irishrover
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Post by irishrover on May 3, 2017 22:40:17 GMT
A thread for the maximum 3/4 people in the universe (and possibly only me) who fit bang in the middle of the Venn diagram of county cricket fans-vaguely competent internet users-gasheads.
To my great annoyance I haven't actually managed to get to a game this season so I'll kick off with traditional season opening generic moan about the schedule. 1)14 Championship games is terrible 2)From a selfish point of view I do not like the change in scheduling them over the week - if you play cricket as I do then it makes it very difficult to carve out the time to go without utterly alienating your loved ones 3)too many early and late games and hardly any in high summer which is very disappointing and largely unnecessary I think. 4)Silly time to schedule One Day Cup too.
Missed the Somerset game at Old Trafford as I was on holiday which is a shame because it looks like it was the game of the season so far. Up here they are talking about the resurgence of Davies which could have a major impact on Lancs prospects. Plus Livingstone seems to be slowly getting nudged forward as the next cab off the rank for England although I can only really see him being an ODI player. But that result rather typified a very slow Somerset start although they seem to be getting it together in the One Day Cup.
Gloucs have been as up and down as you would expect a team to be that has a potent seam bowling lineup but very little batting that can be consistently relied upon.
Before the season I liked Somerset's chances of winning the thing this year - now I don't. So my (admittedly now heavily biased predictions) are Surrey to win the title (although I bloody hope they don't) with Notts and Kent to get promoted and, in the latter's case, undo an injustice because they should have been promoted last year at Hampshire's expense when the Durham fiasco happened. It's almost like Hampshire have an owner who knows all the right people......I think Div 1 relegation will be an almighty battle this year and I'm not even going to suggest a name really - could be anyone because the parity is high in that league but I flippin want Hampshire to go down. |
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jackthegas
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Post by jackthegas on May 5, 2017 14:03:21 GMT
Hello Irish. I think I fall somewhere into your Venn diagram.
I have seen some cricket live this season. I went to my local ground, New Road for day 2 of Worcester Northants a few weekends ago. It was fantastic. I watched something like 25 wickets fall during the day in a 20 run win for the home side in a game that finished at around 7.30pm.
The wicket was pretty up and down, well mainly down actually, as you can imagine given the number of wickets that fell. Joe Leach the Worcester captain promoted both himself and the massive Australian John Hastings to 4 and 5 in a move that felt more befitting of a Sunday XI than a first class fixture. I am still perplexed. Leach scored at more than a run a ball and gave his wicket softly by trying to score quickly but Hastings was really circumspect. It was all very odd and I think Worcester won despite the move not because of it.
My personal highlight was watching Andy Carter bat in the first innings. There aren't may proper number 11s left in the country but his batting has regressed to the point that he is very nearly a number 12. Still a decent bowler mind, although his approach to the crease isn’t as fluid as it was before his injury problems.
Worcester have a good batting line up and in Ben Cox have something of a throwback behind the stumps. He's a terrific keeper and moderate batsman. Leach is good leader of men and of the bowling attack but the key to their success or otherwise this season will be their support bowling. Nathan Lyon is a good signing as Brett D’Oliviera is a bits and pieces cricketer really. If the youngsters Tounge and Barndard can find some consistency then Worcester could finish in the top 3, but I suspect they will finish mid-table.
I’ve backed Kent for promotion for the last 2 seasons I think so I will stick with them on the basis that a stopped clock is right twice a day. Notts should win the league. First division is wide open. Any of them could win it I think and there are lots of home grown players which is good. On the other hand the numbers of Kolpaks has increased which is less good.
The ECB is in the process of destroying the First class game in England. By 2020 50 over cricket will be played at the same time as the new 20 over monstrosity. The blast will be pushed to the margins and I would imagine we will be playing 3 divisions of 6 in the County Championship. You can already see Division 3 developing – Leicester, Glamorgan, Derby, Gloucester and Northants weaker than Kent, Notts, Durham, Sussex and Worcester this season I would think.
It’s a shame because the BBC and Cricinfo have done a great job of promoting the Championship and the ECB and clubs seem to be getting better at using social media to share highlights and even fixed camera live coverage online. Look at the number of hits that the BBC website had over the opening weeks of the season and it makes you think that there is a clear demand for a weekly highlights package on terrestrial TV along the lines of a low budget Match of the Day.
And then you get daft scheduling like having only 2 fixtures over the May bank holiday….
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warehamgas
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Post by warehamgas on May 5, 2017 22:36:44 GMT
Thanks for starting this irish, have just got back from Oz so last day been a bit jet lagged! Like you I'm smack bang in the middle of the venn diagram but feel that watching cricket is a more enjoyable experience than watchng football at times. The sense of hope and exhilaration last year when I thought on the last day that, at last, we might be going to win the championship was great, only to go to the other extreme after Yorkshire and Middlesex contrived a result for themselves. I agree with much of what you say but haven't seen any cricket yet but am going on Wednesday to see us against Hampshire. Seems strange to say that barring a total collapse (and that often happens with Somerset!) we should be guaranteed a home quarter final already in this competition. This is a difference from our batting in the Championship where poor Tom Abel can't buy a run and we have made our usual start of losing the first two games. Although losing to Essex and Lancs they were both matches we should have won esp after two excellent first days. We could have been top now we are bottom! With all the teams in this division I think many are vulnerable to relegation because it is so close esp now they have made it smaller. I can't imagine many other leagues where a quarter of the teams are relegated at the end.
Like you jack, I have been really angry with the way the ECB are running the game and their seemingly obsession with this 20/20 city franchise.
Anyway, like you irish I will share my rants with you and what I haven't liked:
1. Why have they changed the size of the divisions? Have thought this since they announced it a year ago. Apart from the fact that my Somerset season ticket has remained the same price and I will get 4 days less cricket I do not see the reasoning behind this. Having now retired I have seen most of Somersets home matches in the last two years and a few away and the quality has been very high with it being highly competitive in division 1. I don't know about the quality in division 2 but from the results it looks as if there are some teams who struggle to score enough runs to take matches into a fourth day, jack you will know more about that, although you said the match you saw was pretty good. Most matches I've seen are closely contested. The benenefit of England can't be a reason because those players rarely play, except at the very beginning or at the end so that can't be a reason. I fear that clearing time in the schedule to timetable this 20/20 comp may be the reason.
2. The schedule is very strange apart from the two Championship matches in April and the 4 matches at the end in September it seem very bitty and Somerset only have two matches in the whole of the Summer holidays, mid July to August. This is the time when we need to be playing championship cricket. To have the 50 over comp over by July 1 means no final end finale at Lords although the 20 comp will replace that. I think that the ECB are slowly strangling the 4 day game with just fitting in matches where the one dayers aren't.
3. The way the ECB has prevaricated about this 20/20 franchise has been a reason i think that they have taken their eyes off the ball. Somerset will,clearly not be a part of this comp and I except that we don't have the stadium large enough to get the 15000 or so needed. It will be a large city competition with Leeds, Manchester, Nottingham, Birmingham, 2 London teams and possibly either Bristol or Southampton or a surprise team. I fear that the ECB will sell out to the highest bidder which will be Sky. The new comp will need to be on terrestrial TV, in other words BBC, ITV, Channels 4 or 5 so that the biggest audience can be got. I don't trust the ECB to do the right thing for the welfare of cricket. We will see.
4. I too dislike Hampshire because of what happened with the Durham fiasco. I ranted enough about that at the end of last season but I remain angry that the ECB acted as they did against Durham esp when they were only following the rules regarding applying for test matches. Perhaps if the ECB had given them a test match in Summer instead of late Spring thing she might have been better for them. When Durham came into the championship some time ago the ECB were determined to create a northern base for test cricket and Durham have only done what was expected. A few teams have had money problems and have been supported the ECB but only Durham have had relegation imposed on them. Am pretty sure it wouldn't have happened but for pressure from Hampshire and their rich benefactor. It seems to pay to have a rich owner with powerful friends. I've been to the Rose Bowl many times for Championship cricket and one of the best games to play if the cricket gets boring is to count the crowd. I've got to 60/70 a few times but rarely make the ton! Yet they still manage to get players in every year who must cost a bomb.
So without seeing any cricket yet I will try and make some predictions as you have Irish. In the Championship I think the winners will come from Surrey, unfortunately or Yorkshire. Despite their poorish start I think Yorkshire have the players to put in a challenge, although how they react to losing Jason Gillespie will be important. With only 8 teams I think most will be vulnerable to the drop but I suspect that the bottom two will come from Essex, Warwickshire, Hampshire and ourselves. I feel pretty pessimistic about Somersets batting, although our bowlers are very good and have proved devastating in conditions anywhere near helpful. Middlesex were champions but it wouldn't surprise me if they struggle this time around. In the 2nd division I would imagine Notts will win it easily with Kent, Northamptonshire or Worcestershire fighting for the second spot. Glamorgan, Leicester and even Gloucestershire seem to be struggling. I would love to see Gloucestershire do well but their batsmen seem to be struggling to put any decent score together.
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irishrover
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Post by irishrover on May 8, 2017 16:20:08 GMT
I think we're basically agreed on most of these points but that is to be expected because no sporting body disrespects and alienates its hard core supporters as much as the ECB does when it comes to county cricket.
I know there is a danger of sounding like a broken record on this but it is just infuriating. I will repeat again that I don't understand who the potential audience actually is for city based 20/20. There is this utter fantasy that they can recreate an English version of the Big Bash or IPL and it's just crap. First of all, like it or not, cricket simply has a more fundamental place in the sporting cultures of those 2 countries. Secondly, and I must bore people to death with this point but it remains quite critical, it gets bloody cold in England after 6/7 of most evenings even in high summer. The idea that there is a nice sweetspot period of 6 weeks where we get a balmy dusk is just rubbish! Shift it to the weekend afternoons you end up clashing with football one way or another - this has to be an evening thing in order to serve the ECB's purpose and anyone who has spent any time watching or playing cricket in the evening knows full well that the abiding feeling is of being freezing cold. Hardly the panacea for attracting the casual fan. Thirdly, the idea that the average potential cricket fan is going to be attracted by the 'big names' falls down when it becomes apparent that no one knows who those big names are anymore. So Chris Gayle may just about impinge on the public consciousness and he is a heaven sent PR manager's dream but even he may struggle to break through the apathy. As for everybody else - do any of them pass the name recognition down the pub test? So it is very aggrevating for those of us to whom county cricket brings joy to have it sacrificed at the altar of something you don't much like and looks to me like a major potential failure on its own terms. Not to mention the umpteenth messing about with the calendar. The optimist in me could perhaps see a situation where a 16 game Championship season is restored somewhere in the future alongside revenue raising T20 but it's probably a forlorn hope. I hope City based T20 dies on the vine.
From the point of view of someone who plays the game on a regular basis and is heavily involved in club cricket it's bloody obvious where the main issue is for domestic cricket - it's the almost complete failure of the ECB to convert people who are sufficiently passionate about the game to play it every weekend into equally passionate followers of the game. I honestly think that the majority of people that I play with and against on a Saturday could not tell you who won the county championship last year. The apathy towards the domestic game among these natural supporters is really striking and it's not a new thing - it's been that way for as long as I can remember. If some kind of focus was put into attracting these kind of people to attend more there could be a knock on effect from creating an army of cricketing evangelists. That's before we get to all the known issues around scheduling, free to air broadcasting etc.
Anyway - enough of that. I'll end with a comment on Worcestershire. I've always thought there's something quite unique about them - they seem to produce a lot of their own players or at least bring in players who then commit long term to the club. It seems like quite an insular cricket culture there which just constantly replicates itself and leads to them punching above their weight. They don't produce all that many England prospects but they always seem chock full of competent county performers who quietly get on with their job. Somehow I don't think someone as quirky as Adam Shantry would have had a look in with any other country for example. They seem very good at doing all the marginal things you need to do to compete if you don't have the money. It's interesting. I am hoping to attend my first game of the season on Friday - Lancashire vs Derbyshire at Stanley Park Blackpool. Work allowing I hope to be able to get along and I've never been before so that would be one to tick off the list! |
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warehamgas
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Post by warehamgas on May 11, 2017 21:39:44 GMT
Well despite losing to Hampshire it was quite an enjoyable match which had several interesting points. The innings by Rilee Rousseau was brilliant. I don't think I've seen a harder hit innings since Viv Richards in his prime. When he was out caught by another South African, the Somerset sub Johan Myburgh he couldn't believe it, he had hit it so hard that we were all looking to the boundary! Great catch but I don't think he had time to get out of the way! It was a chanceless innings and when you look at the scorecard you realise how unbalanced it was! Only Vince messed about for half an hour without looking safe. Despite looking so secure, Hampshire were so careful they nearly got themselves into trouble and we almost thought we were still in it when of course we weren't! All the best moments in the match came from South Africans batting from Rousseau, Elgar, Van de Meuvre and some good bowling from Groenewald which slowed Hampshire down. One of the worrying things in the match was of the 22 starters only 11, 6 from Somerset and 5 from Hampshire were qualified to play for England and this in a fairly mundane one day match which had little riding on it.
Somerset recovered from an awful first 10 balls and until Elgar and Van de Meuvre found themselves at the same end looked on for over 300 before stuttering to 249. I'm not sure that Hampshire wouldn't have got it with the way Rousseau played but when you get 300 the dynamics of a game and the mindset of the players changes. Big crowd on a Wednesday in May when children are at school helped create a good atmosphere. When I'm in Taunton I don't have access to the internet so I was interested when I got home to read that Rousseau says Elgar was sledging him and this spurred him on. Don't know if it was good hearted, banter or if there's bad feeling there. I suppose both players will be eligible to play for South Africa when they tour later this Summer and if selected both Rousseau and Elgar look in good form.
There's something about the determination of South Africans that make them very hard competitors and as they always do well in England I think we can expect a very hard test series later this Summer.
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warehamgas
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Post by warehamgas on May 12, 2017 19:27:39 GMT
And a cracking win today in Bristol against Gloucestershire. Well done Somerset!
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irishrover
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Post by irishrover on May 15, 2017 15:52:01 GMT
Well despite losing to Hampshire it was quite an enjoyable match which had several interesting points. The innings by Rilee Rousseau was brilliant. I don't think I've seen a harder hit innings since Viv Richards in his prime. When he was out caught by another South African, the Somerset sub Johan Myburgh he couldn't believe it, he had hit it so hard that we were all looking to the boundary! Great catch but I don't think he had time to get out of the way! It was a chanceless innings and when you look at the scorecard you realise how unbalanced it was! Only Vince messed about for half an hour without looking safe. Despite looking so secure, Hampshire were so careful they nearly got themselves into trouble and we almost thought we were still in it when of course we weren't! All the best moments in the match came from South Africans batting from Rousseau, Elgar, Van de Meuvre and some good bowling from Groenewald which slowed Hampshire down. One of the worrying things in the match was of the 22 starters only 11, 6 from Somerset and 5 from Hampshire were qualified to play for England and this in a fairly mundane one day match which had little riding on it. Somerset recovered from an awful first 10 balls and until Elgar and Van de Meuvre found themselves at the same end looked on for over 300 before stuttering to 249. I'm not sure that Hampshire wouldn't have got it with the way Rousseau played but when you get 300 the dynamics of a game and the mindset of the players changes. Big crowd on a Wednesday in May when children are at school helped create a good atmosphere. When I'm in Taunton I don't have access to the internet so I was interested when I got home to read that Rousseau says Elgar was sledging him and this spurred him on. Don't know if it was good hearted, banter or if there's bad feeling there. I suppose both players will be eligible to play for South Africa when they tour later this Summer and if selected both Rousseau and Elgar look in good form. There's something about the determination of South Africans that make them very hard competitors and as they always do well in England I think we can expect a very hard test series later this Summer. Well if it was sledging then that one backfired a bit! Probably a bit like Viv in that respect too - best to shut up and say nothing or risk the onslaught. Robert Croft tells a decent after dinner anecdote about what happened when bang average Somerset spinning journeyman A R K Pierson tried to sledge Viv on the last day of a meaningless draw at St Helens one day. I'm sure it must be on Youtube somewhere - needlessly to say it ends up with the ball being deposited onto the beach a number of times in the subsequent overs.... I though Elgar was one of those who had jacked in South Africa because he could make more money playing county cricket. Am I wrong? If so, who is Somerset's replacement overseas player? Gloucester had Somerset in quite a bit of trouble early on in the 'derby' by the look of it but couldn't press home and then showed the weakness of their batting again. I wonder if teams are finally learning that if you get Klinger there's not a lot left although Jack Taylor continues to deliver - I'm not sure there's a more consistent late order white ball thumper in the country. He always seems to come through. Easy win for Somerset there though they'll disappointed with the Essex result which puts them under a bit of pressure now for qualification I think. I'm still being thwarted in my attempts to break my duck for the year in watching cricket. Wanted to go to Blackpool on Friday but saw the weather forecast and thought better of it - good decision I think cos they were on and off all day and I can't imagine cover was great at the outground. Looks like same issue might scupper me tomorrow (Yorkshire v Leicester day nighter - getting desperate!) and Friday (1st day of Roses match at Old Trafford - proper cricket and I've never been to one so am quite desperate to get to at least a day, forecast prospects typically Mancunian sadly). Bloody North! However, I did watch the closing stages of Notts v Durham from Trent Bridge last week on TV. What a superb innings that was from Paul Collingwood. When I turned it on they needed about 9/10 an over with 15 to go and 5 wickets down and Collingwood just paced the run chase absolutely perfectly. It was just brilliant cricket. There were some World Class shots played as well. It wasn't wham-bam (although there were 6's hit) - it was more precision cricket, findings gaps, putting pressure on fielders, always selecting the right choice of shot in the situation etc. Superb stuff and that was against an attach of Broad, Ball, Gurney and Pattinson. It was a mini-classic and reminded me how much I like the guy - his reputation will always be that of a punchy gritty but quite ugly fighter who punched above his weight at international level. I think that's harsh - I think he had a lot more quality and ability as a batmen than he is ever given true credit for. He reminded me why he has been one of my favourite cricketers of the last 15 years. Final note. I know it's a bit off topic but while I haven't been watching I have definitely been playing and I had quite an extraordinary experience playing on Saturday. We were playing away at a good side who play miles away halfway between Blackburn and Bolton. I was skipper and I didn't have either of our 2 usual opening bowlers (and we are a bowling side really6 so that was a huge loss). Restricted them to a good but potentially gettable 227-5 in 45 on a very good wicket. Then our top order fell apart and we scored far too slowly in trying to rebuild. All the conversations in the pavillion were about what we needed to do to secure bonus points etc and achieve a respectable defeat (which I'd have happily taken at nearly every point during the game) but then in comes our Number 7 who was only called up from the 3rd team in an emergency the day before. We needed 14 an over off the last 9 when he went in and proceeded to smash 67 off 30 balls and we won the match with an over to spare. Never seen anything quite like it in 20 odd years of playing league cricket! |
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warehamgas
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Post by warehamgas on May 15, 2017 18:46:19 GMT
Yes it sounds as if the sledging backfired if it actually was that. Mind you he hasn't scored much since so perhaps he wants someone to sledge him again. Again I might be wrong but am pretty sure Elgar is our overseas player and so might be chosen by SA later on this summer. I'm sure that Somerset has qualified already for the quarter finals of the one day cup irrespective of what happens now. It's a bit different this year I think, the top team in the area leagues go straight into the semi finals and the other three teams or six play off for the right to play them. A bit complicated and by losing to Essex it means that Somerset are unlikely to be top and will need to play an extra match to get there. Either way it all seems a bit this and that but at least there seems to have been some very good matches all over in this competition. Some of the stats have been extraordinary, Hampshire in their last 3 matches have had players score 150 odd, 170 and 153 and yet have only won 1 of them! The ability to chase big scores seems to be so much better than it was, even in your case!
I stopped playing a few years ago now but I would never have imagined players being able to copy what the big names do the. I opened in Somerset village cricket for some years but would never have foreseen the level of aggression we see now. As a player, do the players you play with copy and consciously try and do what they see on the IPL or whatever? Or is it more "haymaker" style hitting?
I'm looking forward to Friday and my first 4 day match of the year against Warwickshire and already it's a bottom of the table match and will probably mean a "must win" performance. It's funny what you said about Michael Klinger and his importance to Gloucestershire. He has always scored runs against us and we've always known how good he is so to get him out cheaply last week was a good sign and once he'd gone I somehow knew we would win but whilst he was there I had my doubts. Essex could be a bit of a surprise team this year. With the ECB saying Cook can play for them until July I think it gives them a real chance of success, one they might not have had had he been captain still or if the schedule had been different. Strange how it works out.
I haven't seen much of the IPL this year, just a few minutes here and there but I have followed the results and the scorecards and it's been a real surprise to see Bangalore at the bottom and not qualifying. With Gayle and Kohli I would have expected more. Gayle hasn't played all the matches so whether he's carrying a slight injury I don't know. He's not been picked up for our domestic 20/20 so far but with it being later I don't know if it coincides with the West Indies version.
So, irish is your cricket league or just friendlies, it sounds as if you get around with it?
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irishrover
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Post by irishrover on May 18, 2017 2:08:47 GMT
Yes it sounds as if the sledging backfired if it actually was that. Mind you he hasn't scored much since so perhaps he wants someone to sledge him again. Again I might be wrong but am pretty sure Elgar is our overseas player and so might be chosen by SA later on this summer. I'm sure that Somerset has qualified already for the quarter finals of the one day cup irrespective of what happens now. It's a bit different this year I think, the top team in the area leagues go straight into the semi finals and the other three teams or six play off for the right to play them. A bit complicated and by losing to Essex it means that Somerset are unlikely to be top and will need to play an extra match to get there. Either way it all seems a bit this and that but at least there seems to have been some very good matches all over in this competition. Some of the stats have been extraordinary, Hampshire in their last 3 matches have had players score 150 odd, 170 and 153 and yet have only won 1 of them! The ability to chase big scores seems to be so much better than it was, even in your case! I stopped playing a few years ago now but I would never have imagined players being able to copy what the big names do the. I opened in Somerset village cricket for some years but would never have foreseen the level of aggression we see now. As a player, do the players you play with copy and consciously try and do what they see on the IPL or whatever? Or is it more "haymaker" style hitting? I'm looking forward to Friday and my first 4 day match of the year against Warwickshire and already it's a bottom of the table match and will probably mean a "must win" performance. It's funny what you said about Michael Klinger and his importance to Gloucestershire. He has always scored runs against us and we've always known how good he is so to get him out cheaply last week was a good sign and once he'd gone I somehow knew we would win but whilst he was there I had my doubts. Essex could be a bit of a surprise team this year. With the ECB saying Cook can play for them until July I think it gives them a real chance of success, one they might not have had had he been captain still or if the schedule had been different. Strange how it works out. I haven't seen much of the IPL this year, just a few minutes here and there but I have followed the results and the scorecards and it's been a real surprise to see Bangalore at the bottom and not qualifying. With Gayle and Kohli I would have expected more. Gayle hasn't played all the matches so whether he's carrying a slight injury I don't know. He's not been picked up for our domestic 20/20 so far but with it being later I don't know if it coincides with the West Indies version. So, irish is your cricket league or just friendlies, it sounds as if you get around with it? Ah - thanks for clarifying that. I hadn't realised how the system had changed for this year. I understand why they have done it this way (I believe it's similar to the IPL system). It means that most teams have a chance of qualifying till near the end so it keeps interest and relevance in the contest but at the same time gives a genuine benefit for continuing to play hard after you have secured qualification. So I suppose I get it but I can't help thinking that cricket could do with building in some simplicity - top 4 in each group goes into the quarter finals seems something everyone can get their head round. We could always bring back the knock out trophy (far too much fun - that had to go!) that was something that you could understand-win and through to next round, lose and you're out. No middle ground there.
Seen a bit more IPL than usual this year actually but I have difficulty getting very excited about it. I've no particular problem with the competition - fair enough if that's what Indian fans are into it seems reasonable to deliver it so I'm not a 'no to all T20 guy' but I have difficulty getting interested in a tournament between sides who change their composition nearly every year. For me the interesting thing about team sport is watching a side develop, make changes, tinker and try and get better relative to other teams etc. With IPL it's almost like they start from scratch every year with players redistributed outwards (I know it's not really like that but there is huge turnover of key players) and I find it hard to identify meaning in the games. I find it interesting that nearly all the people I know who are very into it (and they are nearly all either young Asian guys or originally from the Southern hemisphere) seem to be always emphasising the individual battles and achievements and not really talking about the teams. They seem to experience it as a whole series of personal contests, which of course is all cricket is when it comes down to it. But they talk far more about big 100s, massive 6's, wickets, catches etc. It's about moments and performances. They rarely talk in terms of 'big games' or team performances. I honestly don't think many of them are invested in the results of the games at all - I wonder if it's like that in India itself or if there is more partisan allegiance to teams.
I have finally managed to watch some cricket though! Yorkshire v Leicestershire. I was able to get the afternoon off work and go across the Pennines to Leeds. The weather was not fantastic but dry so I'll take that. Realised I hadn't been to Headingley for a few years - not a massive fan, it's quite an ugly ground and sightlines are pretty poor in many of the stands cos it's a funny shaped ground but always massively entertaining to listen to the old school Yorkshire fans nattering away around me. There is something about the collective wisdom of the Yorkshire membership that is very interesting. The game itself was a huge missed opportunity from Leicester who played pretty well but blew several opportunities to put themselves in a definitive winning position right to the very end. Yorkshire didn't play particularly well but, as seems often to be the case, they had a depth of talent that ultimately allowed them to sneak home. Yorks batted first and banged up 257 off their 45 (reduced for rain). They had a solid if unspectacular opening partnership between Lyth (who always looks good and scores runs when I watch them for some reason) and Lees (who looked out of knick). But just when it looked like they were positioning themselves for an assault on a monster score Leicester's very unheralded 2nd stringers caused a mini-collapse of a succession of distinctly out of form looking Yorks middle order batsmen and they were in a bit of trouble. But it helps having someone of Ballance's quality to come in at 5 and Azaam Rafiq smashed an impressive quick fire 50 odd to push the game in Yorkshire's favour. Great little cricket moment though - in penultimate over Ballance slipped while trying to smash it out the crowd and fell on his wicket so Ballance was out hit wicket because he lost his balance. Leicester then absolutely carted the Yorkshire seamer all over the park - Delport a South African import just tore into them and they were well ahead of the rate. But then the spinners came on and they just crumbled completely - the middle order fell away to the impressive Rafiq (great story he is turning out to be for Yorkshire) and the young left arm spinner Carver who also bowled extremely well. However, when the spinners ran out of overs the tail enders renewed the assault on the Yorkshire seamers (who were very young - they have a load missing right now) and came very close to stealing the win. In fact if Clint Mckay had kept his head when the run rate had dropped below 5 an over instead of trying to smash it out the ground then they may well have sneaked a famous win. I thought Yorkshire were a bit lucky and Leicester looked much better than I expected and, by the look of how things went today, missed a golden chance to get into the knock out stages. May go to Roses match on Friday if the weather is OK which it probably won't be.
My cricket up here is played in the Greater Manchester Cricket League. A recent invention formed out of the merger of a number of old fashioned closed leagues into a bigger pyramid structure (a bit like the WEPL). So it's serious league cricket - we play 45 Overs a side with 14 Over bowling limits in 12 team league where 3 go up and 3 go down every year. The 2nd XI I play for is good and plays a number of lower ranking club's 1st XI's which means we play against the occasional overseas or English professional which many clubs have up here. Most of the younger members of my team have played against Haseeb Hamid in Manchester junior cricket at some point. There's no doubt that the way the game is played has changed over the years. That is clearly down to the professional game having changed people's idea of what is possible. So I am 33 and have been playing club cricket since I was 8. In that time the evolution in the quality of wickets, general facilities and particularly the size and weight of bats have all made a big difference. When I started playing 150 was a very good score in most 40-50 Over games - now it would be beaten 90+% of the time. If you had a run rate of 7 an over or more you used to think that would be pretty challenging - now 10 an over makes you think you are in the game. Certainly in the case of the team I play for it is a function of a more aggressive way of playing - the guys I played with are 80% of Asian origin and, particularly people from Pakistan itself, tend to play the game very aggressively seeing very little value in defensive batting or bowling. That changes the perspective somewhat as well. Competition rules have also changed by tending to emphasise more attacking play. So there's a number of things but I don't think there's any doubt that the number 1 reason for the change in the way the game is played is because T20 has changed everyone's perception of what can be achieved with the bat.
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warehamgas
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Post by warehamgas on May 20, 2017 22:54:52 GMT
Interesting to get your take on the influence of the 20/20 irish. Having only seen minutes in total of the IPL and probably not going to the Somerset 20/20 matches means that I don't see much of it so not too qualified to have too many opinions. Having watched only about 30 odd overs on a rain affected two days at Taunton not sure I can say much about the Championship either! Yesterday morning when most of the play took place it was like watching the future of Somerset bowling for the next 10 years. Although they have both been regulars in the Somerset team Jamie Overton has had a lot of bad luck with injuries and in this match him and Craig Overton had spells bowling in tandem. They are impressive insofar as they have improved their accuracy and all the Warwickshire batsmen had difficulties although Trott with 50 had fewer. They've got the only 3 wickets to fall and Jamie's speed really had the batsmen looking uncomfortable. With only 2 South Africans, although Van de Merve is technically Dutch now, we had 9 of our team qualified to play for England and with all the rain it was very much English conditions. Not much else to say except the groundsmen earnt their wages with the covers coming on and off esp today when only about 6 overs were bowled.
I think the weather has put paid to a result in this match although being Somerset we could collapse twice easily enough! But Warwickshire haven't had the best of starts to the season and both counties are lacking confidence so far. A draw looks the most likely result which will increase the pressure on both teams. It's a shame because yesterday morning there was a decent crowd in looking forward to a days cricket, today there wasn't!
What tremendous form Alistair Cook is in and it's good to see him playing for Essex and scoring runs. I wonder if resigning the captaincy has given him a different attitude and allowed him to go back to batting in an unfettered way without all the pressures of being captain and having to deal with the press. I really liked him as captain and felt he did a good job but I thought that he wasn't a "natural" captain, it didn't come intuitively to him, he had to work at it and learn the art and even then he wasn't an imaginative captain. He took a fair bit of criticism but remained pretty calm esp when the Sky commentators really had a go about two years ago. I find cricket spectators to be one of the nicest groups of people I meet in watching sport and good conversation is easy to find. But the topic of Cook's captaincy is one of the rare times that I've had at cricket when I've disagreed with what someone else was saying. It was a good argument and I don't usually feel strongly enough about it to argue but on this occasion because of the rubbish being spouted I did. I feel that had their been a realistic alternative after Strauss Cook might not have been captain but I didn't consider Kevin Peterson a realistic alternative, the other gentleman did.
Being a pretty miserable day weatherwise reminded me of how really awful a rainy day at the cricket used to be. It's been the first really bad weather match I've been to for a number of years yet now the ground in Taunton with its coffee rooms and members facilities are so much better than they used to be. Awful weather but plenty of places to go and good conversation to be had despite everything. Also being smack bang in the middle of Taunton means you can go out into town and still come back to the ground in a matter of minutes. Something you can't do at some of these out of town sites.
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irishrover
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Post by irishrover on May 23, 2017 23:31:16 GMT
Yes - this week was a bit of damp squib really (or damp squid as Basel and I used to say on the original version of this forum which had an appropriate squid emoji thingy!). Not much really happened in the Championship. I would just like to say congratulations to Marcus Trescothick on breaking Gimblett's record. I am a Keynsham Cricket Club alumnus so I take some reflected glory in that achievement - an absolute legend in every way apart from being a City fan but no one is perfect. Just absolutely chuffed - I thought he was going to do it last year when I was at Old Trafford but he pulled a long hop straight down deep square leg's throat in the late 60s and a brilliant catch was taken. He walked off looking like a guy who'd just bagged a pair for the second game in a row - I thought then that maybe it was because he was planning to retire and had missed a golden chance at the record.
Anyway, that piece of good news not withstanding, Somerset seem to be misfiring somewhat in the Championship this season which I find a bit hard to explain. My feeling was that they had a stronger squad this year than they did last year plus additional years development for the young bowling attack. I was sure they were primed for an assault on the title - instead it seems they have gone in the other direction which is a bit worrying.
I saw a fair bit of the Roses battle which was another underwhelming event in the end (although I did manage to finally tick off 'attend Roses Match' from my cricket bucket list). I was there for the most exciting and relevant bit of the match (although it's a bit mawkish to say so) which was Anderson collapsing in a heap during his delivery stride on the first morning. It sounds strange given that a torn groin muscle is a serious injury, but I'm incredibly relieved it wasn't worse. My instant reaction was genuinely 'that might be the end of his career' because he went down like Sid Lawrence in New Zealand that time - just threw himself to the floor with a scream of pain. It was weird because there'd been an absolute racket going on all morning as it was a kids open day and there were about 2000 school kids making a din in one of the stands largely oblivious to what was going on in the game but when Anderson went down you just heard a massive deep groan of concern from the people watching. It was quite shocking even though it quickly became clear it wasn't all that bad because he walked off under his own steam and didn't seem in too much pain. Other than that the first day was well balanced with Lancs missing several opportunities to really take control of the game but ultimately their lack of seamers (Anderson is not the only injury they have - it's a bit of a mess for them on the seamers front) came into play and Yorks banged up a massive score and with the rain coming that was about it for intrigue in the game. Went back on Monday and saw a meaningless 100 from Handscombe the Yorkshire Aussie and Simon Kerrigan really struggled again - he must be close to losing his Lancs contract, that England game at the Oval really did a number on him psychologically I think.
In a week of awful events up here - a nice story. My club's Under 13s played Alderley Edge (home of stockbrokers, footballers and general wealthy types - by far the poshest club around here) in a regional final and acquitted themselves well losing by only 3 runs in the last over. Which is impressive considering the Alderley Edge side contained both Michael Vaughan and Andy Flintoff's sons in starring roles as well as, slightly more bizarrely, Robbie Savage's! All 3 were in attendance and I wasn't there but was told that they were all very nice and congratulated our team on their performance in the dressing afterwards and were happy to pose for photos etc. |
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warehamgas
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Post by warehamgas on May 27, 2017 21:08:36 GMT
Just got back from first two days of Somerset v Hampshire match. If I was watching Somerset's future fast bowling last week in the past two days I've been seeing their spin bowlers for the next 10 years. Of the 20 Hampshire wickets Bess took 10 and Leach 7 with the Overtons the other 3. It has been a strange match, on a very green pitch which should be favouring the quick bowlers we've had so many taken by spinners. Dawson took 4 for Hampshire, although of all the paceman Abbott for Hants looked the best and was excellent this morning in helpful overcast conditions and helped scuttle Somerset's last 5 wickets in an hour. Should be a very exciting day tomorrow.
Interesting, your take on Somerset irish. I've always thought we were weaker esp on the batting front. The only change is that we have Elgar instead of Rogers and we have lost his captaincy. I am sure we are missing his aggressive captaincy being conducted from mid on or mid off which kept everyone on their toes. Although he was not prolific with runs last year he had the experience and confidence not to be over-worried by loss of form and he did get 1000 in the end. Tom Abell is learning to be captain and at the moment is not in form although he got a classy 40 yesterday and is beginning to play himself back into form. I was impressed though in how he has managed the bowlers in this match although Hants got away with it in the second half of today's innings. He does back his bowlers with attacking fields which explains why we are chasing 259 and not 210. And in terms of the Championship I think last year was our chance and the fact we had it snatched away at the end has deflated the team and its a team which looks lacking in confidence, though tomorrow could change that (or make it worse!). We will need a century from Marcus or Elgar tomorrow and a contribution from Tom Abell would be good. Without one of those I think we'll lose as no one seems to be in any form whatsoever and once a wicket goes the confidence just drains out of the team. And that would leave us deep in the doodoo.
Was impressed by Kyle Abbott and Liam Dawson as bowlers and Abbott scored a total of 70 runs which could be a match winning contribution. Led by Bailey, they look like a more aggressive team and when batting they kept attacking when, had they been more defensive, they could have batted us out if it by now.
I don't know if I've ever been at a match where the same bowler, Bess in this case, was on a hat trick twice in the match, once in each innings.
Never been to a Roses match obviously, was it well attended or is it one of those matches that us cricket fans think is important but no one else does now? If Lancs are struggling for fast bowlers can we swap some of ours for some of their batsmen?! Groenewald and Davey are unlucky not to be in our team having bowled well so far but we need runs!
Today we were trying to make a list of very good overseas players who have been loyal and good value to their counties. I started off by saying how impressed I've always been by Sean Ervine for Hants. Always competitive, always seems to score runs against us and seems a good guy who has been a mainstay for many years. MIchael di Venuto for Durham and Michael Klinger for Gloucestershire were mentioned. Can anyone think of any others?
Good to hear some good news about your cricket teams irish, much needed I'm sure after the last week.
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irishrover
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Post by irishrover on Jul 10, 2017 13:59:27 GMT
That was a huge win for Somerset at Yorkshire - presumably they'll be hoping that Leach and Bess can now deliver the kind of end of season performance they did last year to lift them away from danger.
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warehamgas
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Post by warehamgas on Jul 11, 2017 22:02:59 GMT
Yes it was a good win. I know it sounds strange but having lost to Yorkshire in Taunton by 3 runs and the other losses being matches where we chasing only about 250 had we had a batsman who could dig in and see us home we could have been top of the table. Instead we are one from bottom. I think it looks bad for us and Warwickshire esp with Middlesex wining in Birmingham and putting some distance between us. I've seen our home matches except the first one against Essex and the away match against Hampshire and I've never seen us bowl so well. The Overtons, Tim Groenewold, Lewis Gregory and Jack Leach and Dom Bess always look likely to take wickets all the time. It's just a shame our batsmen have been so awful and any score over 170 looks challenging. TBH I've almost accepted we will go down and am looking for a few silver linings, the main ones being it will be good to play some different teams for a change! But perhaps we'll have a good Augustvand September like we normally do!
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irishrover
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Post by irishrover on Jul 11, 2017 22:44:03 GMT
Yes it was a good win. I know it sounds strange but having lost to Yorkshire in Taunton by 3 runs and the other losses being matches where we chasing only about 250 had we had a batsman who could dig in and see us home we could have been top of the table. Instead we are one from bottom. I think it looks bad for us and Warwickshire esp with Middlesex wining in Birmingham and putting some distance between us. I've seen our home matches except the first one against Essex and the away match against Hampshire and I've never seen us bowl so well. The Overtons, Tim Groenewold, Lewis Gregory and Jack Leach and Dom Bess always look likely to take wickets all the time. It's just a shame our batsmen have been so awful and any score over 170 looks challenging. TBH I've almost accepted we will go down and am looking for a few silver linings, the main ones being it will be good to play some different teams for a change! But perhaps we'll have a good Augustvand September like we normally do! I've no doubt that you will play better but my concern would be who you find to catch I think. I suppose the good thing about having a league with parity in it though is that doesn't matter all that much. If you can win a few in a row then you will get out of trouble as the rest will beat each other. |
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warehamgas
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Post by warehamgas on Jul 12, 2017 7:45:06 GMT
That's the point irish, Middlesex and Surrey are a way ahead. In the end the table doesn't usually lie and it's up to us to win matches, not worry about others!
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Post by pirate49 on Aug 23, 2017 17:11:27 GMT
Anyone thinking of going to the first day's play of the Worcestershire v Glos
game on Monday can get free tickets.
Go on their website wccc.co.uk
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warehamgas
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Post by warehamgas on Sept 8, 2017 18:58:11 GMT
Not sure that anyone's too interested but after Somerset's win today it looks like the two counties to get relegated will come from Warwickshire and one more. It will likely be one from Somerset, Middlesex and Yorkshire. Now this is probably unremarkable except if you go back one year and look at the last afternoon of the season when Middlesex and Yorkshire were fighting it out to be champions knowing that if it was a draw then Somerset would be champions. Middlesex were the winners. So the best three teams last year are now fighting to avoid relegation. I find that quite a turnaround and shows what a close, hard fought competition the 1st Division is. When we play Middlesex in the last match of the season could be a winner gets it all type of match, or rather winner avoids relegation type of match. My instinct is still on us to go down which will be a great shame as a Somerset member but won't be the end of the world.
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irishrover
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Post by irishrover on Sept 8, 2017 23:13:05 GMT
Not sure that anyone's too interested but after Somerset's win today it looks like the two counties to get relegated will come from Warwickshire and one more. It will likely be one from Somerset, Middlesex and Yorkshire. Now this is probably unremarkable except if you go back one year and look at the last afternoon of the season when Middlesex and Yorkshire were fighting it out to be champions knowing that if it was a draw then Somerset would be champions. Middlesex were the winners. So the best three teams last year are now fighting to avoid relegation. I find that quite a turnaround and shows what a close, hard fought competition the 1st Division is. When we play Middlesex in the last match of the season could be a winner gets it all type of match, or rather winner avoids relegation type of match. My instinct is still on us to go down which will be a great shame as a Somerset member but won't be the end of the world. I quite like Somerset's chances getting out of it after that win if they can keep the momentum going. Not sure Lancs have much to play for and are pretty beatable despite their position in the table and then it's basically in their own hands v Surrey and Middlesex, both of whom could still go down. Could be a repeat of last season but at the opposite end of the table - with the spinners coming to the rescue.
I was at Old Trafford this week and saw Hameed's epic 85! TMS was wrong - at one stage he had 11 of 109 balls - one more dot ball would have given him a strike rate of 10 - but for all of the stick that he has received for that it was utterly necessary and most of it was very judicious leaves outside the off stump. It was basically dark clouds all day - they could easily have been skittled for 90. So it was a genuinely impressive knock and he did expand after the shine went off the ball. Lancs generally though are pretty flat and vulnerable.
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warehamgas
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Post by warehamgas on Sept 9, 2017 6:30:21 GMT
Yes, this season has been fascinating in Division 1, rather than top quality batting I just think the bowlers have been on top generally. Our bowling has never been so good yet we're facing at relegation. The Essex bowlers have been excellent yet their batsmen not so good since Cook and Westley disappeared to England duty. The cutting of one team from the division has, I think, had a negative effect with teams looking at who's in danger of relegation and thinking we are! This has led to a bit more negativity in the approach. And of course the large gap in mid summer has meant teams in the first half may be in different form than the second. And Essex seem to have lost the momentum they had built up. At least I hope so, with us getting a bit of form and momentum which we lacked in the first half! Agree with what you've said about Hameed. The qualities he has are exactly what England want at the moment, the ability to build a long innings, accumulate minutes in the middle without seeming too concerned about scoring rate. I think his absence from the test team will strangely work in his favour when selecting the tour party. Yet I've been surprised to see Lancs being the only alternative to Essex. Whilst not a bad team I didn't think they were that good, but they still might win the Championship. I'll be watching them next week at Taunton and hoping we can beat them!
Have you finished playing yet Irish?
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