warehamgas
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Post by warehamgas on Mar 25, 2018 11:21:17 GMT
With what’s going on in South Africa with Australia seemingly planning to systematically cheat I though it deserved a new thread for the few of us who comment on cricket stuff. I didn’t watch it happening live so have only picked up on it late last night, but have seen it since. It appears that the Australian “leadership team” (whoever is involved in that) conspired, planned to systematically cheat to gain an unfair advantage and did so to involve several members of the team. If that’s the case then wow! I look forward to an interesting response from Cricket Australia, will it address the issues head on or will it sweep the issue under the carpet? Im sure Cameron Bancroft will appreciate the quieter atmosphere of the County Ground in Taunton in a week or so! If he comes that is.
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irishrover
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Post by irishrover on Mar 25, 2018 22:55:04 GMT
The whole thing has been amazing and it just reminds you that Australian sporting culture is really quite weird sometimes. They really do take the 'play hard but play fair' thing extremely seriously. It's amazing to see ex-player after ex-player plus people from other sports and politicians just lining up to absolutely pan the Aussie team for this. I honestly don't think that if this had happened in England the reaction would have been anywhere near this volcanic. I'm not saying that whoever did it wouldn't have been roundly condemned and thought worthy of firing etc but I don't think there would be quite this depth of outrage. It says a lot about how Australia thinks of itself as a sporting country I think.
Because from the outside you would think that Australia have always massively pushed the boundaries when given half a chance that being hypercompetitive is just part of the values of sport (I mean I have taken more abuse on cricket fields from Aussies than anyone else etc) - but there's clearly an idea that what is done within the laws and outside the laws are 2 different things. I almost feel a bit sorry Smith here - most mass muderers would get a better press! Clearly what he's done is terrible and he deserves to face the consequences but this is heads on pikes stuff. They did cheat and it is terrible and they clearly deserve to be banned/sacked etc. But somehow the reaction to it has left me feeling slightly the other way. I mean, let's be honest, Atherton was caught doing exactly this 20 odd years ago and nearly every side has been caught doing some variant of this at some point (which one assumes were equally pre-planned) and I remember gentle mockery and general 'down with this sort of thing'. But this is something else and of course the penalty itself is only 5 runs!
This is going to have serious legs to it - it could end up with the destruction of this particular Australian side. There are obviously some pretty gross parts of this too - not least the obvious setting-up of a young player by getting Bancroft to do it etc. But in some ways it was the way they just brazenly owned up to it afterwards which seems to have particularly damned them in this instance. Plus the obvious - how on earth did they think they were ever going to get away with it? Particularly in such a bad tempered series like this in which TV producers would be having camera on nearly everything for the chance of another story. It's been a bizarre few weeks. I do wonder if the Aussies have just lost their minds under the stick they're getting and their anger at Rabada not getting banned and got it into their heads that there was some odd form of justice in doing this.
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Peter Parker
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Post by Peter Parker on Mar 26, 2018 12:06:50 GMT
The whole thing has been amazing and it just reminds you that Australian sporting culture is really quite weird sometimes. They really do take the 'play hard but play fair' thing extremely seriously. It's amazing to see ex-player after ex-player plus people from other sports and politicians just lining up to absolutely pan the Aussie team for this. I honestly don't think that if this had happened in England the reaction would have been anywhere near this volcanic. I'm not saying that whoever did it wouldn't have been roundly condemned and thought worthy of firing etc but I don't think there would be quite this depth of outrage. It says a lot about how Australia thinks of itself as a sporting country I think. Because from the outside you would think that Australia have always massively pushed the boundaries when given half a chance that being hypercompetitive is just part of the values of sport (I mean I have taken more abuse on cricket fields from Aussies than anyone else etc) - but there's clearly an idea that what is done within the laws and outside the laws are 2 different things. I almost feel a bit sorry Smith here - most mass muderers would get a better press! Clearly what he's done is terrible and he deserves to face the consequences but this is heads on pikes stuff. They did cheat and it is terrible and they clearly deserve to be banned/sacked etc. But somehow the reaction to it has left me feeling slightly the other way. I mean, let's be honest, Atherton was caught doing exactly this 20 odd years ago and nearly every side has been caught doing some variant of this at some point (which one assumes were equally pre-planned) and I remember gentle mockery and general 'down with this sort of thing'. But this is something else and of course the penalty itself is only 5 runs! This is going to have serious legs to it - it could end up with the destruction of this particular Australian side. There are obviously some pretty gross parts of this too - not least the obvious setting-up of a young player by getting Bancroft to do it etc. But in some ways it was the way they just brazenly owned up to it afterwards which seems to have particularly damned them in this instance. Plus the obvious - how on earth did they think they were ever going to get away with it? Particularly in such a bad tempered series like this in which TV producers would be having camera on nearly everything for the chance of another story. It's been a bizarre few weeks. I do wonder if the Aussies have just lost their minds under the stick they're getting and their anger at Rabada not getting banned and got it into their heads that there was some odd form of justice in doing this. The reaction is Australia is OTT, but then again this is Australia and it's cricket and Steve Smith surely knew what he was letting himself in for.
I can only assume the admission to it so quickly was intended to put there hands. take a punishment and move on, but the whole pre-planned thing involving 2 or more senior individuals has opened up a huge can of worms and uproar. Perhaps if Smith said it was him and him alone and he coerced Bancroft into doing it. Sure Smith would probably be 'ruined' and the captaincy gone, but thhat might have been it, but I think they just added fuel to the fire
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Captain Jayho
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Post by Captain Jayho on Mar 26, 2018 14:00:59 GMT
This is like Christmas has come early over here. Amazing.
Where's this line in the sand now then boys? The one that you constantly harp on about not crossing when you're playing hard but fair. The one that's different depending on whether it's applied to Australia or the rest of the world.
Word is that Warner is balls deep in this - pardon the pun. Always been a total grub and the chickens have come home to roost now. Never understood how anyone thought he might be captain material. Utter madness.
Warner, Smith and Bancroft will do time and realistically Lyon and Starc should too as they are in the leadership group and therefore consented to it. Lehman will have to go as well. If he knew then he should go, and if he didn't then you have to ask how and clearly not in control of the players.
Sad for cricket but seriously, somebody pinch me. They are eating each other from the inside out over here.
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jackthegas
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Post by jackthegas on Mar 26, 2018 21:36:51 GMT
The whole thing has been amazing and it just reminds you that Australian sporting culture is really quite weird sometimes. They really do take the 'play hard but play fair' thing extremely seriously. It's amazing to see ex-player after ex-player plus people from other sports and politicians just lining up to absolutely pan the Aussie team for this. I honestly don't think that if this had happened in England the reaction would have been anywhere near this volcanic. I'm not saying that whoever did it wouldn't have been roundly condemned and thought worthy of firing etc but I don't think there would be quite this depth of outrage. It says a lot about how Australia thinks of itself as a sporting country I think. Because from the outside you would think that Australia have always massively pushed the boundaries when given half a chance that being hypercompetitive is just part of the values of sport (I mean I have taken more abuse on cricket fields from Aussies than anyone else etc) - but there's clearly an idea that what is done within the laws and outside the laws are 2 different things. I almost feel a bit sorry Smith here - most mass muderers would get a better press! Clearly what he's done is terrible and he deserves to face the consequences but this is heads on pikes stuff. They did cheat and it is terrible and they clearly deserve to be banned/sacked etc. But somehow the reaction to it has left me feeling slightly the other way. I mean, let's be honest, Atherton was caught doing exactly this 20 odd years ago and nearly every side has been caught doing some variant of this at some point (which one assumes were equally pre-planned) and I remember gentle mockery and general 'down with this sort of thing'. But this is something else and of course the penalty itself is only 5 runs! This is going to have serious legs to it - it could end up with the destruction of this particular Australian side. There are obviously some pretty gross parts of this too - not least the obvious setting-up of a young player by getting Bancroft to do it etc. But in some ways it was the way they just brazenly owned up to it afterwards which seems to have particularly damned them in this instance. Plus the obvious - how on earth did they think they were ever going to get away with it? Particularly in such a bad tempered series like this in which TV producers would be having camera on nearly everything for the chance of another story. It's been a bizarre few weeks. I do wonder if the Aussies have just lost their minds under the stick they're getting and their anger at Rabada not getting banned and got it into their heads that there was some odd form of justice in doing this. As soon as I saw the look on Smiths face when the umpires were talking to Bancroft, I knew Smith was in on it. There are a number of factors that make this worse than the dirt in the pocket stuff in my opinion. The Aussie team are really hard to like. The coach really went for Broad a few years ago and then had the nerve to bleat about unfair treatment in South Africa. Lyon talked about ending careers Before the ashes. The way they went after Rabada was out of order. Smith setting himself up as a guardian of the game and making it clear that he felt he should have been consulted with after the ban was overturned. Has anyone heard Warner talking about the du plessis ball tampering a few years ago? Basically said the rules are there for a reason and we’d never stoop so low. They’re massive hypocrites. They asked for stump mics to be turned down so no one could hear them going after the South Africans then again, had the nerve to complain when South Africa reacted. Smith got the youngest guy in the team to ball tamper. He was also really stupid when fronting up to the press. This stuff about it being the leadership team may have been him trying to protect Warner but he has dropped Starc, Lyon and Hazelwood right in it. Ultimately, they have some throughly unlikable men in their team and have brazenly tried to cheat. Taking a foreign object into the field to try and alter the condition of the ball and then try and cover it up on the field is not a foolish one off incident. It is systemic. Smith’s position is untenable and I suspect he will miss at least 6 months cricket. Lehman will also lose his job. I cannot imagine this happening if Langer or Gillespie were in charge. I have no idea why Warner was VC in the first instance. If Lyon, Starc or Hazelwood we’re involved then they will be banned to and will be out of the running for the captaincy.
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Captain Jayho
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Post by Captain Jayho on Mar 27, 2018 1:14:10 GMT
The whole thing has been amazing and it just reminds you that Australian sporting culture is really quite weird sometimes. They really do take the 'play hard but play fair' thing extremely seriously. It's amazing to see ex-player after ex-player plus people from other sports and politicians just lining up to absolutely pan the Aussie team for this. I honestly don't think that if this had happened in England the reaction would have been anywhere near this volcanic. I'm not saying that whoever did it wouldn't have been roundly condemned and thought worthy of firing etc but I don't think there would be quite this depth of outrage. It says a lot about how Australia thinks of itself as a sporting country I think. Because from the outside you would think that Australia have always massively pushed the boundaries when given half a chance that being hypercompetitive is just part of the values of sport (I mean I have taken more abuse on cricket fields from Aussies than anyone else etc) - but there's clearly an idea that what is done within the laws and outside the laws are 2 different things. I almost feel a bit sorry Smith here - most mass muderers would get a better press! Clearly what he's done is terrible and he deserves to face the consequences but this is heads on pikes stuff. They did cheat and it is terrible and they clearly deserve to be banned/sacked etc. But somehow the reaction to it has left me feeling slightly the other way. I mean, let's be honest, Atherton was caught doing exactly this 20 odd years ago and nearly every side has been caught doing some variant of this at some point (which one assumes were equally pre-planned) and I remember gentle mockery and general 'down with this sort of thing'. But this is something else and of course the penalty itself is only 5 runs! This is going to have serious legs to it - it could end up with the destruction of this particular Australian side. There are obviously some pretty gross parts of this too - not least the obvious setting-up of a young player by getting Bancroft to do it etc. But in some ways it was the way they just brazenly owned up to it afterwards which seems to have particularly damned them in this instance. Plus the obvious - how on earth did they think they were ever going to get away with it? Particularly in such a bad tempered series like this in which TV producers would be having camera on nearly everything for the chance of another story. It's been a bizarre few weeks. I do wonder if the Aussies have just lost their minds under the stick they're getting and their anger at Rabada not getting banned and got it into their heads that there was some odd form of justice in doing this. As soon as I saw the look on Smiths face when the umpires were talking to Bancroft, I knew Smith was in on it. There are a number of factors that make this worse than the dirt in the pocket stuff in my opinion. The Aussie team are really hard to like. The coach really went for Broad a few years ago and then had the nerve to bleat about unfair treatment in South Africa. Lyon talked about ending careers Before the ashes. The way they went after Rabada was out of order. Smith setting himself up as a guardian of the game and making it clear that he felt he should have been consulted with after the ban was overturned. Has anyone heard Warner talking about the du plessis ball tampering a few years ago? Basically said the rules are there for a reason and we’d never stoop so low. They’re massive hypocrites. They asked for stump mics to be turned down so no one could hear them going after the South Africans then again, had the nerve to complain when South Africa reacted. Smith got the youngest guy in the team to ball tamper. He was also really stupid when fronting up to the press. This stuff about it being the leadership team may have been him trying to protect Warner but he has dropped Starc, Lyon and Hazelwood right in it. Ultimately, they have some throughly unlikable men in their team and have brazenly tried to cheat. Taking a foreign object into the field to try and alter the condition of the ball and then try and cover it up on the field is not a foolish one off incident. It is systemic. Smith’s position is untenable and I suspect he will miss at least 6 months cricket. Lehman will also lose his job. I cannot imagine this happening if Langer or Gillespie were in charge. I have no idea why Warner was VC in the first instance. If Lyon, Starc or Hazelwood we’re involved then they will be banned to and will be out of the running for the captaincy. Totally agree with all this. They set themselves up for this massively over the last few years with their attitude, behaviour and commentary. Lehman and Warner have always been rogues - no idea how they were allowed into positions of authority. CA really need to have a look at the way they dish out leadership positions because the fish rots from the head. I am guessing here but I suspect Smith was a little led by Lehman and Warner but clearly if that was the case he should have stood up - so not that much sympathy. The same could be said for anyone in the dressing room as I'm guessing this was an open secret. This is a good article by a recently retired first class Australian cricketer which suggests the difference between what has occurred here and many other incidents that have been cited. Interesting to hear it from a player perspective. www.theage.com.au/sport/cricket/the-secret-cricketer-why-the-ball-tampering-scandal-has-stunned-australian-players-20180326-p4z6cc.html
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Peter Parker
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Post by Peter Parker on Mar 27, 2018 5:32:26 GMT
The whole thing has been amazing and it just reminds you that Australian sporting culture is really quite weird sometimes. They really do take the 'play hard but play fair' thing extremely seriously. It's amazing to see ex-player after ex-player plus people from other sports and politicians just lining up to absolutely pan the Aussie team for this. I honestly don't think that if this had happened in England the reaction would have been anywhere near this volcanic. I'm not saying that whoever did it wouldn't have been roundly condemned and thought worthy of firing etc but I don't think there would be quite this depth of outrage. It says a lot about how Australia thinks of itself as a sporting country I think. Because from the outside you would think that Australia have always massively pushed the boundaries when given half a chance that being hypercompetitive is just part of the values of sport (I mean I have taken more abuse on cricket fields from Aussies than anyone else etc) - but there's clearly an idea that what is done within the laws and outside the laws are 2 different things. I almost feel a bit sorry Smith here - most mass muderers would get a better press! Clearly what he's done is terrible and he deserves to face the consequences but this is heads on pikes stuff. They did cheat and it is terrible and they clearly deserve to be banned/sacked etc. But somehow the reaction to it has left me feeling slightly the other way. I mean, let's be honest, Atherton was caught doing exactly this 20 odd years ago and nearly every side has been caught doing some variant of this at some point (which one assumes were equally pre-planned) and I remember gentle mockery and general 'down with this sort of thing'. But this is something else and of course the penalty itself is only 5 runs! This is going to have serious legs to it - it could end up with the destruction of this particular Australian side. There are obviously some pretty gross parts of this too - not least the obvious setting-up of a young player by getting Bancroft to do it etc. But in some ways it was the way they just brazenly owned up to it afterwards which seems to have particularly damned them in this instance. Plus the obvious - how on earth did they think they were ever going to get away with it? Particularly in such a bad tempered series like this in which TV producers would be having camera on nearly everything for the chance of another story. It's been a bizarre few weeks. I do wonder if the Aussies have just lost their minds under the stick they're getting and their anger at Rabada not getting banned and got it into their heads that there was some odd form of justice in doing this. As soon as I saw the look on Smiths face when the umpires were talking to Bancroft, I knew Smith was in on it. There are a number of factors that make this worse than the dirt in the pocket stuff in my opinion. The Aussie team are really hard to like. The coach really went for Broad a few years ago and then had the nerve to bleat about unfair treatment in South Africa. Lyon talked about ending careers Before the ashes. The way they went after Rabada was out of order. Smith setting himself up as a guardian of the game and making it clear that he felt he should have been consulted with after the ban was overturned. Has anyone heard Warner talking about the du plessis ball tampering a few years ago? Basically said the rules are there for a reason and we’d never stoop so low. They’re massive hypocrites. They asked for stump mics to be turned down so no one could hear them going after the South Africans then again, had the nerve to complain when South Africa reacted. Smith got the youngest guy in the team to ball tamper. He was also really stupid when fronting up to the press. This stuff about it being the leadership team may have been him trying to protect Warner but he has dropped Starc, Lyon and Hazelwood right in it. Ultimately, they have some throughly unlikable men in their team and have brazenly tried to cheat. Taking a foreign object into the field to try and alter the condition of the ball and then try and cover it up on the field is not a foolish one off incident. It is systemic. Smith’s position is untenable and I suspect he will miss at least 6 months cricket. Lehman will also lose his job. I cannot imagine this happening if Langer or Gillespie were in charge. I have no idea why Warner was VC in the first instance. If Lyon, Starc or Hazelwood we’re involved then they will be banned to and will be out of the running for the captaincy. Its possiblr the whole leadership grohp were in on it, but i am sure most of us think that is unlikely as surely someone would have said no youd think even if Smith still went off and did it. Smith didnt have the guts to take the fall himself and has tried to throw as many people under the bus as possible
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RiversGas
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Post by RiversGas on Mar 27, 2018 9:42:37 GMT
This is like Christmas has come early over here. Amazing. Sad for cricket but seriously, somebody pinch me. They are eating each other from the inside out over here. Can't agree more Captain. Queensland Sheffield Shield Champions yet again. Hip Hip Hooray. And who is the first on the plane to South Africa to replace (oh they haven't decided yet exactly who he is replacing) Smith, because he is currently the only one stood down, Matthew Renshaw, an opener, and an Englishman.
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Captain Jayho
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Post by Captain Jayho on Mar 27, 2018 10:43:37 GMT
This is like Christmas has come early over here. Amazing. Sad for cricket but seriously, somebody pinch me. They are eating each other from the inside out over here. Can't agree more Captain. Queensland Sheffield Shield Champions yet again. Hip Hip Hooray. And who is the first on the plane to South Africa to replace (oh they haven't decided yet exactly who he is replacing) Smith, because he is currently the only one stood down, Matthew Renshaw, an opener, and an Englishman. However in bad news it's no longer really acceptable or desirable to persist with the line that Steve Smith is actually an Englishman!
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warehamgas
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Post by warehamgas on Mar 27, 2018 14:04:23 GMT
This is like Christmas has come early over here. Amazing. Sad for cricket but seriously, somebody pinch me. They are eating each other from the inside out over here. Can't agree more Captain. Queensland Sheffield Shield Champions yet again. Hip Hip Hooray. And who is the first on the plane to South Africa to replace (oh they haven't decided yet exactly who he is replacing) Smith, because he is currently the only one stood down, Matthew Renshaw, an opener, and an Englishman. Interesting. As a Somerset member I have been watching their website to see what their response will be with Cameron Bancroft due in Taunton soon. Somerset have bought themselves some time to consider the legal position and this man’s name, Matt Renshaw came up as a possible replacement for CB if Somerset decide to dispense with him. Time will tell I guess.
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warehamgas
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Post by warehamgas on Mar 27, 2018 14:13:51 GMT
My views for what they are worth: 1. The Australians have been working their way to something like this for ages. They are at the centre of most public spats in cricket over the past 10 years. Other nations have their arguments and occasional back page story but it is Australia who have had the obvious clashes with England but also with India and others. I think they believe themselves to be untouchable and that they can do what they like. David Warner has been bullying other players from other teams for years and no Australian captain has been able to contain him. He seems to have no limits on his behaviour. Cricket Australia, individual Australian captains have ignored what has been happening on the pitch and when it has blown up they laugh it off with macho comments. Even Michael Clarke who has come out strongly against SS was just as bad when he abused and threatened James Anderson 4 years ago. The ICC seem incapable of acting against such on field or off field behaviour. They have accepted it. This has led Australia to believe they can do what they want. When other teams have tried to fight fire with fire such as in this test when the SA crowd gave Warner’s wife and family some grief he comes out and complains. I do not condone families being abused but Warner needs to realise that his on field and off field bullying has implications. Did you see the twitter spat between Michael Vaughan and Mrs Warner, I think MV came out on top. (It’s on the BBC website for cricket). And in the end what right has David Warner to start saying what the boundaries for decent or acceptable behaviour is or isn’t.
2. This incident was premeditated and organised and was not an off the cuff incident that happened in the heat of the moment. It was planned amongst this “leadership” group, was basically a conspiracy to cheat and get an unfair advantage through unfair means. It was a conspiracy, organised in the dressing room and not a reaction to on the field cricket. For that Smith, Warner ( captain and vice captain) and anyone else in this leadership group should be banned from test cricket for a long time. That won’t happen but it should.
3. Steve Smith has shown himself up to be a poor example of a captain. He has basically in his press conference with Bancroft not accepted responsibility and spread the blame to this leadership group. In my mind the captain is responsible for all on field behaviour and as such it is his fault and his responsibility totally. So now instead of shouldering the blame he has implicated many others in this conspiracy to cheat. That will make his leadership impossible and without any credibility. That the youngest and most inexperienced player was left to do the dirty leaves me speechless. I don’t condone Cameron Bancroft at all but Smith is the principal culprit. Bancroft has come over as a stupid young man lacking maturity and judgement and lacking any realisation of the importance of what he was about to do. You can blame that on youth but that would be an excuse. I understand that Mitchel Starc is fuming because he claims to have known nothing about it all and yet the implication was that he was a part of this leadership group. I guess there is a lot more yet to come out about it.
4. The role of Darren Lehmann, the coach needs consideration. When Stuart Broad didn’t walk some years ago Lehmann went on the offensive and promised him a hot re+epitomises in Oz. Which he got! Yet he stated earlier on this week that the SA crowds were abusing the Australians and there should be action against them. As ever the Australians like to give it out but don’t like it back. Was Lehmann part of this leadership group, I can’t believe he wasn’t.
5. My son in Australia was saying how badly this is playing out in Australia. We were having an email conversation to and fro on Saturday and CricketAustralia he thinks are going to act quite strongly esp after the PM of Australia became involved.
So overall the repercussions to this could be enormous. The ICC, Cricket Australia will have to act strongly. Australia have been leading up to this for years and believed they could do what they liked. Smith thought all be had to do on Saturday was go on TV say he was sorry and that was that. He was apologising for getting caught not for doing it. He must have been stupid, as they all were, to think that the TV cameras would not see someone doing what they did. How did they think they would get away with it? They have been winding people up for years hoping for a reaction that would get caught by the stump microphone and get their opponents into trouble. Yet they thought they could get away with such blatant cheating because they thought they were untouchable. Any problems with an opponent they just set bully boy Warner on to them. I think this is what they mean by karma or to take a biblical metaphor, you reap what you sow.
Sorry to go on, rant over. As you can see I am very angry about what they have done. They are in a very privileged position playing cricket and they have abused that position.
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Captain Jayho
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Post by Captain Jayho on Mar 27, 2018 21:51:42 GMT
Can't believe Lehmann has been given a get out of jail card. Ridiculous.
Warner now being ostracised by the rest of the team though. Chickens coming home to roost.
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Captain Jayho
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Post by Captain Jayho on Mar 28, 2018 10:51:29 GMT
Now admitted it was sandpaper not tape. The confession was pretty much a total web of lies. Can't take any part of it as the truth seemingly.
IPL and counties should dump them so they can only play grade cricket. Doubt that will happen though - no doubt the counties will roll out the welcome mat as usual.
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Peter Parker
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Post by Peter Parker on Mar 28, 2018 10:57:25 GMT
Now admitted it was sandpaper not tape. The confession was pretty much a total web of lies. Can't take any part of it as the truth seemingly. IPL and counties should dump them so they can only play grade cricket. Doubt that will happen though - no doubt the counties will roll out the welcome mat as usual. Smith and Warner 12 month ban and Bancroft 9 months from Cricket Australia.
More notable though was Warner will not be considered for any leadership positions in future,
So presumably Smith can
Personally I don't think Warner will ever play for Australia again
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Captain Jayho
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Post by Captain Jayho on Mar 28, 2018 13:06:43 GMT
Now admitted it was sandpaper not tape. The confession was pretty much a total web of lies. Can't take any part of it as the truth seemingly. IPL and counties should dump them so they can only play grade cricket. Doubt that will happen though - no doubt the counties will roll out the welcome mat as usual. Smith and Warner 12 month ban and Bancroft 9 months from Cricket Australia.
More notable though was Warner will not be considered for any leadership positions in future,
So presumably Smith can
Personally I don't think Warner will ever play for Australia again
Only banned from state and international cricket though. Not that CA have jurisdiction elsewhere of course. You are right about Warner. No-one in his own team wants to go near him so hard to see a way back. Good batsman and fielder but a very ordinary human being.
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irishrover
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Post by irishrover on Mar 28, 2018 15:16:35 GMT
Smith and Warner 12 month ban and Bancroft 9 months from Cricket Australia.
More notable though was Warner will not be considered for any leadership positions in future,
So presumably Smith can
Personally I don't think Warner will ever play for Australia again
Only banned from state and international cricket though. Not that CA have jurisdiction elsewhere of course. You are right about Warner. No-one in his own team wants to go near him so hard to see a way back. Good batsman and fielder but a very ordinary human being. That's pretty draconian stuff though for an offence the ICC doesn't even see as Level 1 and for which they received as official 1 game ban. It shows the nerve that this has hit in Australian sporting culture. I agree that this Aussie side is hard to like but then so are quite a lot of the England team to be honest. Anderson's exchange with Yuvraj a few years back (do not doubt that most Indian cricket fans think English players are cheating scumbags to a man because of this and jellybean gate etc), Broad's constant pushing of boundaries with umpires for which he gets far less stick than he should, Stokes discipline issues on and off the pitch etc etc. The SA team have also not exactly comported themselves with decency during this series. Cricket has a big issue all round as far as I can see - and it would be nice to think that something like this would have a substantial ripple effect.
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warehamgas
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Post by warehamgas on Mar 28, 2018 17:24:46 GMT
Smith and Warner 12 month ban and Bancroft 9 months from Cricket Australia.
More notable though was Warner will not be considered for any leadership positions in future,
So presumably Smith can
Personally I don't think Warner will ever play for Australia again
Only banned from state and international cricket though. Not that CA have jurisdiction elsewhere of course. You are right about Warner. No-one in his own team wants to go near him so hard to see a way back. Good batsman and fielder but a very ordinary human being. I thought, and I may be wrong, that CA (and any other Cricket national body) have to issue a Non Objection Certificate for every Australian player playing overseas. So they have to give permission for players to play in the IPL and other competitions. I was presuming the 9 month ban on Cameron Bancroft would mean that he would not be able to play for Somerset. They are not surely going to give permission for him to play overseas when saying he isn’t fit to play for Australia. That would be just crazy. If that’s not the case it switches the decision back to Somerset to decide rather than relying on CA to decide. A lot of late night meetings in Taunton today and tomorrow then!
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irishrover
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Post by irishrover on Mar 28, 2018 19:02:56 GMT
Only banned from state and international cricket though. Not that CA have jurisdiction elsewhere of course. You are right about Warner. No-one in his own team wants to go near him so hard to see a way back. Good batsman and fielder but a very ordinary human being. I thought, and I may be wrong, that CA (and any other Cricket national body) have to issue a Non Objection Certificate for every Australian player playing overseas. So they have to give permission for players to play in the IPL and other competitions. I was presuming the 9 month ban on Cameron Bancroft would mean that he would not be able to play for Somerset. They are not surely going to give permission for him to play overseas when saying he isn’t fit to play for Australia. That would be just crazy. If that’s not the case it switches the decision back to Somerset to decide rather than relying on CA to decide. A lot of late night meetings in Taunton today and tomorrow then! I think that's exactly what they are doing - I imagine the players involved could sue them for some form of restraint of trade otherwise (after all the international body has not banned them). Somerset have a very difficult decision to make here. On the one hand they don't want to be seen on the wrong side of this but on the other hand it could do a lot of damage to their season as it's unikely they'd be able to find anything like the same calibre of overseas player at such short notice.
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warehamgas
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Post by warehamgas on Mar 28, 2018 21:25:39 GMT
Interestingly irish, when it first arose at the weekend the overwhelming body of opinion was that he shouldn’t come and when thinking about a replacement the name Matt Renshaw was being mentioned by several Somerset supporters, the player now replacing Bancroft in South Africa. Now that CA have made their decision over the suspensions which has been mirrored by the IPL in regard to Smith and Warner I don’t think Somerset have any choice other than to support CA by cancelling or suspending the contract. To do so will maintain the idea of a cricket and world wide common response to the incident. Yes it will give Somerset a headache to get a replacement but I think self-interest has to come pretty low down the list of considerations and ultimately I’d be pretty sure the guys head can’t/won’t be in the right place to come here, into what will be a fairly hostile environment (yes I know I’m talking about Taunton but even so!!). A hard but correct decision made now will save a season of excuses, embarrassment, of officials trying to defend an indefensible position and a possibly divided dressing room. And when you say about a damaged start of the season for Somerset irish, I think either way now it’s damaged so I guess it’s deciding which option is likely to cause the least damage. But as I said self-interest has to be low down on the list of considerations.
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irishrover
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Post by irishrover on Mar 28, 2018 21:36:03 GMT
Interestingly irish, when it first arose at the weekend the overwhelming body of opinion was that he shouldn’t come and when thinking about a replacement the name Matt Renshaw was being mentioned by several Somerset supporters, the player now replacing Bancroft in South Africa. Now that CA have made their decision over the suspensions which has been mirrored by the IPL in regard to Smith and Warner I don’t think Somerset have any choice other than to support CA by cancelling or suspending the contract. To do so will maintain the idea of a cricket and world wide common response to the incident. Yes it will give Somerset a headache to get a replacement but I think self-interest has to come pretty low down the list of considerations and ultimately I’d be pretty sure the guys head can’t/won’t be in the right place to come here, into what will be a fairly hostile environment (yes I know I’m talking about Taunton but even so!!). A hard but correct decision made now will save a season of excuses, embarrassment, of officials trying to defend an indefensible position and a possibly divided dressing room. And when you say about a damaged start of the season for Somerset irish, I think either way now it’s damaged so I guess it’s deciding which option is likely to cause the least damage. But as I said self-interest has to be low down on the list of considerations. Yes I think that's probably true. Of the 3 of them Bancroft (oddly) seems to be considered least culpable in this. But I think once IPL bans came in as well it's hard to see how anyone would want to buck the global trend here. It would look terrible and it's hard to see Somerset fans happily accepting that decision.
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