Bridgeman
Alfie Biggs
Joined: May 2014
Posts: 3,549
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Post by Bridgeman on Jan 19, 2016 19:20:18 GMT
Others appear to think not. I actually don't have a problem if it is a budget issue - that seems completely reasonable to me and I'd have accepted that as an explanation. We do have to balance resources and priorities. I have more concerns about DC's explanation that this is a footballing decision. Why on earth send a guy out on loan who is capable of actively contributing to the side? We're in January, not September, so if Harrison is demanding 1st team football frankly the response should be 'tough s*** pal and if you don't like it find another club at the end of the season' (it's hardly in his interest to down tools or sulk for 5 months given he's out of contract - wherever he is, he'll have to give it everything to earn another contract somewhere). He's contracted to Rovers, he's doing a reasonable job in the role he is playing for Rovers; what's good for his wider career is none of our concern right now. This is about short term need and we're in a dogfight for promotion! I've never come across a manager who would rather not have an extra player in his squad. The same arguments that have applied to Harrison could equally well apply to any of our other 'bench' players - is the suggestion they should go out on loan too so they come back with more match fitness? I'm not buying the argument that Harrison is better off starting at Hartlepool than sitting on our bench either. If he carries on as he is then he'll end up with 15-18 goals largely as a squad player in a team that has been in a promotion hunt - I think that's a pretty attractive starting point for League 2 clubs looking to upgrade their forward line for next season given his age. If he goes to Hartlepool he could be starting in a misfiring side that is mired in a relegation battle - OK, he could score the goals that fire them to safety. More likely though, as in 2014, he gets caught up in a squad down on morale and struggling to create opportunities for their forward players. So if he's gone there out of choice I think he's been pretty badly advised because people could see him struggling in that side, see his record from 2014 and think 'not up to it'. Rather than stay with us and carry on chipping in from the bench and I think he keeps a reputation as a genuinely promising prospect at this level. Unless of course he's had a lifelong burning desire to play for Ronnie Moore.... For me this makes little sense as a 'footballing' decision for either Rovers or Harrison - although it does at least make some sense for Harrison, it makes no sense for Rovers as far as I can see. It's not a criticism of Clarke, he has made very good calls all season - just a comment that if this is the explanation I'm not really buying it. All else being equal, why wouldn't you want an impact player like Harrison sitting on your bench? Once again you post and there is nothing that I don't agree with. Spot on the money and I think our fans have been programmed to not question such decisions. Me ? I am just way too cynical to accept it. Great post fella Kp, you should know me by now (although not personally of course) not to be programmed have you read the article where Ellis says how the loan has come about and how he spoke with Andy Monkhouse before he made his decision ? I accept the cynicism that some are greeting this with and will want to search for other reasons but Ellis is going on loan for 4 weeks only, not for the rest of the season. If he was being sent out on loan for the rest of the season that would be an entirely different matter but he's not.
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Post by o2o2bo2ba on Jan 19, 2016 19:35:37 GMT
Harrison in the starting 11 tonight for Hartlepool He could really do us a favour there. No Windyarse for milk drinkers, too!
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gass
Joined: July 2014
Posts: 118
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Post by gass on Jan 19, 2016 20:10:57 GMT
Accrington 1-0 Hartlepool
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Bridgeman
Alfie Biggs
Joined: May 2014
Posts: 3,549
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Post by Bridgeman on Jan 19, 2016 20:32:46 GMT
Come on Ellis, we'd like you to do more than just get fit
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Post by Curly Wurly on Jan 19, 2016 20:40:38 GMT
2-0 at half time. From BBC text Accrington are well on top and Ellis is hardly featuring. 45 to go though.
Accrington's games in hand could shake things up in the top 7.
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Post by lostinspace on Jan 19, 2016 20:42:38 GMT
2-0 at half time. From BBC text Accrington are well on top and Ellis is hardly featuring. 45 to go though. he hit the post with a header though just before Accies scored on the half time
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Post by Curly Wurly on Jan 19, 2016 20:49:59 GMT
2-0 at half time. From BBC text Accrington are well on top and Ellis is hardly featuring. 45 to go though. he hit the post with a header though just before Accies scored on the half time Thanks, I didn't see that. Never thought I would be so interested in a game between Accrington and Hartlepool!
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Post by Curly Wurly on Jan 19, 2016 21:18:52 GMT
3-0 now, but at least Ellis should get the full 90 as pool have used all 3 subs.
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Post by singupgas on Jan 19, 2016 21:22:44 GMT
Not sure this loan is going to be any benefit to him, game time or not.
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Post by Colyton Gas. on Jan 19, 2016 21:25:48 GMT
Crowd at Accrington 1,211.
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Post by lostinspace on Jan 19, 2016 21:34:40 GMT
Crowd at Accrington 1,211. thats a decent crowd for them mid week and this weather too
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faggotygas
Byron Anthony
Joined: May 2014
Posts: 1,862
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Post by faggotygas on Jan 19, 2016 22:00:26 GMT
Where are you getting 12 goals from Irish? Soccerbase says 6. Apart from a penalty on Saturday, he's not scored since October. He's a young man who needs game time to find his form, imo. Where's Irish quoted 12 FG, I can't see that but you're right he's only scored 6, 2 of which are penalties. He's only going on loan for 4 weeks and potentially could play up to 7 games. That has enormous potential for us on his return and for the rest of the season. His prior post, where he says 12 is a great return. Also the post he quoted says that if he produces the same over the rest of the season, he'll get 15 to 18 goals; actually it's more like 10. Not saying it's Ellis's fault, we just now have players who are playing better than him, which is why he needs game time to improve. He's 21, we have to consider his development, don't we?
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Bridgeman
Alfie Biggs
Joined: May 2014
Posts: 3,549
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Post by Bridgeman on Jan 19, 2016 22:13:39 GMT
Not sure this loan is going to be any benefit to him, game time or not. He's got another 90 minutes under his belt for only the 2nd time in a couple of months, the last time was against Barnet and it showed. He'll come back far match fitter than he went and that's the whole reason for him going. He may also see that maybe life isn't always greener elsewhere and he'll appreciate being at our club a lot more.
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Bridgeman
Alfie Biggs
Joined: May 2014
Posts: 3,549
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Post by Bridgeman on Jan 19, 2016 22:26:10 GMT
Where's Irish quoted 12 FG, I can't see that but you're right he's only scored 6, 2 of which are penalties. He's only going on loan for 4 weeks and potentially could play up to 7 games. That has enormous potential for us on his return and for the rest of the season. His prior post, where he says 12 is a great return. Also the post he quoted says that if he produces the same over the rest of the season, he'll get 15 to 18 goals; actually it's more like 10. Not saying it's Ellis's fault, we just now have players who are playing better than him, which is why he needs game time to improve. He's 21, we have to consider his development, don't we? Ah right, thanks FG but I absolutely agree with you about his development and it is only for 4 weeks. Mind you he not only scored from the penalty but controlled the ball brilliantly on his chest to pass it to Easter who then played it through into the penalty area from where he was brought down.
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irishrover
Global Moderator
Joined: June 2014
Posts: 3,372
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Post by irishrover on Jan 20, 2016 0:34:33 GMT
Where's Irish quoted 12 FG, I can't see that but you're right he's only scored 6, 2 of which are penalties. He's only going on loan for 4 weeks and potentially could play up to 7 games. That has enormous potential for us on his return and for the rest of the season. His prior post, where he says 12 is a great return. Also the post he quoted says that if he produces the same over the rest of the season, he'll get 15 to 18 goals; actually it's more like 10. Not saying it's Ellis's fault, we just now have players who are playing better than him, which is why he needs game time to improve. He's 21, we have to consider his development, don't we? To be honest that figure was in my head from another thread. I'm sure someone mentioned that he'd scored 12. Apologies. Not sure it massively undermines the basic point that I think it's a strange move to send a player away at this point in the season. I'm not particularly bothered about it as it's hard going to make a big difference one way or another but I don't really see the logic and the timing was also somewhat peculiar.
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kingswood Polak
Without music life would be a mistake
Joined: May 2014
Posts: 10,278
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Post by kingswood Polak on Jan 20, 2016 11:38:15 GMT
Once again you post and there is nothing that I don't agree with. Spot on the money and I think our fans have been programmed to not question such decisions. Me ? I am just way too cynical to accept it. Great post fella Kp, you should know me by now (although not personally of course) not to be programmed have you read the article where Ellis says how the loan has come about and how he spoke with Andy Monkhouse before he made his decision ? I accept the cynicism that some are greeting this with and will want to search for other reasons but Ellis is going on loan for 4 weeks only, not for the rest of the season. If he was being sent out on loan for the rest of the season that would be an entirely different matter but he's not. Hello Bridgey, I have seen it but there is something that unsettles me about it. I guess you have seen me post about now not putting unsubstantiated rumour ? I have been hung out to dry on that score and so I now avoid posting the nuggets of information that I still get thrown but I will say that I have heard, several times, that Harrison was to be let go. There is a part of me that really wished I could take the clubs information at face value, it would make it much simpler for me but I am afraid that I have come to distrust anything that is told me or us. I think I am justified in being this way to be honest. Yes, on the face of it this is just a short term loan but it just doesn't make sense to allow him to go. This is a player that, when on form, is a real threat and played a huge part in our getting promoted back to football league status. I guess we will have to agree to disagree. No disrespect or hard feelings but I just cannot trust those people who run the club
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faggotygas
Byron Anthony
Joined: May 2014
Posts: 1,862
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Post by faggotygas on Jan 20, 2016 12:10:59 GMT
Kp, you should know me by now (although not personally of course) not to be programmed have you read the article where Ellis says how the loan has come about and how he spoke with Andy Monkhouse before he made his decision ? I accept the cynicism that some are greeting this with and will want to search for other reasons but Ellis is going on loan for 4 weeks only, not for the rest of the season. If he was being sent out on loan for the rest of the season that would be an entirely different matter but he's not. Hello Bridgey, I have seen it but there is something that unsettles me about it. I guess you have seen me post about now not putting unsubstantiated rumour ? I have been hung out to dry on that score and so I now avoid posting the nuggets of information that I still get thrown but I will say that I have heard, several times, that Harrison was to be let go. There is a part of me that really wished I could take the clubs information at face value, it would make it much simpler for me but I am afraid that I have come to distrust anything that is told me or us. I think I am justified in being this way to be honest. Yes, on the face of it this is just a short term loan but it just doesn't make sense to allow him to go. This is a player that, when on form, is a real threat and played a huge part in our getting promoted back to football league status. I guess we will have to agree to disagree. No disrespect or hard feelings but I just cannot trust those people who run the club Exactly, when on form. The last few appearances I've seen, he's been a long way off that. The lad needs game time.
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Post by gashead1979 on Jan 20, 2016 13:40:34 GMT
Didn't realise Ellis had a game last night, neither did Hartlepool looking at that result!!!
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Post by Curly Wurly on Jan 20, 2016 14:03:06 GMT
Can't really pick much up from the Hartlepool fans' reaction. Naturally, they all seem pretty pi**ed off at the moment. The only comment I did catch about Ellis following last night's game was:
"Ellis Harrison has potential to be something but the rest of the team played truly awful".
A month away will give Ellis plenty of game time and unless Hartlepool pick up, he'll probably realise that competing for a place at Rovers is preferable.
One thing is clear to me this season, that Darrell Clarke will use the main squad and rotate in many positions, due to form, but also what he thinks will deal best with the opposition.
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Deleted
Joined: January 1970
Posts: 0
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Post by Deleted on Jan 20, 2016 16:54:35 GMT
Someone posted a link on Gaschat, that said Ronnie Moore wasn't very impressed with his new signings
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