irishrover
Global Moderator
Joined: June 2014
Posts: 3,372 
|
Post by irishrover on Sept 11, 2017 18:04:26 GMT
Yes, this season has been fascinating in Division 1, rather than top quality batting I just think the bowlers have been on top generally. Our bowling has never been so good yet we're facing at relegation. The Essex bowlers have been excellent yet their batsmen not so good since Cook and Westley disappeared to England duty. The cutting of one team from the division has, I think, had a negative effect with teams looking at who's in danger of relegation and thinking we are! This has led to a bit more negativity in the approach. And of course the large gap in mid summer has meant teams in the first half may be in different form than the second. And Essex seem to have lost the momentum they had built up. At least I hope so, with us getting a bit of form and momentum which we lacked in the first half! Agree with what you've said about Hameed. The qualities he has are exactly what England want at the moment, the ability to build a long innings, accumulate minutes in the middle without seeming too concerned about scoring rate. I think his absence from the test team will strangely work in his favour when selecting the tour party. Yet I've been surprised to see Lancs being the only alternative to Essex. Whilst not a bad team I didn't think they were that good, but they still might win the Championship. I'll be watching them next week at Taunton and hoping we can beat them! Have you finished playing yet Irish? Yes, my season ended last Saturday although I didn't actually play as I was away at a Conference. My side finished 2nd which is good enough to secure promotion for the 2nd year running (they are writing a history of the club this winter back to 1845 and I want to see if I go down as the most successful captain ever as we're not a club that's been overly burdened with success down through the years!). Unfortunately because I skipper the 2nd team our promotion is reliant on our 1st team also getting promoted from the league above because both teams are not allowed to play in the same division. This is a lot more in the balance and our 1sts still have 2 games left and probably need to win both to guarantee promotion and avoid this embarrassing situation. To be honest I'm not all that bothered - I think my team would struggle mightily to compete at the next level which is a real step up - we are probably the best 2nd team in the area (despite our 1s being average at best) but nearly all the teams we'd be playing against next year would have at least 1 professional and probably an overseas amateur too and I think that would be a bit much for us.
No one at Lancs seemed to seriously think they had a Championship shot - I think they were just relieved that they hadn't been dragged into the relegation battle again this year. Suprising amount of apathy given that it should have been a highlight of the reason - weather didn't help in that regard I suppose, never looked likely there would be a result looking at the forecast. Almost feels like Essex have won it by default this year which might be a bit harsh but no one else has really shown an any consistency at all. I certainly don't think Lancs are particularly good - they're OK but I'd have had them more likely to be in a relegation battle than near the top to be honest. Pretty dull to watch too on the whole because they lack the bowlers to be able to break open games. I definitely don't think Somerset should particularly fear them at home. Although, beware Matt Parkinson if you prepare a Taunton turner for Bess and Leach - he is becoming increasingly dangerous. |
|
warehamgas
Predictions League
Joined: May 2014
Posts: 3,421
|
Post by warehamgas on Sept 11, 2017 18:36:49 GMT
Well done irish, sounds like a good season.
Yes, a pretty underwhelming County Championship season. I'm surprised Yorkshire didn't kick on nor did Middlesex nor did Somerset. Essex had a storming start with Cook playing and have never looked back. I've always thought the table doesn't lie and the team at the top deserves it. I go on about it but the balance of sides only eight teams is not right and has meant that one or even two good teams will go down. On a turning pitch at Taunton Leach and Bess have done very well. They certainly outbowled Batty for Surrey and most other spin pairs this season. Only Dawson and Crane have even equalled them at Taunton and over the season have been nowhere near them fir total wickets. I haven't see Parkinson bowl so I'll look forward to seeing him. Kerrigan, I presume, has fallen away which is sad.
|
|
irishrover
Global Moderator
Joined: June 2014
Posts: 3,372
|
Post by irishrover on Sept 11, 2017 20:45:17 GMT
Well done irish, sounds like a good season. Yes, a pretty underwhelming County Championship season. I'm surprised Yorkshire didn't kick on nor did Middlesex nor did Somerset. Essex had a storming start with Cook playing and have never looked back. I've always thought the table doesn't lie and the team at the top deserves it. I go on about it but the balance of sides only eight teams is not right and has meant that one or even two good teams will go down. On a turning pitch at Taunton Leach and Bess have done very well. They certainly outbowled Batty for Surrey and most other spin pairs this season. Only Dawson and Crane have even equalled them at Taunton and over the season have been nowhere near them fir total wickets. I haven't see Parkinson bowl so I'll look forward to seeing him. Kerrigan, I presume, has fallen away which is sad. My feeling is that as an attacking spinner Parkinson is potentially one of the best I've seen in a while - he can't hold an end up though which is why they are selective in which games they pick him in. A Parkinson at Taunton on a turning pitch would be an exciting experience I think - potential to take wickets and go for a hatful of runs. It could an intriguing battle But Lancs are deeply conservative to their core and will probably pick Parry anyway, who is as dull a bowler as you can find. Kerrigan is currently on loan at Northants and did OK but has basically dropped off the map in the last few years. It sounds too easy to say he was destroyed by the single test he played but, for once, that seems a plausible explanation. Complete shadow of the player he used to be. I don't think it's the 'terrified by Test players' narrative but I do think it might be a tough thing to deal with psychologically - ie that you hit the pinnacle and were embarrassed when you got there. I think it may have done for his motivation - what else is there to aim for now? etc. Either way there's no way he gets another contract at Old Trafford - he's 4/5th in the spinners pecking order these days. Big game for Somerset - if they win and there's a result at Uxbridge then they're out of the relegation zone. I'd quite like Yorkshire to go down - for no other reason than I can go to Headingley next year when Glos play there. I don't really get to watch CC2 anymore.
I'm happy with the idea that Essex have been the best team - I just don't think they have been tested really. It has been a procession. Be interesting to see if Northants, Kent or Sussex can put any pressures on Worcs for that final promotion spot in the last few weeks. I doubt it personally - also I have a lot of time for Worcs and it feels like they deserve it.
|
|
warehamgas
Predictions League
Joined: May 2014
Posts: 3,421
|
Post by warehamgas on Sept 13, 2017 21:14:40 GMT
A very good two days of cricket at Taunton. You were right irish, Parkinson was a good bowler. He gave the ball good flight and with 4-68 had well deserved figures. For Somerset to get 335 in conditions that favoured the bowlers probably tells you all you need to know. To be honest we were disappointed with Lancs considering they were in with a chance of the Championship, albeit pretty slim, their fielding was a bit lacklustre with at least 4 dropped catches and bowlers who bowled too many bad balls allowing Somerset to get away after having them struggling a bit at lunch. Parry never looked like turning the ball whilst Parkinson got some good turn. I thought that Parkinson gave away runs with a few bad balls but he always threatened and made life difficult. In the first few overs dreading being 17-3 by 11.00 didn't materialise although the fast bowlers esp Maclaren bowled well. Although batting was never easy the bowlers weren't that threatening. Today was a bit of an eye opener for me. Lancs batting was very poor, in better conditions than yesterday, they collected 11 runs in the first 10 overs! When Davies went Hameed went into his shell and scored one run in 35 minutes. I was surprised because even when he got a bad ball he didn't punish it and the poor run rate put pressure on the team and when he did try and hook he put it down long legs throat. Looked as if he was drained of confidence, not good after I thought he was a shoe-in for Australia. If he goes he needs to learn how to score when he's not playing well. You need to be able to dig in and be determined but today all that did was put pressure on LIvingstone and Croft who had to go for runs. Being young he will learn how to do that but today he looked uncomfortable against Overton.After a long delay for rain at 61-3 we came back on at 3.30 and Lancs were all out at 5.30. Leach bowled well as did Overton and Bess but some of the shots from the batsmen were woeful and I can't imagine the coach was happy. We enforced the follow on because of the weather I would imagine because the wicket will get worse but so will the showers!
I think that's probably given the title to Essex and if we can snatch a win between the showers give ourselves half a chance. What impressed me about this match is that despite a poor season batting wise Somerset dug in yesterday and innings by Davies, Hildreth, Abell and the bowlers showed a bit of determination. And Abells captaincy was top rate. After a poor season batting his last 3 innings incl a century have shown he will battle and still play his shots. His ability to encourage his bowlers and make the correct changes exactly when they were needed and place attacking fields were impressive. And in a season when we looked doomed for much of it the fielding and catching have been extremely good and there is always a great, upbeat approach to the fielding and throwing. It's great to see a captain with on-field presence. Well done to a young captain who has had a difficult season and who may yet have to accept relegation. And even if we do go down we will do so having shown a bit of spirit and having a team made up of young English or older English players. Only Groenewold was an overseas player, Kolpak.
It should be an interesting two days to come.
|
|
irishrover
Global Moderator
Joined: June 2014
Posts: 3,372
|
Post by irishrover on Sept 13, 2017 22:59:55 GMT
A very good two days of cricket at Taunton. You were right irish, Parkinson was a good bowler. He gave the ball good flight and with 4-68 had well deserved figures. For Somerset to get 335 in conditions that favoured the bowlers probably tells you all you need to know. To be honest we were disappointed with Lancs considering they were in with a chance of the Championship, albeit pretty slim, their fielding was a bit lacklustre with at least 4 dropped catches and bowlers who bowled too many bad balls allowing Somerset to get away after having them struggling a bit at lunch. Parry never looked like turning the ball whilst Parkinson got some good turn. I thought that Parkinson gave away runs with a few bad balls but he always threatened and made life difficult. In the first few overs dreading being 17-3 by 11.00 didn't materialise although the fast bowlers esp Maclaren bowled well. Although batting was never easy the bowlers weren't that threatening. Today was a bit of an eye opener for me. Lancs batting was very poor, in better conditions than yesterday, they collected 11 runs in the first 10 overs! When Davies went Hameed went into his shell and scored one run in 35 minutes. I was surprised because even when he got a bad ball he didn't punish it and the poor run rate put pressure on the team and when he did try and hook he put it down long legs throat. Looked as if he was drained of confidence, not good after I thought he was a shoe-in for Australia. If he goes he needs to learn how to score when he's not playing well. You need to be able to dig in and be determined but today all that did was put pressure on LIvingstone and Croft who had to go for runs. Being young he will learn how to do that but today he looked uncomfortable against Overton.After a long delay for rain at 61-3 we came back on at 3.30 and Lancs were all out at 5.30. Leach bowled well as did Overton and Bess but some of the shots from the batsmen were woeful and I can't imagine the coach was happy. We enforced the follow on because of the weather I would imagine because the wicket will get worse but so will the showers! I think that's probably given the title to Essex and if we can snatch a win between the showers give ourselves half a chance. What impressed me about this match is that despite a poor season batting wise Somerset dug in yesterday and innings by Davies, Hildreth, Abell and the bowlers showed a bit of determination. And Abells captaincy was top rate. After a poor season batting his last 3 innings incl a century have shown he will battle and still play his shots. His ability to encourage his bowlers and make the correct changes exactly when they were needed and place attacking fields were impressive. And in a season when we looked doomed for much of it the fielding and catching have been extremely good and there is always a great, upbeat approach to the fielding and throwing. It's great to see a captain with on-field presence. Well done to a young captain who has had a difficult season and who may yet have to accept relegation. And even if we do go down we will do so having shown a bit of spirit and having a team made up of young English or older English players. Only Groenewold was an overseas player, Kolpak. It should be an interesting two days to come. It's nice that Abell has turned it around at one stage this stage he couldn't even buy a run in WEPL cricket and it was looking a terrible decision to make him captain from the point of view of a promising young player. At this stage I'd say the main battle you have is weather and if you can get enough overs in to bowl them out should Hameed or Chanderpaul. Wouldn't have thought the rest would give you much trouble - Lancs lineup is woefully out of form all through. I don't think they're a very good to be honest. Batting blow hot and cold and their seam attack is pretty reliant on Jarvis. McLaren is fine but not as a main strike bowler and the 3rd seamer's been an issue all season. They should show faith in Parkinson next season and give him a decent run in the side-that would be intriguing. He is a high risk high reward type of bowler. The Lancs teams I've been watching over the last few years have been deeply conservative - they need some kind of jault. Not at all surprised they looked lacklustre disinterested in the field - it was the same last week and they were playing Essex. Seen no evidence that they are really thinking in terms of a tilt at the Championship - there weren't even any gripes up here when ECB didn't release Anderson which there normally are. I think everyone's already halfway into the offseason around Old Trafford to be honest.
With Hameed I'm pretty sure he's been told to do this. The narrative around him early season is that he was giving it away early on playing expansive shots that were out of character. I think he's had the order from on high to go back to basics (baby Boycott etc). No doubt his powers of concentration and patience are immense - I don't think I've met many 20 year olds who would happily bat our 109 balls for 11 runs without doing anything remotely daft! It's clear that he is just playing on his off stump. I also wonder if bowlers are becoming more disciplined and know that he will get bogged if they themselves don't get bored and start bowling into him which is what he wants - so you get this weird cat and mouse where the opposition are not really attacking him much either. Get him early tomorrow and Lancs should fold. Hope Somerset win - I have no candle for Lancs other than a desire to be able to watch more entertaining cricket next year and hopefully a dodgy run in will precipitate a rethink. They've not been good to watch this year - I think they need a change of skipper. However, a win might not help you as much as it should do - tempted to call 'fix' on what's happening at the Oval......
|
|
Deleted
Joined: January 1970
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Sept 14, 2017 15:39:47 GMT
Gashead James Bracey doing the business behind the stumps for Glos.
|
|
irishrover
Global Moderator
Joined: June 2014
Posts: 3,372
|
Post by irishrover on Sept 14, 2017 22:14:34 GMT
Gashead James Bracey doing the business behind the stumps for Glos. Interesting - do tell? I don't know anything about him. Cricinfo says he's a product of Winterbourne CC (who have had a meteoric rise from average club cricket club to a top club in the area in recent years) so I assume he's from round there? |
|
Deleted
Joined: January 1970
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Sept 14, 2017 22:17:18 GMT
Gashead James Bracey doing the business behind the stumps for Glos. Interesting - do tell? I don't know anything about him. Cricinfo says he's a product of Winterbourne CC (who have had a meteoric rise from average club cricket club to a top club in the area in recent years) so I assume he's from round there? Spent three years at Loughborough, wicketkeeper batsman, good lad and gas. Delighted for him. Hopefully he'll get a score tomorrow, was unlucky at Leicestershire being run out after the ball deflected off the bowler. |
|
irishrover
Global Moderator
Joined: June 2014
Posts: 3,372
|
Post by irishrover on Sept 14, 2017 22:42:12 GMT
Interesting - do tell? I don't know anything about him. Cricinfo says he's a product of Winterbourne CC (who have had a meteoric rise from average club cricket club to a top club in the area in recent years) so I assume he's from round there? Spent three years at Loughborough, wicketkeeper batsman, good lad and gas. Delighted for him. Hopefully he'll get a score tomorrow, was unlucky at Leicestershire being run out after the ball deflected off the bowler. Excellent - I will keep an eye out then. Always nice to see someone come through local cricket to the county game. You're right - that's a gutting way to be out for a youngster trying to earn a place in the game. |
|
warehamgas
Predictions League
Joined: May 2014
Posts: 3,421
|
Post by warehamgas on Sept 18, 2017 21:23:54 GMT
Yes, good to hear that youngsters are getting the chance to play county cricket for Gloucs. They must be pretty well off for wicket keepers, Mustard, Roderick and Bracey. He must be a good batsman if they played him against Kent as a batsman and let Roderick keep wicket. Hope Gloucestershire keep all their best players to have a good season in 2018, it's about time they started to push for promotion, would be good to see.
|
|
warehamgas
Predictions League
Joined: May 2014
Posts: 3,421
|
Post by warehamgas on Sept 18, 2017 21:38:39 GMT
A very good two days of cricket at Taunton. You were right irish, Parkinson was a good bowler. He gave the ball good flight and with 4-68 had well deserved figures. For Somerset to get 335 in conditions that favoured the bowlers probably tells you all you need to know. To be honest we were disappointed with Lancs considering they were in with a chance of the Championship, albeit pretty slim, their fielding was a bit lacklustre with at least 4 dropped catches and bowlers who bowled too many bad balls allowing Somerset to get away after having them struggling a bit at lunch. Parry never looked like turning the ball whilst Parkinson got some good turn. I thought that Parkinson gave away runs with a few bad balls but he always threatened and made life difficult. In the first few overs dreading being 17-3 by 11.00 didn't materialise although the fast bowlers esp Maclaren bowled well. Although batting was never easy the bowlers weren't that threatening. Today was a bit of an eye opener for me. Lancs batting was very poor, in better conditions than yesterday, they collected 11 runs in the first 10 overs! When Davies went Hameed went into his shell and scored one run in 35 minutes. I was surprised because even when he got a bad ball he didn't punish it and the poor run rate put pressure on the team and when he did try and hook he put it down long legs throat. Looked as if he was drained of confidence, not good after I thought he was a shoe-in for Australia. If he goes he needs to learn how to score when he's not playing well. You need to be able to dig in and be determined but today all that did was put pressure on LIvingstone and Croft who had to go for runs. Being young he will learn how to do that but today he looked uncomfortable against Overton.After a long delay for rain at 61-3 we came back on at 3.30 and Lancs were all out at 5.30. Leach bowled well as did Overton and Bess but some of the shots from the batsmen were woeful and I can't imagine the coach was happy. We enforced the follow on because of the weather I would imagine because the wicket will get worse but so will the showers! I think that's probably given the title to Essex and if we can snatch a win between the showers give ourselves half a chance. What impressed me about this match is that despite a poor season batting wise Somerset dug in yesterday and innings by Davies, Hildreth, Abell and the bowlers showed a bit of determination. And Abells captaincy was top rate. After a poor season batting his last 3 innings incl a century have shown he will battle and still play his shots. His ability to encourage his bowlers and make the correct changes exactly when they were needed and place attacking fields were impressive. And in a season when we looked doomed for much of it the fielding and catching have been extremely good and there is always a great, upbeat approach to the fielding and throwing. It's great to see a captain with on-field presence. Well done to a young captain who has had a difficult season and who may yet have to accept relegation. And even if we do go down we will do so having shown a bit of spirit and having a team made up of young English or older English players. Only Groenewold was an overseas player, Kolpak. It should be an interesting two days to come. It's nice that Abell has turned it around at one stage this stage he couldn't even buy a run in WEPL cricket and it was looking a terrible decision to make him captain from the point of view of a promising young player. At this stage I'd say the main battle you have is weather and if you can get enough overs in to bowl them out should Hameed or Chanderpaul. Wouldn't have thought the rest would give you much trouble - Lancs lineup is woefully out of form all through. I don't think they're a very good to be honest. Batting blow hot and cold and their seam attack is pretty reliant on Jarvis. McLaren is fine but not as a main strike bowler and the 3rd seamer's been an issue all season. They should show faith in Parkinson next season and give him a decent run in the side-that would be intriguing. He is a high risk high reward type of bowler. The Lancs teams I've been watching over the last few years have been deeply conservative - they need some kind of jault. Not at all surprised they looked lacklustre disinterested in the field - it was the same last week and they were playing Essex. Seen no evidence that they are really thinking in terms of a tilt at the Championship - there weren't even any gripes up here when ECB didn't release Anderson which there normally are. I think everyone's already halfway into the offseason around Old Trafford to be honest.
With Hameed I'm pretty sure he's been told to do this. The narrative around him early season is that he was giving it away early on playing expansive shots that were out of character. I think he's had the order from on high to go back to basics (baby Boycott etc). No doubt his powers of concentration and patience are immense - I don't think I've met many 20 year olds who would happily bat our 109 balls for 11 runs without doing anything remotely daft! It's clear that he is just playing on his off stump. I also wonder if bowlers are becoming more disciplined and know that he will get bogged if they themselves don't get bored and start bowling into him which is what he wants - so you get this weird cat and mouse where the opposition are not really attacking him much either. Get him early tomorrow and Lancs should fold. Hope Somerset win - I have no candle for Lancs other than a desire to be able to watch more entertaining cricket next year and hopefully a dodgy run in will precipitate a rethink. They've not been good to watch this year - I think they need a change of skipper. However, a win might not help you as much as it should do - tempted to call 'fix' on what's happening at the Oval......
Hameed was much better in the second innings, more intent and more shots. Lancs showed a lot more determination on day 3 but Somerset kept plugging away and were pretty pleased that they got it won before the rain came. You may be right about being told to return to basics and as you say his powers of concentration are excellent and almost unseen in such a young cricketer. I think he should go to Australia and in a battle could seriously jar off the Aussies with his concentration. That would be good to see. Relegation fight is on and will be very interesting. Playing Surrey at the oval before Middlesex at Taunton for the last game won't be easy. Surrey and Mr. Batty will be keen to send us down and Middlesex will be fighting for their lives, so no gimmes there! Obviously hope we don't go down but with the Overtons signing new contracts and our spinners committed to the club if we do we will certainly have the bowlers to seriously challenge next year. And in a strange lop sided way it would be good to see some new teams in red ball cricket. It's been a long time since we played Leicestershire, Northants or even Gloucestershire. I've been expecting relegation all season and have almost come to accept it. Now to see that we might avoid it is a bit strange. Come on Somerset! |
|
jackthegas
David Pritchard
Joined: May 2014
Posts: 313
|
Post by jackthegas on Sept 25, 2017 21:04:57 GMT
As always I am intrigued by the end of the Championship season. I listened to the last hour of the Somerset game in the car and it was gripping. Hard to know whether Somerset let Middlesex off the hook wo their collapse or whether Middlesex will rue a poor first session. I also think it's great to see some cricket played in this country on a turning track. I rated Ravi Patel when I saw him a few years ago. There are others like him who would benefit from playing on a few more wickets like the one at Taunton.
My local side Worcester must have thought they were up until Northants beat Notts. I said earlier on this season the Tounge and Barnard would need to step up. Well they absolutely have. It's been great watching those two and to a lessor extent Pat Brown develop. If Tounge can stay fit (and I think he has had back problems) then I am sure he will play for England.
I thought that Koehler Kadmore moving to Yorkshire mid season was going to destabilise the team irrecoverably and they were outclassed by Sussex a month or so ago but they have recovered well. Given that they've tried everyone else I am surprised Daryl Mitchell never gets a mention as an option at the top of the order for the national side. Joe Clarke will play for England too.
The worry however is that Notts and Warwickshire both need players. Clarke wants to keep but is behind Ben Cox. Chris Read has retired and Tim Ambrose is getting on. Warwickshire must be looking for a replacement for Boyd Rankin too. Trott barely trusted to bowl last week against Yorkshire.
Final point from me. I would bloody love it if Notts and Warwickshire were in Div 2 next season. It's deplorable the way that both relatively wealthy Counties have failed miserably to produce their own players over the last decade, although partial credit must be given to Warwickshire for giving Surrey a taste of their own medicine when they pinched Sibley earlier on this year!
|
|
irishrover
Global Moderator
Joined: June 2014
Posts: 3,372
|
Post by irishrover on Sept 25, 2017 22:08:22 GMT
As always I am intrigued by the end of the Championship season. I listened to the last hour of the Somerset game in the car and it was gripping. Hard to know whether Somerset let Middlesex off the hook wo their collapse or whether Middlesex will rue a poor first session. I also think it's great to see some cricket played in this country on a turning track. I rated Ravi Patel when I saw him a few years ago. There are others like him who would benefit from playing on a few more wickets like the one at Taunton. My local side Worcester must have thought they were up until Northants beat Notts. I said earlier on this season the Tounge and Barnard would need to step up. Well they absolutely have. It's been great watching those two and to a lessor extent Pat Brown develop. If Tounge can stay fit (and I think he has had back problems) then I am sure he will play for England. I thought that Koehler Kadmore moving to Yorkshire mid season was going to destabilise the team irrecoverably and they were outclassed by Sussex a month or so ago but they have recovered well. Given that they've tried everyone else I am surprised Daryl Mitchell never gets a mention as an option at the top of the order for the national side. Joe Clarke will play for England too. The worry however is that Notts and Warwickshire both need players. Clarke wants to keep but is behind Ben Cox. Chris Read has retired and Tim Ambrose is getting on. Warwickshire must be looking for a replacement for Boyd Rankin too. Trott barely trusted to bowl last week against Yorkshire. Final point from me. I would bloody love it if Notts and Warwickshire were in Div 2 next season. It's deplorable the way that both relatively wealthy Counties have failed miserably to produce their own players over the last decade, although partial credit must be given to Warwickshire for giving Surrey a taste of their own medicine when they pinched Sibley earlier on this year! I think there's a lot would have sympathy with that. I imagine a few Somerset fans would see it poetic justice if Middlesex went down after last year's contrivance at Lords although I understand Somerset are potentially vulnerable to Middlesex declaring and robbing them of bowling points right? It would be a brave team to take the field at Taunton 10 minutes after having pulled that one mind.....Surrey did it today though to Lancs. All kind of silly buggers could go on. Shades of the Pembrokeshire Cricket League that was doing the rounds a month or so ago!
Notts staying down would be hilarious - I don't think anyone had really thought there was any chance they'd be at risk of staying down but Northants have come on so strong in the final weeks. I wouldn't mind seeing a bit more balance between Test and non-Test hosting counties in the top division so what the hell let's have Somerset stay up and Northants and Worcester join them while Lords hosts Div 2 cricket next year. On the other hand a Championship game between Somerset and Gloucester appeals - a rare beast indeed in recent times.
I understand Ciderabad has attracted the pitch inspectors-11 wickets going down to spin on Day 1 is certainly interesting! The radio said Trescothick was fielding at slip on his knees - was that to the spinners? If so, that's a pretty interesting tactic. |
|
warehamgas
Predictions League
Joined: May 2014
Posts: 3,421
|
Post by warehamgas on Sept 27, 2017 14:40:32 GMT
Have just arrived in Oz so have had to miss the Middlesex match which is a shame but hey ho there are worse places to be! Good for Worcestershire they deserve their promotion and like you Jack would be amused to see Northants beat Nottinghamshire to the other promotion race. If they did then those in control at Notts should be ashamed. They have as you said been lazy and have largely left their other midland county rivals do all the hard work with younger players and then when they looked good give them big contracts to leave their counties and go to Trent Bridge. Leics, Northants have certainly lost players to them over the years along with many others. In mid August and after their second one day title they looked invincible at the top. Looks like complacency, thought they had it won and took their eyes off the ball, literally. Would they still feel it was a good season with two titles if they don't get promotion? I guess most would but not for Notts esp after leading for all the season. Will need to bat well today and tomorrow to get their draw.
Irish, I was looking at the scores just after landing in Oz and was surprised to see Surreys declaration and then thought did they do that to deny Lancs bonus points and hope to snatch second place in the table? From what you said it looks likely. What do you think? Strangely Somerset and Surrey have had a hate/hate relationship over the past few years with there always being a bit of an issue between the players. Batty is certainly not a popular figure in Taunton. In the four day match at Taunton earlier this season Batty was chasing a ball down to long leg where I was sat in Gimblett Hill when he was given some banter, and not very pleasant stuff. This by a four day crowd not a one day one!! He sent someone else to be in that part of the ground and we didn't see him for the rest of the match! Perhaps he wants to get some more "fans" who appreciate his abrasive style of cricket at Lancs CCC!
Yes, you're right about our fans seeing sending Middlesex down as some kind of karma for last season but from a personal point of view I've never had much against Middlesex and would rather see Hampshire get what they deserve after their last two escapes. Last season's antics after being beaten by Durham on the field only to lose it off the field three days later still leaves a nasty taste. One which poor Durham are still recovering, or rather, not recovering from. Still a day and a bit to go so I'm still not certain, especially from afar, that Somerset will win. If they do then they will not go down whilst Middlesex will need three more points than Hants. I'll wait until the pitch inspectors have reported and hope they don't decide to deduct points. I can't imagine they would, it would be just too much of a kick in the whatsits esp after last season. But before I give a sigh of relief I'll wait until whatever is confirmed!! As jack says, still very close and an intriguing end to the season, whatever happens.
|
|
jackthegas
David Pritchard
Joined: May 2014
Posts: 313
|
Post by jackthegas on Sept 28, 2017 12:33:27 GMT
So, barring a late intervention by the pitch inspectors Somerset are safe by virtue of beating Middlesex by a lot. They've got a terrific bowling attack and now Davies has settled and Able has rediscovered a bit of form they might do a bit better next season, especially if they can find an overseas batsman to replace Elgar. What do you make of the Maynard decision Wareham? He has never struck me as particular popular with the Somerset members. Interesting that it is rumored that a failure to replace Elgar is one of the reasons why he has been asked to leave. Notts started the season with a test standard bowling attack but have ended it without Broad, Ball, Pattinson and Fletcher. They also lost Lumb and Brendan Taylor mid season. On reflection it is not a surprise that they have fallen back towards the pack. That said it looks like they have saved themselves. Chris Read is one of the new Notts players I can abide so at least it was his runs that saved them. I'm just going to console myself with the supposition that the perilous nature of the close of play score on day 2 persuaded Jennings to sign for Lancs rather than Notts. Lancs are another side you can lump in with Notts and Warwickshire though. A well resourced county that rely on other sides to produce players for them. Hampshire are mid collapse as I type and they deserve to go down after last season. Stuffed full of Kolpak players too. Fingers crossed they sink without trace today  |
|
warehamgas
Predictions League
Joined: May 2014
Posts: 3,421
|
Post by warehamgas on Sept 28, 2017 15:58:55 GMT
Can't disagree with much of what you've said jack. Apparently a "below average" pitch incurs no points deductions and it been judged as poor then that would have been a possibility. I'm a Somerset fan so I can never be truly neutral about what happens to them but after last seasons collusion between YOrkshire and Middlesex whereby Yorkshire would still go for the runs even if they were 8/9 wickets down meant that between them they shut Somerset out so I don't believe the ECB would dare take points away to save Middlesex this time around. If they do there will be a major problem for cricket imo. Last year the Somerset team and officers though disappointed didn't complain about the contrived result and took their medicine. Although one of the few matches I missed this season due to being in Oz at the moment following it on BBC website and local radio told me that Middlesex players made some very bad shots and collapsed in both innings. Yes it did turn but listening to Matt Maynard the actual match itself totalled more runs than any other division one match, we had a 100 and some high scores for other players. That none of these played for Middlesex says more about the Middlesex players lacking resolve to fight it out than the quality of the pitch. The counties have been asked to prepare pitches that give spin a chance and when they do, Somerset at least are criticised. Maynard was angry about the report on the pitch because the groundmen at Taunton have worked hard to create wickets that give bowlers and batsmen a chance and which make for exciting cricket.
Yes MM leaving has surprised me with one year of his contract to go. But over the past two years he has faced some criticism, unfairly imo, from members. He was criticised for some of his team decisions and selections and rumours this year persist about discontent with some senior pros. I don't know if they were true as, like at Rovers, I'm not itk. I hear a lot of rumours but don't know the actual truth. The failure to sign a good number 3 or possible opener has really affected Somerset this season. It was obvious, with Rogers going at the end of last season, that we needed an opener or a number 3 who would get a 1000+ runs. Every member or spectator who watched Somerset knew this. Edgar, leaving in June to play for SA, was never going to be the answer, although he did well. Come the last half of the season Somerset did what they always do and played well to be the best in-form team in the league in August and September. And for those matches, only Tim Groenewald and Roelof VD Merwe, and he only played in two matches, were unable to play for England. And of the other 10 players (not counting VDM) in the main 11 only Steve Davies didn't come through our academy or youth teams. Now I think that is a fantastic stat, one that few other counties come close to equalling. And that played a large part in our survival, despite the pressure and looking likely to be relegated all season they have never looked like they accepted it, they kept fighting, they have played with spirit and Tom Abell, despite an awful time with the bat early on, has kept his cool and come back into a bit of form, kept the confidence of the players esp the experienced pros like Tres, Hildreth and Trego and handled his bowlers very, very well all season. Maynard has been instrumental in playing the youngsters and I believe that he didn't replace Edgar because he knew he had to let the youngsters have a chance. At that time mid June it looked almost certain we would go down and I wonder if he just thought, let's just let them have a go and we will see what they are like. I don't know but that's my take on it. Whereas Ashley Giles at Warwickshire was playing down and talking down their chances of staying up all season and was very verbal about them getting relegated and building again I think Maynard may have thought the same about Somerset but never came out openly and admitted it and once they got their first win fairly late on at Yorkshire and then thrashed Warwickshire away knew that in August and September we would have a chance. So to answer your question jack you may be right MM did pay with his job for not replacing Edgar but I think it probably stemmed from an earlier failure to secure a number 3 or an opener who could get 1000+ runs during the close season. Now this may strange, esp after the season at the bottom of the table, but I believe had Somerset secured a good number 3 or opener we would have had a good chance of winning the Championship. We bowled out sides twice on many occasions early in the season yet were unable to chase 230-250 to secure wins on a few occasions and couldn't chase just over a 100 at Southampton to beat Hants and settled for a draw when it should have been an easy win. Our bowlers have been fantastic all season and with Jamie Overton and Lewis Gregory out injured since August we have struggled for fast bowlers, fortunately Craig O and Tim G have bowled very well.
Like you I'm keeping a close eye on Hants and actually hope Warwickshire can do Middlesex a favour for exactly the same reasons you've said.
|
|
jackthegas
David Pritchard
Joined: May 2014
Posts: 313
|
Post by jackthegas on Sept 28, 2017 16:51:28 GMT
Hampshire survive again. Pah!
|
|
irishrover
Global Moderator
Joined: June 2014
Posts: 3,372
|
Post by irishrover on Sept 29, 2017 1:46:25 GMT
I think, even taking into account last year's contrivance, every true county cricket fan in the country North of the South Downs was hoping that it was Hampshire that went down. There would have been a certain poetic justice in it. Somerset ultimately did the business - I don't really think Middlesex can honestly have that many complaints about the game this week. Ultimately what kind of cricket do you want? I feel that counties should be encouraged to prepare more home advantage 'result' wickets in the Championship. Particularly in the era of 14 games a season. No doubt that one aspect of having games in September is the number of close low scoring games - all things being equal that's how I would prefer it I think. It just means both runs and wickets are more meaningful ultimately. My view on Somerset is that they probably do have a few too many long in the tooth players and haven't quite transitioned to the next generation becoming consistent match winners. Hildreth had a fairly poor year by his standards (although obviously fully redeemed himself with the critical knock), Trescothick struggled until the very end really and Trego began to show signs of wear. Ultimately they need to start to get to the point where the younger players in the batting lineup carry the load- and that didn't happen this year. I can understand why Maynard has been accountable I think - this should have been a year for Somerset to push on and challenge for trophies and instead they fell back on pretty much all fronts. It might be harsh bit I can see why a message might be sent there. Jack - wouldn't you say the same potentially applied to Dawson at Glos? I mean I know the challenges are massive but, when it comes to it, Glos have been terrible this season right? I'm not saying sack the coach necessarily but surely they have to do something - pretty underwhelming stuff. If I was still a member I think I'd be quite grumpy - aren't we supposed to be in the golden post-ground redevelopment era?
It is disappointing Notts sneaked it in the end although I agree that no one could begrudge Chris Read playing that crucial knock - what a great way for a county legend to sign off a pretty spectacular career that, sadly, we are very unlikely to see the likes of again. I would slightly defend Lancs (only slightly though). It's not quite the same as the well resourced club that poaches players because they can't produce their own. From personal experience I would say that Lancs are in deep financial crap and keep being forced to cut back on their youth development. A huge number of youth coaches and development officers have been laid off by Lancs in the last few years and they are currently struggling to hold on to their own promising young players as a result - many of the best are defecting to Yorks and Warwickshire. That is different for me from Notts who simply choose not to invest and develop in the youth and recreational cricket in their area which, again from personal experience, is of a shocking standard. All of this does indeed speak well to Somerset's success in developing home grown talent. In any case Onions is a poor signing in my view - huge risk as to how often he gets on the field and is ultimately just a replacement for Jarvis (downgrade in my view given their relative ages) who is going back to Zimbabwe. Jennings is a good signing but was clearly not going to stay at Durham whatever happened.
As for Surrey's declaration - I'm not really sure how it went down. This is probably my biggest work period of the year so I wasn't able to get down to Old Trafford this week but I don't get the impression there were massive objections. To some degree the battle for 2nd place is simply about players bonuses right? I'm not sure fans get particularly excited about it. Gareth Batty is a bit of a North/South divide thing. Northern cricket fans see a proper hard bitten tough professional who gives nothing and takes every advantage going while Southern cricket fans see a borderline cheat on the whole. In one of the first games I played up here I was absolutely bollocked by my skipper because I walked for a knick behind - 'if you carry on like that you won't get picked next week - that's not how we do it up here'.......it was a friendly! Game is genuinely played in a different way........the expectation is you will take every single inch going - that is seen as part of sportsmanship not in opposition to it. |
|
jackthegas
David Pritchard
Joined: May 2014
Posts: 313
|
Post by jackthegas on Oct 3, 2017 12:23:14 GMT
Jack - wouldn't you say the same potentially applied to Dawson at Glos? I mean I know the challenges are massive but, when it comes to it, Glos have been terrible this season right? I'm not saying sack the coach necessarily but surely they have to do something - pretty underwhelming stuff. If I was still a member I think I'd be quite grumpy - aren't we supposed to be in the golden post-ground redevelopment era?
I am a bit out of the loop if I'm honest and I haven't seen Gloucestershire at all this year with the exception of a T20 game on TV. If I was still a Glos member though I would be appalled at their inability to develop their own players. For a middle - sized county to have failed to have produced anyone who has even come close to England selection since Jon Lewis more than a decade ago is dreadful. I firmly subscribe to the view that developing players who can play for England is the primary remit of the 18 first class counties. I would even settle for picking up other Counties young cast offs and giving them a chance to develop. The kind of record we have doesn't get turned around overnight and I wonder if there are green shoots of recovery on that front. The likes of Dent, Taylor(s), Hankins, Miles and Norwell are at least a core of players who have some connection to the County and have forged semi decent careers as a cricketer. Bracey made an encouraging start to his career and the signing of Ryan Higgins is a better signing than anything we managed last season (Chris Liddle for heavens sake!) On the other hand you could probably argue that they were all young players of some promise and not one of them has really kicked on. Miles is the only player who I think could play first division cricket and he Maybe the pathway is better but the coaching isn't? Either way a clear strategy would help. |
|
irishrover
Global Moderator
Joined: June 2014
Posts: 3,372
|
Post by irishrover on Oct 3, 2017 13:21:35 GMT
Jack - wouldn't you say the same potentially applied to Dawson at Glos? I mean I know the challenges are massive but, when it comes to it, Glos have been terrible this season right? I'm not saying sack the coach necessarily but surely they have to do something - pretty underwhelming stuff. If I was still a member I think I'd be quite grumpy - aren't we supposed to be in the golden post-ground redevelopment era?
I am a bit out of the loop if I'm honest and I haven't seen Gloucestershire at all this year with the exception of a T20 game on TV. If I was still a Glos member though I would be appalled at their inability to develop their own players. For a middle - sized county to have failed to have produced anyone who has even come close to England selection since Jon Lewis more than a decade ago is dreadful. I firmly subscribe to the view that developing players who can play for England is the primary remit of the 18 first class counties. I would even settle for picking up other Counties young cast offs and giving them a chance to develop. The kind of record we have doesn't get turned around overnight and I wonder if there are green shoots of recovery on that front. The likes of Dent, Taylor(s), Hankins, Miles and Norwell are at least a core of players who have some connection to the County and have forged semi decent careers as a cricketer. Bracey made an encouraging start to his career and the signing of Ryan Higgins is a better signing than anything we managed last season (Chris Liddle for heavens sake!) On the other hand you could probably argue that they were all young players of some promise and not one of them has really kicked on. Miles is the only player who I think could play first division cricket and he Maybe the pathway is better but the coaching isn't? Either way a clear strategy would help. Yes -I would agree with all of that. Higgins seems to me like the most interesting signing they have made in years at least. I can never understand why Gloucestershire are so happy to rest on their laurels - no real interest in developing the club or building up a stronger support base despite, on the face of it, have everything going for them in that regard. |
|
