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Post by swissgas on May 8, 2019 10:27:40 GMT
without wanting to put words into knowall's mouth, that doesn't seem far from his view to me in the sense that they didn't really have much idea what they were taking on, and now that they know they are a bit stuck Yes, I think knowall comes from the group which have supported Rovers for a very long time and always held the position that backing the owners, whatever the circumstances, was the right course to take for the good of the club. My view is that the owners need to be put under constant scrutiny for the good of the club and that view dates back to my letters to the Evening Post in the 1970’s which questioned the action of the directors. I do think the owners are stuck in a difficult position and that Hani is the man we need to reach out to. |
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Post by Deleted on May 8, 2019 10:45:36 GMT
Rovers situation will not change for the better whilst the qadi are still the owners so the most positive news would be them selling up. I think that clubs can only stagnate for so long before they decline,not being relegated is important as it keeps non league football a division away,if Rovers had been relegated next season would be a concern. But surely its all dependent on who, if anyone buys the club. We could be sold tomorrow, but it wont mean we are any better off necessarily And I bet the owners will not give their shares away in exchange for paying off what the club owes them like the previous incumbents which probably means a minimum of 25 million just to buy the club and stand still |
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Post by Deleted on May 8, 2019 10:52:09 GMT
But surely its all dependent on who, if anyone buys the club. We could be sold tomorrow, but it wont mean we are any better off necessarily And I bet the owners will not give their shares away in exchange for paying off what the club owes them like the previous incumbents which probably means a minimum of 25 million just to buy the club and stand still I bet the current owners would snap off the hands of anybody willing to give them their money back. I don’t think that person who would have the best intention of the club exists considering the sort of numbers we are talking about. To add to Swiss’s view, I also think that the current owners didn’t realise what they were taking on although as long as they have equity within the value of the stadium they will try to move it on before calling in their loans. |
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Post by Deleted on May 8, 2019 10:55:54 GMT
And I bet the owners will not give their shares away in exchange for paying off what the club owes them like the previous incumbents which probably means a minimum of 25 million just to buy the club and stand still I bet the current owners would snap off the hands of anybody willing to give them their money back. I don’t think that person who would have the best intention of the club exists considering the sort of numbers we are talking about. To add to Swiss’s view, I also think that the current owners didn’t realise what they were taking on although as long as they have equity within the value of the stadium they will try to move it on before calling in their loans. I wonder if that's why the accounts aren't out yet.that the debts are very close to the assets and we are closer to admin now than we were 3 years ago |
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eppinggas
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Post by eppinggas on May 8, 2019 11:02:08 GMT
Surely without speculation... there is no Forum. I like to hear what people have to say. I think you were the first to wave a red flag when a charge was put on the Mem and that worse news was to follow. About 2 months before the UWE collapse. I would suggest that the people get all angsty about "gossip and speculation" on the subject... don't read or respond to comments on it. So just for me and AMPG - what's your current thoughts? UTG. My thoughts remain the same as they have done for the past two years. It was all a big mistake but, unfortunately for Rovers’ prospects, rich people are usually able to make sure others pay for their mistakes. Which means that any future owners will be starting from a much worse position than we had in February 2016 because the equity the club had in the Mem at that time will be gone. And so we are very likely to have to face the future as a small club with modest facilities and limited potential. The only recent information I have is that AJIB profits declined again in the first quarter of this year but the company still declared a 9% dividend. It looks to me that the company is rewarding it’s shareholders despite poor trading performance and borrowing from the Jordan Central Bank to ensure they have liquidity to pay that dividend. Meanwhile the people of Jordan are protesting in the streets about their falling standard of living and anyone with the ambition for self improvement must feel they are in a hopeless situation. For clarification the above paragraph is about AJIB not BRFC  Thanks Swiss. I guess should they sell... we'll then see whether 1. the "loans" to BRFC are going to be called in, (they already charge 6% on them anyway? Good business for bankers), or 2. whether Dwane Sports write them off. I suspect the former. Which means (please correct me if I'm wrong) that they wouldn't have put 1 penny of their own money into the Football Club, and they would have squandered the equity that existed in the Memorial Stadium. As you say - this then obviously makes the Club significantly less attractive to a new investor. If they don't find a buyer, then we can look forward to devolution (not even stagnation, let alone evolution) and huge cuts in budget both on and off the field as they frantically try and balance the books. We might even have to make do with a slightly smaller London Office at this stage. Oh the shame of it. |
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kingswood Polak
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Post by kingswood Polak on May 8, 2019 11:17:01 GMT
My thoughts remain the same as they have done for the past two years. It was all a big mistake but, unfortunately for Rovers’ prospects, rich people are usually able to make sure others pay for their mistakes. Which means that any future owners will be starting from a much worse position than we had in February 2016 because the equity the club had in the Mem at that time will be gone. And so we are very likely to have to face the future as a small club with modest facilities and limited potential. The only recent information I have is that AJIB profits declined again in the first quarter of this year but the company still declared a 9% dividend. It looks to me that the company is rewarding it’s shareholders despite poor trading performance and borrowing from the Jordan Central Bank to ensure they have liquidity to pay that dividend. Meanwhile the people of Jordan are protesting in the streets about their falling standard of living and anyone with the ambition for self improvement must feel they are in a hopeless situation. For clarification the above paragraph is about AJIB not BRFC Thanks Swiss. I guess should they sell... we'll then see whether 1. the "loans" to BRFC are going to be called in, (they already charge 6% on them anyway? Good business for bankers), or 2. whether Dwane Sports write them off. I suspect the former. Which means (please correct me if I'm wrong) that they wouldn't have put 1 penny of their own money into the Football Club, and they would have squandered the equity that existed in the Memorial Stadium. As you say - this then obviously makes the Club significantly less attractive to a new investor. If they don't find a buyer, then we can look forward to devolution (not even stagnation, let alone evolution) and huge cuts in budget both on and off the field as they frantically try and balance the books. We might even have to make do with a slightly smaller London Office at this stage. Oh the shame of it. It seems to me the knowall,and many others, believe that WAQ is the one that has not wanted to let go. I don’t know if this is true or not but it’s what many have alluded to. On my part, I am more worried about our long term prospects than ever before. I hope to be proved wrong as I never want us to fail but, let’s face it, we have not exactly been filled with optimism by our owners. |
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trymer
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Post by trymer on May 8, 2019 12:26:11 GMT
Rovers situation will not change for the better whilst the qadi are still the owners so the most positive news would be them selling up. I think that clubs can only stagnate for so long before they decline,not being relegated is important as it keeps non league football a division away,if Rovers had been relegated next season would be a concern. But surely its all dependent on who, if anyone buys the club. We could be sold tomorrow, but it wont mean we are any better off necessarily In his last interview with Twentyman the owner seemed to say (he isn't very straightforward) that they are keen to sell,if that's the case they are hardly likely to be interested in the future of the club ? Any potential buyer would know that UWE is dead and that they would have to have their own plans and ideas, until the present lot go the club is just treading water but how long can that continue ?
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eppinggas
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Post by eppinggas on May 8, 2019 22:50:09 GMT
5. ok scenario; They keep improving the club and its facilities,they pay off any losses over and above the value of the mem,in other words they simply do what the rest of the football world is doing. They seek out investment partners to finance a new ground. What sort of percentage of likelihood would you now give option 5? Serious question. Not having a dig. UTG. Here's mine: Option 1: 0.1% Option 2: 30% Option 3: 50% Option 4: 19% Option 5: 0.9% Not picking on you Sir. But would you care to re-evaluate? I'm worried. I am genuinely interested in others opinions. I could well be in a pessimistic minority. Or a pessimistic majority. |
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Post by eppinggas on May 8, 2019 22:52:10 GMT
Apologies - original post:
Nov 7, 2018 at 8:56am eppinggas said:
Fear and greed my friend.
If Dwane Sports did not have the appropriate level of detail on the UWE part of the deal, then they should not have bought BRFC. However they were worried some-one else would beat them to the deal (fear). They thought that there was a chance to make some decent money with UWE (greed). So they took a punt.
(BTW - If they took absolutely everything that Nick Higgs said at face-value, then more fool them).
Here is how they (sounds like Wael) justified taking a punt to 'the family'.
They are bankers. Even if the UWE deal doesn't come off, the asset value of the Memorial Stadium is more than the price paid for BRFC. So it's a no-brainer, isn't it?
1. Best case scenario: UWE 'works' and a shiny new Stadium is delivered. This makes money. Wael is a hero. Everyone is happy. Hooray! :-)
2. Worst case scenario: Dwane Sports sell the Mem for it's true value and get out flat on the deal. BRFC are homeless. Gasheads are unhappy. Wael leaves with his tail between his legs and his reputation in tatters. Boo :-(
3. Hopeful scenario: Sell BRFC (hopefully at a profit) to someone who just might deliver a new stadium. Wael could even stay on the Board. Gasheads and Wael are happy. Hooray! :-)
4. Stagnation scenario: Dwane Sports don't find a buyer. They don't take option 2. But they stop putting any money into BRFC as they don't want debt to exceed asset value. The club is strangled. Dwane Sports are left with a large nonperforming asset. We drop down the leagues in an increasingly decrepit stadium. Gasheads and Wael are not happy. Boo :-(
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Post by Deleted on May 9, 2019 15:21:28 GMT
They are bankers. Even if the UWE deal doesn't come off, the asset value of the Memorial Stadium is more than the price paid for BRFC. So it's a no-brainer, isn't it?
eppinggas. This is the line I keep quoting and some people can't quite grasp it.
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Post by a more piratey game on May 9, 2019 15:27:22 GMT
They are bankers. Even if the UWE deal doesn't come off, the asset value of the Memorial Stadium is more than the price paid for BRFC. So it's a no-brainer, isn't it? eppinggas. This is the line I keep quoting and some people can't quite grasp it. 'they' are bankers, but Wael wants a career in football. The valuation gap is Wael's window of opportunity. The gap has been narrowing for over 3 years now That's how I see it |
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eppinggas
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Post by eppinggas on May 9, 2019 17:04:56 GMT
I guess the accounts will show us just how much assets exceed debt.
If they still do.
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Post by droitwichgas on May 9, 2019 18:24:22 GMT
It's probably a big season coming where GC has to either make a play off push &/or selling JCH for £m's or the ALQ's will want out before their debts exceed the equity in the Mem and we started heading the way of Bolton etc with continuing annual debts.
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Post by a more piratey game on May 10, 2019 17:48:22 GMT
They are bankers. Even if the UWE deal doesn't come off, the asset value of the Memorial Stadium is more than the price paid for BRFC. So it's a no-brainer, isn't it? eppinggas. This is the line I keep quoting and some people can't quite grasp it. 'they' are bankers, but Wael wants a career in football. The valuation gap is Wael's window of opportunity. The gap has been narrowing for over 3 years now That's how I see it The 'plan', such as it is, seems to be to develop the club's infrastructure alongside 'enabling' property developments such as hotel and shops at the ground (a la MK) and housing (such as that considered for the Mem or the Colony) It seems to me that the AQs are bankers, but not experienced property developers or football people Maybe I'm being blinkered, but outside of TV revenues and some sponsorship that might come with promotion (with maybe an occasional modest transfer fee) , I don't see where material other revenues would come from |
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Post by Deleted on May 10, 2019 20:43:29 GMT
'they' are bankers, but Wael wants a career in football. The valuation gap is Wael's window of opportunity. The gap has been narrowing for over 3 years now That's how I see it The 'plan', such as it is, seems to be to develop the club's infrastructure alongside 'enabling' property developments such as hotel and shops at the ground (a la MK) and housing (such as that considered for the Mem or the Colony) It seems to me that the AQs are bankers, but not experienced property developers or football people Maybe I'm being blinkered, but outside of TV revenues and some sponsorship that might come with promotion (with maybe an occasional modest transfer fee) , I don't see where material other revenues would come from I think I've rumbled Wael's cunning plan. He's going to buy up every house in BS7, build the biggest stadium possible, wait for the value of the properties to go through the roof because that's what happens when huge stadiums are built at the bottom of gardens in residential areas, then show that pauper Mansour bin Zayed bin Sultan bin Zayed bin Khalifa Al Nahyan how to run a football club properly. Edit. It's no longer ''Early May', so another load of borrocks talked by people desperate to look big, clever and important. |
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Post by Deleted on May 13, 2019 21:13:44 GMT
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Post by Deleted on May 13, 2019 22:03:05 GMT
Yo Smudger, wanna buy ma club? That's one way of getting shot of one of those dud shirts with the Mintbet logo on I suppose. |
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Post by swissgas on May 13, 2019 22:13:13 GMT
Yo Smudger, wanna buy ma club? That's one way of getting shot of one of those dud shirts with the Mintbet logo on I suppose. Bamber, please tell me that photo isn’t real. They are taking the p*ss on a scale not seen since we signed Wilf Smith in 1975. |
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Post by Deleted on May 13, 2019 22:23:56 GMT
Your man Wael 'tweeted' it today.
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Post by swissgas on May 13, 2019 22:52:36 GMT
Your man Wael 'tweeted' it today. Anais Anais, I bought you duty free but there is no way I would have bought you in Lewis’s or Jones |
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