trymer
Joined: November 2018
Posts: 924 
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Post by trymer on Apr 14, 2023 15:36:50 GMT
Standard procedure to attack weak points and leave strongpoints isolated or bombard them with artillery. Seems the Ukes could have 40,000 new troops trained in EU and UK with armour, no doubt US giving them up to date information on Russian positions,so they could punch through in a couple of places. I agree that it will be interesting,if the Russians look like they are getting rolled up will they resort to tactical nuclear weapons ? Some Americans getting fed up with paying for the war,if that sentiment becomes widespread it could affect future funding,so this offensive could be the final one. think nobby pointed out a while back about what the actual expenditure was the US are "donating! barely ripple the wallet per person........ i dread to think what the situation would be had DT been in the White House... spewtin would be having lunch on the lawns by now me thinks!! Would Russia have invaded Ukraine if Trump was still President ? |
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Ukraine
Apr 14, 2023 18:20:56 GMT
via mobile
Post by baselswh on Apr 14, 2023 18:20:56 GMT
Apparently Putin is being treated for cancer,so potentially he's away from the 'front line' ,as it were.
In this scenario (if true) , who will be running the show and how different are they maybe to Putin?
Do they want the war to continue eg?
Was it General Rey,that led a cavalry charge against Wellington at Waterloo, without support of artillery when Bonaparte was resting?
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trymer
Joined: November 2018
Posts: 924
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Post by trymer on Apr 14, 2023 18:35:47 GMT
Apparently Putin is being treated for cancer,so potentially he's away from the 'front line' ,as it were. In this scenario (if true) , who will be running the show and how different are they maybe to Putin? Do they want the war to continue eg? Was it General Rey,that led a cavalry charge against Wellington at Waterloo, without support of artillery when Bonaparte was resting? Marshall Ney...he led several cavalry charges but he had horse artillery with him,the British had to keep in squares because of the cavalry and so they were hammered by the artillery,carnage in some squares. |
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Ukraine
Apr 14, 2023 19:27:51 GMT
via mobile
Post by baselswh on Apr 14, 2023 19:27:51 GMT
Apparently Putin is being treated for cancer,so potentially he's away from the 'front line' ,as it were. In this scenario (if true) , who will be running the show and how different are they maybe to Putin? Do they want the war to continue eg? Was it General Rey,that led a cavalry charge against Wellington at Waterloo, without support of artillery when Bonaparte was resting? Marshall Ney...he led several cavalry charges but he had horse artillery with him,the British had to keep in squares because of the cavalry and so they were hammered by the artillery,carnage in some squares. Ah yes,Ney! Thanks Trymer.👍 Anyway,wrong name but never the less,an example of how things can change when the Boss is not around. |
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trymer
Joined: November 2018
Posts: 924
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Post by trymer on Apr 14, 2023 19:53:48 GMT
Marshall Ney...he led several cavalry charges but he had horse artillery with him,the British had to keep in squares because of the cavalry and so they were hammered by the artillery,carnage in some squares. Ah yes,Ney! Thanks Trymer.👍 Anyway,wrong name but never the less,an example of how things can change when the Boss is not around. Napoleon was watching from the other side of the valley and he was unhappy that Ney had charged without waiting for infantry support,the French cavalry couldnt break the British squares and although the British infantry suffered IF French infantry would have been with the cavalry it could have been a disaster. I do wonder if Putin cant continue as leader or if he dies would the Russians call off the war ? reading different opinions from various countries some think that the war could go on for 10 years ! that could wreck the World economy and the instability could cause other conflicts to flare up. |
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trymer
Joined: November 2018
Posts: 924
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Post by trymer on Apr 16, 2023 10:44:30 GMT
The leaked US documents give different casualty estimates to the figures that we have seen so far of 7 Russian casualties to 1 Ukrainian (or even 10 to 1) the US estimates (IF true) are more like 1.5 or 2 to 1....
I dont watch many videos from Ukraine but yesterday I saw 2 that were interesting,one was from Bristol where bionic arms for wounded Ukrainian soldiers are being made, the other was 'the roads of Bakhmut' showing the destruction along the 2 roads into the city from the west, the Russians are very close to the roads and vehicles run the gauntlet,lots of destroyed military vehicles on the roadsides.
Something else that I read yesterday was that although lots of Ukrainian recruits are being trained in Britain the training only lasts 5 weeks !,by comparison British infantry basic training is 26 weeks.
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Post by lostinspace on Apr 16, 2023 12:44:16 GMT
The leaked US documents give different casualty estimates to the figures that we have seen so far of 7 Russian casualties to 1 Ukrainian (or even 10 to 1) the US estimates (IF true) are more like 1.5 or 2 to 1.... I dont watch many videos from Ukraine but yesterday I saw 2 that were interesting,one was from Bristol where bionic arms for wounded Ukrainian soldiers are being made, the other was 'the roads of Bakhmut' showing the destruction along the 2 roads into the city from the west, the Russians are very close to the roads and vehicles run the gauntlet,lots of destroyed military vehicles on the roadsides. Something else that I read yesterday was that although lots of Ukrainian recruits are being trained in Britain the training only lasts 5 weeks !,by comparison British infantry basic training is 26 weeks. it seems from several scenes that i have watched,ruskies are so intent on just flattening everything in their way, everywhere they have been that they seem like spoilt children and not having their way, if i can't have it then you ain't ...regards the training of the military, i don't think they have 26 weeks to play with, and that they are so intent on not giving up their country they are so eager to learn and quickly, may not be so refined as a 26 week recruit but eager to defend their land as if they were |
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trymer
Joined: November 2018
Posts: 924
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Post by trymer on Apr 16, 2023 16:48:32 GMT
The leaked US documents give different casualty estimates to the figures that we have seen so far of 7 Russian casualties to 1 Ukrainian (or even 10 to 1) the US estimates (IF true) are more like 1.5 or 2 to 1.... I dont watch many videos from Ukraine but yesterday I saw 2 that were interesting,one was from Bristol where bionic arms for wounded Ukrainian soldiers are being made, the other was 'the roads of Bakhmut' showing the destruction along the 2 roads into the city from the west, the Russians are very close to the roads and vehicles run the gauntlet,lots of destroyed military vehicles on the roadsides. Something else that I read yesterday was that although lots of Ukrainian recruits are being trained in Britain the training only lasts 5 weeks !,by comparison British infantry basic training is 26 weeks. it seems from several scenes that i have watched,ruskies are so intent on just flattening everything in their way, everywhere they have been that they seem like spoilt children and not having their way, if i can't have it then you ain't ...regards the training of the military, i don't think they have 26 weeks to play with, and that they are so intent on not giving up their country they are so eager to learn and quickly, may not be so refined as a 26 week recruit but eager to defend their land as if they were Seems to be their way of fighting wars,massive artillery bombardment flatten everything,remember Grozny in the Chechen war ?...in Bakhmut I am convinced that they could seal the city off but they are leaving the roads in that corridor open to reinforcements so they can keep causing Uke casualties. Yes,you're right they havent got time to play with,they need to replace the massive losses to their professional army,tbh if theyre going to push these conscripts into meat grinder battles like Bakhmut the amount of training they have doesnt matter. Now Poland and Hungary want to ban Ukrainian grain...but the EU says that its not a decision that countries can take....this could be interesting. |
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Post by Nobbygas on Apr 17, 2023 8:00:37 GMT
it seems from several scenes that i have watched,ruskies are so intent on just flattening everything in their way, everywhere they have been that they seem like spoilt children and not having their way, if i can't have it then you ain't ...regards the training of the military, i don't think they have 26 weeks to play with, and that they are so intent on not giving up their country they are so eager to learn and quickly, may not be so refined as a 26 week recruit but eager to defend their land as if they were Seems to be their way of fighting wars,massive artillery bombardment flatten everything,remember Grozny in the Chechen war ?...in Bakhmut I am convinced that they could seal the city off but they are leaving the roads in that corridor open to reinforcements so they can keep causing Uke casualties. Yes,you're right they havent got time to play with,they need to replace the massive losses to their professional army,tbh if theyre going to push these conscripts into meat grinder battles like Bakhmut the amount of training they have doesnt matter. Now Poland and Hungary want to ban Ukrainian grain...but the EU says that its not a decision that countries can take....this could be interesting. You cannot compare the five weeks training received by the Ukes with the 26 week training for a British Army soldier. First off I have never been through the British Army training process but I can imagine what they do, as my infantry training took 38 weeks. Those timescales are peacetime timescales. A lot of training time is taken up with learning things like personal admin (washing, ironing, polishing boots, drill). There are countless lessons like map reading, history and current affairs to attend. Bringing the basic fitness levels up from a civilian to a soldier takes a long time. Get rid of all of that, and you can fit an awful lot into five concentrated weeks, especially with highly motivated people who are willing to learn fast! The five weeks the Ukes receive are purely war based. Many of them already have some combat experience. The training they receive will teach them to move, act and fight as a unit. Five weeks of concentrated training will be of huge benefit to them and should not be underestimated. Poland is not looking to ban Ukrainian wheat. The problem is that the ships normally used to export the grain are limited, so much of the grain is being moved through Poland. The result is that Poland is flooded with grain which has driven down the prices and it's destroying the Polish grain industry. Poland doesn't want to ban the wheat, but it wants that wheat to just move through the country for export purposes. It's a tricky situation for them and they are just trying to find a solution to the problem. |
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trymer
Joined: November 2018
Posts: 924
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Post by trymer on Apr 17, 2023 10:44:34 GMT
Seems to be their way of fighting wars,massive artillery bombardment flatten everything,remember Grozny in the Chechen war ?...in Bakhmut I am convinced that they could seal the city off but they are leaving the roads in that corridor open to reinforcements so they can keep causing Uke casualties. Yes,you're right they havent got time to play with,they need to replace the massive losses to their professional army,tbh if theyre going to push these conscripts into meat grinder battles like Bakhmut the amount of training they have doesnt matter. Now Poland and Hungary want to ban Ukrainian grain...but the EU says that its not a decision that countries can take....this could be interesting. You cannot compare the five weeks training received by the Ukes with the 26 week training for a British Army soldier. First off I have never been through the British Army training process but I can imagine what they do, as my infantry training took 38 weeks. Those timescales are peacetime timescales. A lot of training time is taken up with learning things like personal admin (washing, ironing, polishing boots, drill). There are countless lessons like map reading, history and current affairs to attend. Bringing the basic fitness levels up from a civilian to a soldier takes a long time. Get rid of all of that, and you can fit an awful lot into five concentrated weeks, especially with highly motivated people who are willing to learn fast! The five weeks the Ukes receive are purely war based. Many of them already have some combat experience. The training they receive will teach them to move, act and fight as a unit. Five weeks of concentrated training will be of huge benefit to them and should not be underestimated. You say that many of them will have previous military experience but many of these people are conscripts,hopefully they will get further training in Ukraine after their training here. You say get rid of the fitness training,thats ok for rear echelon stuff but these blokes will be expected to take part in an offensive,they need fieldcraft, practise with the weapons that they will be using,and training in urban warfare (probably),training in various attacks. tbh I have only watched a very few videos from Ukraine because a lot of its propaganda bull**** ,but from what I have seen there are some VERY poorly trained (maybe not trained at all) people,its like I imagine paintball would be but with fatal consequences. |
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trymer
Joined: November 2018
Posts: 924
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Post by trymer on Apr 17, 2023 10:51:13 GMT
Seems to be their way of fighting wars,massive artillery bombardment flatten everything,remember Grozny in the Chechen war ?...in Bakhmut I am convinced that they could seal the city off but they are leaving the roads in that corridor open to reinforcements so they can keep causing Uke casualties. Yes,you're right they havent got time to play with,they need to replace the massive losses to their professional army,tbh if theyre going to push these conscripts into meat grinder battles like Bakhmut the amount of training they have doesnt matter. Now Poland and Hungary want to ban Ukrainian grain...but the EU says that its not a decision that countries can take....this could be interesting. Poland is not looking to ban Ukrainian wheat. The problem is that the ships normally used to export the grain are limited, so much of the grain is being moved through Poland. The result is that Poland is flooded with grain which has driven down the prices and it's destroying the Polish grain industry. Poland doesn't want to ban the wheat, but it wants that wheat to just move through the country for export purposes. It's a tricky situation for them and they are just trying to find a solution to the problem. Apparently Polish farmers as a group have quite a lot of political clout,they can see their livelihoods threatened,as I said this situation could be interesting,we will see what cohesion the EU has. |
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Post by Nobbygas on Apr 17, 2023 11:38:56 GMT
You cannot compare the five weeks training received by the Ukes with the 26 week training for a British Army soldier. First off I have never been through the British Army training process but I can imagine what they do, as my infantry training took 38 weeks. Those timescales are peacetime timescales. A lot of training time is taken up with learning things like personal admin (washing, ironing, polishing boots, drill). There are countless lessons like map reading, history and current affairs to attend. Bringing the basic fitness levels up from a civilian to a soldier takes a long time. Get rid of all of that, and you can fit an awful lot into five concentrated weeks, especially with highly motivated people who are willing to learn fast! The five weeks the Ukes receive are purely war based. Many of them already have some combat experience. The training they receive will teach them to move, act and fight as a unit. Five weeks of concentrated training will be of huge benefit to them and should not be underestimated. You say that many of them will have previous military experience but many of these people are conscripts,hopefully they will get further training in Ukraine after their training here. You say get rid of the fitness training,thats ok for rear echelon stuff but these blokes will be expected to take part in an offensive,they need fieldcraft, practise with the weapons that they will be using,and training in urban warfare (probably),training in various attacks. tbh I have only watched a very few videos from Ukraine because a lot of its propaganda bull**** ,but from what I have seen there are some VERY poorly trained (maybe not trained at all) people,its like I imagine paintball would be but with fatal consequences. "these blokes will be expected to take part in an offensive,they need fieldcraft, practise with the weapons that they will be using,and training in urban warfare (probably),training in various attacks." - Give these highly motivated guys five weeks of intensive training with experienced instructors, and they'd have that. Also, the Ukes will not have whole units manned by the newbies. They will be mixed into already experienced units where the new guys can learn from the more experienced guys. When they get to their units then even more advanced training will take place. The same happens in the British Army/ Royal Marines. Basic Training is just that, Basic. The real learning takes place when the fresh out of the box soldier/marine reach their units. |
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Post by Nobbygas on Apr 17, 2023 11:45:23 GMT
Poland is not looking to ban Ukrainian wheat. The problem is that the ships normally used to export the grain are limited, so much of the grain is being moved through Poland. The result is that Poland is flooded with grain which has driven down the prices and it's destroying the Polish grain industry. Poland doesn't want to ban the wheat, but it wants that wheat to just move through the country for export purposes. It's a tricky situation for them and they are just trying to find a solution to the problem. Apparently Polish farmers as a group have quite a lot of political clout,they can see their livelihoods threatened,as I said this situation could be interesting,we will see what cohesion the EU has. This is the problem. Poland were hoping the EU would do something, but as always they've done nothing so Poland are trying to force the issue. |
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trymer
Joined: November 2018
Posts: 924
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Post by trymer on Apr 17, 2023 11:51:30 GMT
You say that many of them will have previous military experience but many of these people are conscripts,hopefully they will get further training in Ukraine after their training here. You say get rid of the fitness training,thats ok for rear echelon stuff but these blokes will be expected to take part in an offensive,they need fieldcraft, practise with the weapons that they will be using,and training in urban warfare (probably),training in various attacks. tbh I have only watched a very few videos from Ukraine because a lot of its propaganda bull**** ,but from what I have seen there are some VERY poorly trained (maybe not trained at all) people,its like I imagine paintball would be but with fatal consequences. "these blokes will be expected to take part in an offensive,they need fieldcraft, practise with the weapons that they will be using,and training in urban warfare (probably),training in various attacks." - Give these highly motivated guys five weeks of intensive training with experienced instructors, and they'd have that. Also, the Ukes will not have whole units manned by the newbies. They will be mixed into already experienced units where the new guys can learn from the more experienced guys. When they get to their units then even more advanced training will take place. The same happens in the British Army/ Royal Marines. Basic Training is just that, Basic. The real learning takes place when the fresh out of the box soldier/marine reach their units. I agree that basic training is basic training,but these blokes will be learning as they go into a war zone not when they join a peace time unit. Anyway they are getting 5 weeks training so they will have to make the best of it,I doubt that the Russian training is much is up to much looking at them. I just read on the Guardian website that Slovakia have joined Poland and Hungary in banning grain imports from Ukraine. |
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Post by Nobbygas on Apr 20, 2023 9:54:52 GMT
From various reports and sources it looks as though the Uke offensive will begin very soon. Already there are reports of various Uke assaults going in. It appears that they are (to use a military term) 'shaping the battlefield'. This means that various things are happening to prepare for the offensive. For example, there maybe an assault somewhere which is designed to draw Russian forces to it, and therefore away from where the main assault may happen. Or various supple dumps, railway lines, bridges etc may be hit to hamper the logistics within that area. Of course, when you are 'shaping' you have to do it in a way that still does not indicate where the main offense will happen.
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trymer
Joined: November 2018
Posts: 924
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Post by trymer on Apr 20, 2023 10:17:36 GMT
From various reports and sources it looks as though the Uke offensive will begin very soon. Already there are reports of various Uke assaults going in. It appears that they are (to use a military term) 'shaping the battlefield'. This means that various things are happening to prepare for the offensive. For example, there maybe an assault somewhere which is designed to draw Russian forces to it, and therefore away from where the main assault may happen. Or various supple dumps, railway lines, bridges etc may be hit to hamper the logistics within that area. Of course, when you are 'shaping' you have to do it in a way that still does not indicate where the main offense will happen. I read that the Ukes have formed 8 brigades from their new troops,I expect that they will be stiffened with cadres of experienced troops from existing formations much as new British and German units were in WW2. This offensive (or offensives ) will be vulnerable when the units concentrate prior to attacking,Russian satellites (or satellite information from friendly countries) could pinpoint forming up areas to attack from the air. The Dnieper river must be crossed to attack some positions,this will be a problem but if the Ukes have good intel I think that they can break through the Russian positions in some places,whether they have enough troops to exploit successful breakthroughs we will find out. |
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Post by Nobbygas on Apr 20, 2023 10:34:52 GMT
"but if the Ukes have good intel" - They are getting the very best Intel that NATO can provide! The intelligence leaks in the US have shown that NATO probably know more about what Russia are doing that Putin himself!
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trymer
Joined: November 2018
Posts: 924
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Post by trymer on Apr 20, 2023 13:30:05 GMT
"but if the Ukes have good intel" - They are getting the very best Intel that NATO can provide! The intelligence leaks in the US have shown that NATO probably know more about what Russia are doing that Putin himself! Do you believe that the leaks were genuine or that its an operation to disseminate false information ? Years ago I saw a presentation about military use of drones,showed an infantry section on the move and they were using a small drone to scout ahead of them.....last night a friend told me to watch a video of Ukes defending a position in Bakhmut (or just outside) the Ukes were getting information from a drone which meant that the Russians couldnt use dead ground. No doubt there will be some means of jamming drones but until that happens drones will be of great use to infantry or AFVs. Drones,shoulder launched anti -tank missiles are the big 'winners' in this war so far,artillery causing most casualties again. |
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Post by Nobbygas on Apr 20, 2023 20:36:29 GMT
"but if the Ukes have good intel" - They are getting the very best Intel that NATO can provide! The intelligence leaks in the US have shown that NATO probably know more about what Russia are doing that Putin himself! Do you believe that the leaks were genuine or that its an operation to disseminate false information ? Years ago I saw a presentation about military use of drones,showed an infantry section on the move and they were using a small drone to scout ahead of them.....last night a friend told me to watch a video of Ukes defending a position in Bakhmut (or just outside) the Ukes were getting information from a drone which meant that the Russians couldnt use dead ground. No doubt there will be some means of jamming drones but until that happens drones will be of great use to infantry or AFVs. Drones,shoulder launched anti -tank missiles are the big 'winners' in this war so far,artillery causing most casualties again. Drones have changed everything, especially for the infantry. Current Royal Marines use drones extensively and have been doing so for a few years. The DJI hobby drones have been used in Ukraine in their thousands. However, as always happens in warfare, the Russians have developed means to stop them and their use is now limited. I have one and just messing around with it in the countryside you can quite clearly see the benefits of using one. So, the cheaper hobby drones use is now limited, but the more expensive ones are still used. |
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bluetornados
Predictions League
Joined: June 2014
Posts: 8,159
Member is Online
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Post by bluetornados on Apr 21, 2023 7:49:04 GMT
Ukraine war: Russian warplane accidentally bombs own city...From Reporter George Wright
The defence ministry in Moscow says a Russian fighter jet accidentally bombed the city of Belgorod near the border with Ukraine.
Regional Governor Vyacheslav Gladkov said the blast had left a huge crater about 20 metres (60 ft) wide in the city centre.
Two women were injured and several buildings were damaged, he said.
A Su-34 fighter-bomber jet accidentally discharged aircraft ordnance, the ministry said.
The incident took place at 22:15 local time (19:15 GMT) on Thursday, Russian news agencies said. An investigation is under way.
Photos and videos on social media show apartments damaged by the blast, while one image appears to a show a car on the roof of a building.
Belgorod - a city of 370,000 - is around 25 miles (40 km) from the Ukrainian border. It lies just north of Ukraine's second city, Kharkiv, and people there have been living in fear of Ukrainian shelling since the Russian invasion of Ukraine last year.
Russian jets also regularly fly over the city on their way to Ukraine.
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