a pulp on the downs and the black rapper who thugs drove a car into whilst he was sat on a wall in Southmead. These sort of incidents really make me think we are not an inclusive nation. Shamefully I missed Chile off my inclusive Nations list. My experience there was of really wonderful people who were so proud of their country that they were determined that you would have the best time possible. All the Chileans I have met in my life have been exceptionally nice people. I was brought up visiting my Aunty Vi in Cathays in Cardiff who made Welsh cakes and they just had sultanas in them but covered in sugar rather than flour (typical 1970s). There's loads of lovely traditions in British food that we should always be proud of. I hate going abroad and seeing people not bother to try to speak the local language. It's no wonder some French people are rude when you just rock up and speak English. I have a Polish mate who said it is the same there. When I got the job as manager of Swinton in Kingswood a few years ago, I recognised there was a large Polish community down the road, having previously seen the same in Avonmouth for the previous 8 years. I looked into getting our leaflets translated into Polish for the local community to generate business, the powers that be didn't go for it, but I did learn the word for Thank You which went down really well and made people smile at least.
|
|
eppinggas
Administrator
Ian Alexander
Don't care
Joined: June 2014
Posts: 8,173
|
Post by eppinggas on Dec 11, 2020 9:40:30 GMT
I'm obviously not as well travelled as you... But in defence of the UK we seem to do pretty well for inclusivity according to belonging.berkeley.edu/inclusivenessindexShame it's not a bit more granular, and I would concede that we are not as inclusive as the Scandinavian countries. I'd be interested if there are any other trustworthy sites to compare. Lies, damned lies and statistics... Interesting report there Epping, which does seem to align with my experience in the US, and not as closely with my experience of the rest of the world. Some of the countries I spent time in quite some time ago so things may well be different now to when I was there. The bit on political backsliding particularly struck a chord with me. The report identifies a huge amount of gerrymandering to return election results in complete disproportion to the recorded vote. The irony that this happened under the orange w***puffin's administration does not escape me and looks like much stronger evidence of a stolen election than anything he and his acolytes have produced for this election. lucky our electoral system can't be rigged in that way isn't it? Here's another report...https://www.ipsos.com/sites/default/files/ct/news/documents/2018-06/the-inclusiveness-of-nationalities-ipsos-global-advisor.pdf (page 5 for the rankings). I'm a bit surprised at Australia being 'top 5'. Then again am I pray to the oft-quoted - but apparently incorrect perception that - "Australia is an inherently racist right-wing country"? The USA (as we know) will have big disparities between states. We do better than Germany, but oddly, not as well as France. Weird. My conclusion would be that people perceive the UK as "not being very inclusive" - when in fact the data (yes, I know only 2 reports I've found) points to us doing pretty well. I am in the incredibly unfashionable "proud to be British" camp. I do not read the Daily Mail. UTG.
|
|
Rex
Predictions League
Joined: June 2014
Posts: 3,287
|
Post by Rex on Dec 11, 2020 11:11:07 GMT
Wonderful, a real eye opener, thank you. Again, as you say, I think there are different parts of the UK like US that are more tolerant than others, add to that different parts of Bristol, etc etc. Opinions can only be backed up by your level of experience so I value yours on this subject more than most. I love that about the food, let me know when the next night is, I will bring some Welsh Cakes 🙂 Welsh cakes would have been wonderful, as would a steaming hot bowl of cawl. I get really annoyed when I hear people say that British food is crap. how anyone could dislike welsh cakes is beyond me - unless they dislike dried fruit, in which case substitute with chocolate chips (I know not traditional, but also delicious). Someone else on the Brit table brought home made scones in which also went down well - sadly no clotted cream as we couldn't get that in VA. Inclusivity is a difficult thing to measure I think. It is an abstract concept rather than something more tangible, and you will feel it if it is there, and also if it is absent. I don't attach any store to indices that attempt to measure it. For me it is about being free to be who you are without having to conform to cultural norms (without causing intentional harm to others). All too often in the UK I hear things like "they should speak English over here" or " they should behave in this way in this country" which leads me to conclude that Britain being an inclusive nation is as much of a myth as British "exceptionalism". I passionately despise the rampant populism/nationalism that is sweeping through much of the western world at present. It is isolationist rather than inclusive in nature and is IMHO is responsible for many of the ills and the hatred in the world. Much better to be open and try to see the world through other people's eyes than build barriers in my opinion, and the funny thing is, by being inclusive towards others, my experience has been that it gets reciprocated. Maybe it is why I've been so lucky to experience inclusivity in so many different nations. Favourite tactic of the populists - divide and conquer to deliberately pit people against each other, usually by generating envy that one group gets something that another doesn't. A surprisingly wise person (Jimmy Carr) came out with a really simple saying that I think is profound, and which I try to keep at the front of my mind - "Comparison is the thief of joy". WM Gas' analogy that Brits would rather have a fiver if no-one else got one than everyone gets a tenner resonates with me. Whilst I know bad things do happen in other countries there have been some incidents in the UK that leave me really ashamed to be British. These include the two lesbians beaten up on a bus in London, the French boy kicked to a pulp on the downs and the black rapper who thugs drove a car into whilst he was sat on a wall in Southmead. These sort of incidents really make me think we are not an inclusive nation. Shamefully I missed Chile off my inclusive Nations list. My experience there was of really wonderful people who were so proud of their country that they were determined that you would have the best time possible. All the Chileans I have met in my life have been exceptionally nice people.That Pinochet bloke was a bit of a wrong 'un mind! Chile is a place I would love to visit, my dad lived there just after the war, he was in the merchant navy and if you fell ill on ship they just got you ashore and you had to wait for your ship to dock in that port again, which was around 18 months in his case! He ended up living with a Chilean family and family rumour has it that there me and my sisters may have another sibling! We will never know if that is true or not , but the fact that a family took in a British sailor, who spoke no Spanish, just to help him out speaks volumes. It's great to read posts such as yours, viewed through social media, I find it increasingly depressing that the UK is seemingly populated by Little Englanders, most of whom are on my friends list!
|
|
Rex
Predictions League
Joined: June 2014
Posts: 3,287
|
Post by Rex on Dec 11, 2020 11:28:10 GMT
Yet in the 1970s and 80s we were all out for our neighbours and equality too? I think not. We're better off now, that was my point. We had the last vestiges of the post war consensus in the 70s, when Labour and Tories (regardless of politics) were both committed to providing a basic standard of living to push society forward for the better. Free market neo-liberalism was also considered a wacky ideology. Then Thatcher arrived, the consensus went out the window and looking after number one became the whole of the law. As a result the political ideology of this country has shifted rightwards massively to the point where the notion of socialism is now the wacky ideology. So I wouldn’t say we are better off because the selfishness of today’s society is going to cause social and economic problems further down the line that are going under the radar at the moment. Young people are being marginalised because the security that a lot of people had in previous years (in terms of jobs for life, housing, final salary pension etc) just isn’t there any more and the wealth isn’t trickling down either to address the incessant rise in housing costs. In fact the state is subsiding cheap labour for business through the minimum wage which is having the effect of just suppressing wages and increasing the 12 billion thst the tax payer gives every to private landlords because people can’t afford housing on low wages. That’s all creating a bubble and in 20 years time that bubble is going to pop and it ain’t gonna be pretty. That’s before you even factor in the problems that Brexit is going to bring. I wouldn’t want to be a young person now if you paid me so no, I don’t think we’ve got it better compared to the opportunities that those in the 80’s had with free university education, right to buy and final salary pensions. It’s also backed up in fact as a google will show you data that indicates that the millennials are the first generation in a long time to have materially less than the generation before. I always thought Thatcher was the worst PM of our time, somehow the current incumbent has manged to make me have a rethink and I find myself sticking up for her on the odd occasion! I now understand why some people think so highly of her, and I would also say she implemented policies because she thought it was the right thing to do and not for personal gain (Boris fans take note) . What she did was enable many working class families to 'move up' and for that , those families and their children are understandably thankful for it. However, while many will think that will be her legacy, I still believe it came at too high a price and the worst is yet to come, particularly when it comes to housing. Maybe I'm imagining it, I would love to see the figures, but I'm pretty damn sure that when I was growing up (I was born in 1964) homelessness wasn't even really a thing, there was the odd tramp, but- and I accept this may be a rose tinted memory- they seemed few and far between and tended to be slightly eccentric characters who had opted out - as I say, I could be hopelessly wrong on that point. I would argue that homelessness is now a very real threat to 'ordinary' members of society who find themselves in debt (for a whole bunch of reasons)
|
|