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Post by swissgas on Sept 30, 2020 23:12:17 GMT
Swiss. The person making those commercial decisions is now on the BoD. What can possibly go wrong. I despair, honestly. But this feeds in to the point made about characters and personalities. Gorringe / Garner, peas in a pod. I haven’t been Martyn Starnes biggest fan but he is undoubtedly a “football man” and I don’t envy him for the very difficult situation he is in at the moment.
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basel
Joined: May 2014
Posts: 3,064
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Post by basel on Oct 1, 2020 5:06:48 GMT
Interesting theory Vertigo. It perhaps backs up my own theory,that a promotion challenge was sacrificed by El Presidente Wael,for his - and those that backed him- ,'passing game' revolution.A massive mistake.The timing could not of been worse and the new Manager turned out to be a flop.A sorry episode in the Rovers story.Right up there with our other disasters.I think it the most stupid thing this club has probably ever done. Mark Robin's eg is a football manager and therefore he would of been better than BG. “The most stupid thing this club has ever done”. Absolutely spot on. It looked like a total car crash when my mate gave me the news but even I never imagined he would have won only two games AND still been in a job almost a year later. Looking back it’s almost unfathomable how someone with no managerial experience was given the reigns of a side ticking over nicely in the 3rd tier. It’s possibly the most Bristol Rovers thing Bristol Rovers have ever done. Wael either didn’t want promotion or bottled it. In my lifetime supporting Rovers we’ve only ever been serious promotion candidates from this division in the mid to late 90’s that’s how rare these opportunities crop up. And it was pissed away. And true to form this season already seems a write off so the wait to see Rovers in the 2nd tier in my lifetime goes on and will likely go on for a long while yet. Rank amateur stuff from a club that just can’t shake off how tin pot it is. It's so bad as to be hard to believe WMGas. Rovers. I remember being the only protester at the time,at least on the forum..... PT and Lennie.Effectively a partnership and one that worked. So, let's get rid of Lennie! Why? Uhh,we have to see if PT can do it on his own! Why? A stupid and unnecessary experiment. As dumb as eg breaking up Warboys and Bannister,to find out if one could do it alone.
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Rex
Predictions League
Joined: June 2014
Posts: 3,287
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Post by Rex on Oct 1, 2020 5:46:56 GMT
Swiss. The person making those commercial decisions is now on the BoD. What can possibly go wrong. I despair, honestly. But this feeds in to the point made about characters and personalities. Gorringe / Garner, peas in a pod. I have this horrible vision of a day when they have both got to the top of the slippery role and considered a success story, an interviewer gently questions them 'Of course, everyone makes mistakes along the way, you both started at a club some of our older viewers may remember, Bristol Rovers, whatever happened to them?'
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Post by mangogas15 on Oct 1, 2020 8:13:43 GMT
Swiss. The person making those commercial decisions is now on the BoD. What can possibly go wrong. I despair, honestly. But this feeds in to the point made about characters and personalities. Gorringe / Garner, peas in a pod. I have this horrible vision of a day when they have both got to the top of the slippery role and considered a success story, an interviewer gently questions them 'Of course, everyone makes mistakes along the way, you both started at a club some of our older viewers may remember, Bristol Rovers, whatever happened to them?' No it will be an interview Steven Gerrard (why do you think he turned down City), 'how do you feel about winning the Champions League with Rovers it all seemed to start with the sacking of Ben Garner didn't it?'
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Deleted
Joined: January 1970
Posts: 0
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Post by Deleted on Oct 1, 2020 8:14:44 GMT
Okay, I would like to know your concerns regarding 'construction of the buildings at Almondsbury', and what is 'Coombe Dingle Sports Complex'? The construction of the club house, gymnasium and associated infrastructure will take a very large amount of cash. But on the face of it the end result will be an inferior training facility to that we have now at the Coombe Dingle Sports Complex. And the annual cost of running the Almondsbury Training Centre will be at least double what was paid in rent at Cribbs and probably a lot more than we would pay at Coombe Dingle for superior indoor, outdoor and all weather facilities. I think that cash, which may be in excess of a million, would be better spent on a making sure the business can pay its way and in restructuring to ensure we have a competitive football team. It’s probably too late now but I would still make the calls. Please be gentle with Mr Unpopular ! Why stop there, Why not start using Eastville Park, I mean , it was OK in the 60's and 70s. So although you don't say directly you are advocating major downsizing Swiss. You previously even suggested selling the Mem and arrange a ground share. (somehow with a straight face?) You want to replicate another era, days gone by. In fact, light years away. There is a danger some people might think you are actually being serious and be taken in by all this, that's the trouble with the internet.
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Deleted
Joined: January 1970
Posts: 0
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Post by Deleted on Oct 1, 2020 8:23:50 GMT
The construction of the club house, gymnasium and associated infrastructure will take a very large amount of cash. But on the face of it the end result will be an inferior training facility to that we have now at the Coombe Dingle Sports Complex. And the annual cost of running the Almondsbury Training Centre will be at least double what was paid in rent at Cribbs and probably a lot more than we would pay at Coombe Dingle for superior indoor, outdoor and all weather facilities. I think that cash, which may be in excess of a million, would be better spent on a making sure the business can pay its way and in restructuring to ensure we have a competitive football team. It’s probably too late now but I would still make the calls. Please be gentle with Mr Unpopular ! Why stop there, Why not start using Eastville Park, I mean , it was OK in the 60's and 70s. So although you don't say directly you are advocating major downsizing Swiss. You previously even suggested selling the Mem and arrange a ground share. (somehow with a straight face?) You want to replicate another era, days gone by. In fact, light years away. There is a danger some people might think you are actually being serious and be taken in by all this, that's the trouble with the internet. Maybe I didn't understand what Swiss wrote, but I thought he was questioning whether we could be spending money to produce facilities inferior to those presently available to us?
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Deleted
Joined: January 1970
Posts: 0
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Post by Deleted on Oct 1, 2020 8:30:52 GMT
Swiss. The person making those commercial decisions is now on the BoD. What can possibly go wrong. I despair, honestly. But this feeds in to the point made about characters and personalities. Gorringe / Garner, peas in a pod. I have this horrible vision of a day when they have both got to the top of the slippery role and considered a success story, an interviewer gently questions them 'Of course, everyone makes mistakes along the way, you both started at a club some of our older viewers may remember, Bristol Rovers, whatever happened to them?' Don't know about Gorringe, he may be competent, but it looks like he's trying to do more than 1 job, hence the endless mistakes. As for Garner, the results say all you need to know. So I don't doubt for a second that Wael will be planning his elevation to CEO, President, Master of the Universe or some other title, fully deserved of course.
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Post by a more piratey game on Oct 1, 2020 8:45:03 GMT
Swiss. The person making those commercial decisions is now on the BoD. What can possibly go wrong. I despair, honestly. But this feeds in to the point made about characters and personalities. Gorringe / Garner, peas in a pod. I haven’t been Martyn Starnes biggest fan but he is undoubtedly a “football man” and I don’t envy him for the very difficult situation he is in at the moment. can you elaborate swiss - it seems to me that he's in a good spot.... now got the freedom to do his job gets on with his boss and his colleagues got plenty of interesting stuff to be getting on with between the training ground/Covid/BRFC London/general upgrades all round got much more job security than his peers at other clubs sounds good, dunnit?
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Post by a more piratey game on Oct 1, 2020 8:50:11 GMT
Okay, I would like to know your concerns regarding 'construction of the buildings at Almondsbury', and what is 'Coombe Dingle Sports Complex'? The construction of the club house, gymnasium and associated infrastructure will take a very large amount of cash. But on the face of it the end result will be an inferior training facility to that we have now at the Coombe Dingle Sports Complex. And the annual cost of running the Almondsbury Training Centre will be at least double what was paid in rent at Cribbs and probably a lot more than we would pay at Coombe Dingle for superior indoor, outdoor and all weather facilities. I think that cash, which may be in excess of a million, would be better spent on a making sure the business can pay its way and in restructuring to ensure we have a competitive football team. It’s probably too late now but I would still make the calls. Please be gentle with Mr Unpopular ! Good morning Mr Interesting-if-currently-Unpopular! All successful clubs own their own training ground, ergo we want to own ours The pitches won't be inferior to what we have at present, which is key (according to those who know about football), all will be relatively poo-free It will be developed over time to be better It will provide a base for a proper club - a sense of belonging And the annual cost of running it will be defrayed by income streams attached to the site which will be developed by Mr Gorringe-rhymes-with-Orange And we've had time to look before we leapt. Before you know it, we'll both look like a Championship club and be a Championship club! Maybe
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Deleted
Joined: January 1970
Posts: 0
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Post by Deleted on Oct 1, 2020 9:12:03 GMT
The construction of the club house, gymnasium and associated infrastructure will take a very large amount of cash. But on the face of it the end result will be an inferior training facility to that we have now at the Coombe Dingle Sports Complex. And the annual cost of running the Almondsbury Training Centre will be at least double what was paid in rent at Cribbs and probably a lot more than we would pay at Coombe Dingle for superior indoor, outdoor and all weather facilities. I think that cash, which may be in excess of a million, would be better spent on a making sure the business can pay its way and in restructuring to ensure we have a competitive football team. It’s probably too late now but I would still make the calls. Please be gentle with Mr Unpopular ! Good morning Mr Interesting-if-currently-Unpopular! All successful clubs own their own training ground, ergo we want to own ours The pitches won't be inferior to what we have at present, which is key (according to those who know about football), all will be relatively poo-free It will be developed over time to be better It will provide a base for a proper club - a sense of belonging And the annual cost of running it will be defrayed by income streams attached to the site which will be developed by Mr Gorringe-rhymes-with-Orange And we've had time to look before we leapt. Before you know it, we'll both look like a Championship club and be a Championship club! Maybe Hope you are right about the income, but Wael and Gorringe between them don't have a great track record on this. Higgs was losing circa £1m PA, that's broadly trebled since the arrival of our Dynamic Duo. But there's good news, we are turning over more money to achieve this. Fingers crossed, eh? I had no idea that Almondsbury was fox free. Good to hear.
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eppinggas
Administrator
Ian Alexander
Don't care
Joined: June 2014
Posts: 8,161
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Post by eppinggas on Oct 1, 2020 9:27:50 GMT
I have this horrible vision of a day when they have both got to the top of the slippery role and considered a success story, an interviewer gently questions them 'Of course, everyone makes mistakes along the way, you both started at a club some of our older viewers may remember, Bristol Rovers, whatever happened to them?' Don't know about Gorringe, he may be competent, but it looks like he's trying to do more than 1 job, hence the endless mistakes. As for Garner, the results say all you need to know. So I don't doubt for a second that Wael will be planning his elevation to CEO, President, Master of the Universe or some other title, fully deserved of course.You seem to have softened your stance on Tom Gorringe... FWIW I think he's done a very good job in challenging times. Wael made a good appointment in this instance. Ben Garner. I wanted to give him at least 6 league games this season. Sadly 3 games in (against tough opposition admittedly), he looks as out of his depth as he did against Southend under 21's. Northampton now looks like a very Big Game for Ben Garner.
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Deleted
Joined: January 1970
Posts: 0
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Post by Deleted on Oct 1, 2020 9:57:20 GMT
Don't know about Gorringe, he may be competent, but it looks like he's trying to do more than 1 job, hence the endless mistakes. As for Garner, the results say all you need to know. So I don't doubt for a second that Wael will be planning his elevation to CEO, President, Master of the Universe or some other title, fully deserved of course.You seem to have softened your stance on Tom Gorringe... FWIW I think he's done a very good job in challenging times. Wael made a good appointment in this instance. Ben Garner. I wanted to give him at least 6 league games this season. Sadly 3 games in (against tough opposition admittedly), he looks as out of his depth as he did against Southend under 21's. Northampton now looks like a very Big Game for Ben Garner. Not at all, have always said the same thing about Gorringe. Have highlighted the total farce of some of the projects he's headed up, with Mintbet being his Tour de Force, but have always also said that it's been unclear exactly what his role is. Is he doing retail, commercial, PR, construction, infrastructure development, probably other stuff as well. You can't spread yourself too thinly or everything suffers. Now he's a Director as well. No, times weren't challenging when he arrived, there was huge goodwill from the customer base towards the club.
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Deleted
Joined: January 1970
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Post by Deleted on Oct 1, 2020 13:46:07 GMT
No, times weren't challenging when he arrived, Absolutely. Clearly they were not challenging at all. In fact, everything was spot on commercially: -Massive shirt sponsorship via the annual Lucky Dip -Wonderful club shop, people used to queue to get in and out! -On line shop was a wonderful experience -the Stadium manager was doing the commercial role, how visionary - what a great way to develop the brand -The bars were the most up to date and welcoming place you could have a drink anywhere. People couldn't wait to go in for a pint Looking at the above I am amazed why we ever needed to employ Mr Gorringe, clearly everything was brilliant and everything since has been a downgrade. I reckon Bamber and Swiss are the same person
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Post by rowdenhill on Oct 1, 2020 14:24:50 GMT
Good old Contraception. Let's have some more. Pile it on mate!
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Post by a more piratey game on Oct 1, 2020 14:36:11 GMT
I think this is probably what is happening TBH, ie external investment being sought for new stadium. But Swiss, that is long term isnt it. Something could be announced now but would be 2-3 years away minimum. So what would be your strategy in the short - medium term? You also suggest what the club is doing is 'what every club does'. I would suggest that is not the case. Plenty of clubs look for experienced players, and don't focus on potential re-sale value (even if the chances at our level of that are not high) and plenty of clubs have lost decent players on a free on contract expiry. We have had plenty of occasions with a lot of contracts expiring at the same time. That can be flawed and can require regular re building. We also know we lost Lockyer, Taylor and Bodin for peanuts, so need to recognisee the plan to maximise contract value is an improvement. Plenty of clubs do not invest in an academy, some at our level don't even have an academy. We are making a go of it. Certainly when it comes to maximising income Rovers don't have a great track record. Christ, Boycey use to undertake the commercial role himself, cant recall us having an experienced or dynamic marketing approach until now. Ian Holtby used to do it, and he was Stadium manager. He did his best, but he had huge constraints and we ended up with a lucky dip shirt sponsor. We did not make use of our brand or the quarters, the Pirates brand, Heritage, whatever. We were always missing a trick as we didn't invest. So the constant knocking of Wael is flawed, recognise the challenges by all means but also acknowledge the progress made of moving away from being run like corner shop which we have been for decades. That brought cosy arrangements with the likes of the Supporters Club and Presidents Club but it is history and had to be done to progress into the real world. The Training Ground is a massive step forward. I'm sure you will challenge 'who owns it'. But it doesn't matter - Who owns Ashton Gate and their new training Ground? Is it 'Bristol City FC', 'Ashton Gate Holdings' or whatever?? It doesn't matter. I ask again what would your short term/medium strategy be as your post could be interpreted as "find someone who will give us more money" My short term strategy would start tomorrow by getting in touch with a few advisory firms such as Deloitte and BDO... Depending on the outcome of this exercise then choose the advisory firm to go forward with, committing a large sum of money for their work, and after say a six month period end up with a comprehensive business plan which, together with their help, can be marketed to potential investors worldwide. I think the last thing I'd say about Wael is that he has been unwilling to engage consultants
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eppinggas
Administrator
Ian Alexander
Don't care
Joined: June 2014
Posts: 8,161
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Post by eppinggas on Oct 1, 2020 14:59:16 GMT
No, times weren't challenging when he arrived, Absolutely. Clearly they were not challenging at all. In fact, everything was spot on commercially: -Massive shirt sponsorship via the annual Lucky Dip -Wonderful club shop, people used to queue to get in and out! -On line shop was a wonderful experience -the Stadium manager was doing the commercial role, how visionary - what a great way to develop the brand -The bars were the most up to date and welcoming place you could have a drink anywhere. People couldn't wait to go in for a pint Looking at the above I am amazed why we ever needed to employ Mr Gorringe, clearly everything was brilliant and everything since has been a downgrade. I reckon Bamber and Swiss are the same person There are few certainties in life. Death, taxes, and Bamber and Swiss not being the same person.
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Rex
Predictions League
Joined: June 2014
Posts: 3,287
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Post by Rex on Oct 1, 2020 15:04:54 GMT
No, times weren't challenging when he arrived, Absolutely. Clearly they were not challenging at all. In fact, everything was spot on commercially: - Massive shirt sponsorship via the annual Lucky Dip-Wonderful club shop, people used to queue to get in and out! -On line shop was a wonderful experience -the Stadium manager was doing the commercial role, how visionary - what a great way to develop the brand -The bars were the most up to date and welcoming place you could have a drink anywhere. People couldn't wait to go in for a pint Looking at the above I am amazed why we ever needed to employ Mr Gorringe, clearly everything was brilliant and everything since has been a downgrade. I reckon Bamber and Swiss are the same person A lot of people are very pompous about the 'lucky dip' as you call it, I thought it was brilliant and a real chance for local businesses to be part of club. I was led to believe - although I am happy to admit I don't know the figures- that is was considered a success commercially as well, as I say I stand to be corrected. My only real experience of Gorringe's influence are the end of season dos at the waterfront, which I have to say have been incredibly professional and more importantly enjoyable. All rather very un-Rovers like really!
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Deleted
Joined: January 1970
Posts: 0
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Post by Deleted on Oct 1, 2020 15:08:35 GMT
Maybe I didn't understand what Swiss wrote, but I thought he was questioning whether we could be spending money to produce facilities inferior to those presently available to us? Well that's a nonsense for a start - its not too hard to understand what he wrote as its in black & white in the thread above and he states the cash should be diverted to making us "a more competitive team" So Swiss doesn't want the new training ground, has already said we should sell the Mem, wants more spent on the team rather than infrastructure and also says we should get consultants in to tell us what to do. All whilst being a serial WAQ & Board knocker. Seems like more and more the model of 30 years ago (other than the last bits) The worrying thing is that one or two might think he is being serious. Or even more worrying that it could be a good idea. Full of Wind Up Merchants is the Internet
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Post by swissgas on Oct 1, 2020 16:11:43 GMT
Maybe I didn't understand what Swiss wrote, but I thought he was questioning whether we could be spending money to produce facilities inferior to those presently available to us? Well that's a nonsense for a start - its not too hard to understand what he wrote as its in black & white in the thread above and he states the cash should be diverted to making us "a more competitive team" So Swiss doesn't want the new training ground, has already said we should sell the Mem, wants more spent on the team rather than infrastructure and also says we should get consultants in to tell us what to do. All whilst being a serial WAQ & Board knocker. Seems like more and more the model of 30 years ago (other than the last bits) The worrying thing is that one or two might think he is being serious. Or even more worrying that it could be a good idea. Full of Wind Up Merchants is the Internet The model of 30 years ago got Rovers to Championship level, balanced the books and enabled us to buy the Mem. It was called common sense then and it still is today.
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knowall
Joined: August 2019
Posts: 162
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Post by knowall on Oct 1, 2020 16:12:52 GMT
My short term strategy would start tomorrow by getting in touch with a few advisory firms such as Deloitte and BDO... Depending on the outcome of this exercise then choose the advisory firm to go forward with, committing a large sum of money for their work, and after say a six month period end up with a comprehensive business plan which, together with their help, can be marketed to potential investors worldwide. I think the last thing I'd say about Wael is that he has been unwilling to engage consultants I wonder why? ?
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