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Post by swissgas on Oct 9, 2024 20:49:01 GMT
The strategy of trying to divide a father and son by hurling vicious abuse at the son is never going to work. But failing strategies are what you enthusiastically supported between 2020 and 2023. I've put forward my view of how the Al-Saeeds should be running the club but in a constructive and polite way which I believe has far more chance of success. We need an experienced CEO and CFO working alongside Abdullatif to guide and mentor him. And once we have strong confident leadership from the top the positivity will soon filter down to George Friend, Matt Taylor, his coaches, his players and the administrative staff who keep the club running on a day to day basis. Alongside this the leadership need to communicate their strategy to Gasheads and other stakeholders so we know where we are going and how we are going to get there. The bits and pieces of information we've been given so far in relation to the football strategy and the stadium and training ground developments don't add up. There is no meat on the bones, no prioritization, no visible plan or even any objective other than "the dream". The owners have got to do better and we can encourage them by putting forward constructive ideas whereas abusing them in the way you've done is playing with fire and won't help Rovers at all. |
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Post by irenestoyboy on Oct 9, 2024 21:05:37 GMT
The strategy of trying to divide a father and son by hurling vicious abuse at the son is never going to work. But failing strategies are what you enthusiastically supported between 2020 and 2023. I've put forward my view of how the Al-Saeeds should be running the club but in a constructive and polite way which I believe has far more chance of success. We need an experienced CEO and CFO working alongside Abdullatif to guide and mentor him. And once we have strong confident leadership from the top the positivity will soon filter down to George Friend, Matt Taylor, his coaches, his players and the administrative staff who keep the club running on a day to day basis. Alongside this the leadership need to communicate their strategy to Gasheads and other stakeholders so we know where we are going and how we are going to get there. The bits and pieces of information we've been given so far in relation to the football strategy and the stadium and training ground developments don't add up. There is no meat on the bones, no prioritization, no visible plan or even any objective other than "the dream". The owners have got to do better and we can encourage them by putting forward constructive ideas whereas abusing them in the way you've done is playing with fire and won't help Rovers at all.   No one is trying to divide father and son. Son is behaving appallingly ant times and father needs to get a grip of him. It's as simple as that. Abdul is not the owner, his father is but the monkeys are running the circus and hes becoming a liability on the footballing side of the club. (That's coming from many people inside the club and for the record, Wael has told me nothing as is often the accusation on here). People inside the football industry are also talking negatively about us. You have been a director, you know how incesteous this industry is. Players, agents, managers, PFA reps, club secs and scouts all talk. Well done for constructively saying something, other have also tried. Did they listen to you? Because I recall you saying the same things 12 months or so ago and Abdul is still swinging his proverbial around the place with his mates. Abdul it would appear is incapable of having anyone tell him what to do let alone have a mentoring influence upon him and the fact we have half of his university class on the board or in senior positions is also a massive worry. These are inexperienced silver spoon kids with no idea of the real world, no idea how to treat and talk to people and zero idea how to run a football club. You were the first to slate Tom G on here, and rightly so, his record wasn't without blemish or fault, but Abdul and his mates are making Tom look like Alan Sugar. I fear and worry for the club, it seems utterly rudderless at the top with no actual experienced business or football people at the club. |
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bondigas
Joined: December 2017
Posts: 410 
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Post by bondigas on Oct 9, 2024 21:40:31 GMT
He who pays the piper always plays the tune whether with silver spoons in their mouths or not. The last majority shareholder appointed a CEO who was found hopelessly wanting and out of his depth. The club now has a new majority shareholder who has appointed his CEO with his backing as Chairman of the club. However much people protest about the present CEO their efforts are misguided, blood is always thicker than water and only time will tell where this all ends.It certainly will not be in the present owners interest to trash the club and cause unrest.
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Post by swissgas on Oct 9, 2024 22:04:43 GMT
The strategy of trying to divide a father and son by hurling vicious abuse at the son is never going to work. But failing strategies are what you enthusiastically supported between 2020 and 2023. I've put forward my view of how the Al-Saeeds should be running the club but in a constructive and polite way which I believe has far more chance of success. We need an experienced CEO and CFO working alongside Abdullatif to guide and mentor him. And once we have strong confident leadership from the top the positivity will soon filter down to George Friend, Matt Taylor, his coaches, his players and the administrative staff who keep the club running on a day to day basis. Alongside this the leadership need to communicate their strategy to Gasheads and other stakeholders so we know where we are going and how we are going to get there. The bits and pieces of information we've been given so far in relation to the football strategy and the stadium and training ground developments don't add up. There is no meat on the bones, no prioritization, no visible plan or even any objective other than "the dream". The owners have got to do better and we can encourage them by putting forward constructive ideas whereas abusing them in the way you've done is playing with fire and won't help Rovers at all. No one is trying to divide father and son. Son is behaving appallingly ant times and father needs to get a grip of him. It's as simple as that. Abdul is not the owner, his father is but the monkeys are running the circus and hes becoming a liability on the footballing side of the club. (That's coming from many people inside the club and for the record, Wael has told me nothing as is often the accusation on here). People inside the football industry are also talking negatively about us. You have been a director, you know how incesteous this industry is. Players, agents, managers, PFA reps, club secs and scouts all talk. Well done for constructively saying something, other have also tried. Did they listen to you? Because I recall you saying the same things 12 months or so ago and Abdul is still swinging his proverbial around the place with his mates. Abdul it would appear is incapable of having anyone tell him what to do let alone have a mentoring influence upon him and the fact we have half of his university class on the board or in senior positions is also a massive worry. These are inexperienced silver spoon kids with no idea of the real world, no idea how to treat and talk to people and zero idea how to run a football club. You were the first to slate Tom G on here, and rightly so, his record wasn't without blemish or fault, but Abdul and his mates are making Tom look like Alan Sugar. I fear and worry for the club, it seems utterly rudderless at the top with no actual experienced business or football people at the club. Do you get the irony of what you have written ? "These are inexperienced silver spoon kids with no idea of the real world, no idea how to treat and talk to people and zero idea how to run a football club." In 2020 circumstances conspired to put Wael in a position where he could take full control of the club whereas previously his father had installed mechanisms designed to help him succeed but also to prevent him from falling down due to inexperience. At the time I posted that this could be a good thing for Rovers so long as Wael brought the right people into the club and was willing to take good advice because otherwise we could be going down a rocky road. We went down the rocky road and ended up with the Al-Saeeds. Now we appear to be facing similar circumstances but the good thing is that Hussain is still around and so we can try to persuade him to make changes but this has to be done in a constructive way. We cannot go down the route of only bringing in people who are "yes men" and who's only attribute is that they praise "the boss" at every opportunity. Tom Gorringe thought this was the way to the top and was duped into believing that he was a world beater. When he was encouraged to speak at conferences and give podcast to tell us how a football club should be run it was cringeworthy. What we got was "cheese grater" professionalism and one look at the accounts showed the mess the club was in. If he decides to stay in football I hope he goes back at the right level and learns from his experience at Rovers. If Hussain is in this for the long term then he has a chance now to persuade Abdullatif to accept that this adventure will only be successful if he brings in experienced people and allows them to run the business in a financially disciplined way and the club is prepared to be transparent with stakeholders. There may be friction and disagreements along the way but if the right people are recruited Abdullatif will learn from them and hone his skill set so that in a few years he really will become an effective leader of a professional football club. That transparency has to include answering the question hanging over the training ground project about whether selling land for someone to build 70 houses and at the same time constructing a new training ground there with sufficient additional room for the academy and the womens team with a big new building housing an indoor pitch is pie in the sky. Looking at an aerial view of the site, it's shape and the nature of the terrain suggests to me that it is. The other question is about the development of the Mem because a successful business always takes great care to establish priorities and to my way of thinking increasing capacity for the sake of it is way down the list. To contemplate putting in more structures like the South Stand and surrounding them with student apartments to pay for it doesn't make sense to me. |
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Post by irenestoyboy on Oct 9, 2024 22:09:28 GMT
He who pays the piper always plays the tune whether with silver spoons in their mouths or not. The last majority shareholder appointed a CEO who was found hopelessly wanting and out of his depth. The club now has a new majority shareholder who has appointed his CEO with his backing as Chairman of the club. However much people protest about the present CEO their efforts are misguided, blood is always thicker than water and only time will tell where this all ends.It certainly will not be in the present owners interest to trash the club and cause unrest. The last CEO dragged us into the 21st century from a commercial perspective where the last "stadium manager" ran it like an old pals club and outsourced lots of things because we/he didn't have the skill set to do ourselves. However when made CEO he had no mentor and learned on the job. As a result made huge mistakes, allowed his ego to get in the way on more than one occasion. History is repeating itself again. The chairman needs to get hold of his CEO and give him a good bollocking, whether that's in the father and son sense or professional one, it won't matter at this stage, but as the organ grinder, he needs to exercise a bit of control. |
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Post by irenestoyboy on Oct 10, 2024 10:52:48 GMT
No one is trying to divide father and son. Son is behaving appallingly ant times and father needs to get a grip of him. It's as simple as that. Abdul is not the owner, his father is but the monkeys are running the circus and hes becoming a liability on the footballing side of the club. (That's coming from many people inside the club and for the record, Wael has told me nothing as is often the accusation on here). People inside the football industry are also talking negatively about us. You have been a director, you know how incesteous this industry is. Players, agents, managers, PFA reps, club secs and scouts all talk. Well done for constructively saying something, other have also tried. Did they listen to you? Because I recall you saying the same things 12 months or so ago and Abdul is still swinging his proverbial around the place with his mates. Abdul it would appear is incapable of having anyone tell him what to do let alone have a mentoring influence upon him and the fact we have half of his university class on the board or in senior positions is also a massive worry. These are inexperienced silver spoon kids with no idea of the real world, no idea how to treat and talk to people and zero idea how to run a football club. You were the first to slate Tom G on here, and rightly so, his record wasn't without blemish or fault, but Abdul and his mates are making Tom look like Alan Sugar. I fear and worry for the club, it seems utterly rudderless at the top with no actual experienced business or football people at the club.
" These are inexperienced silver spoon kids with no idea of the real world, no idea how to treat and talk to people and zero idea how to run a football club."
If you are saying that the ALQ family and Wael as president was the same when he first came in, then I would agree with you Wael had no FC experience but was a bit older, had worked in the football industry and was well connected. He also didnt come in, raise prices and isolate football managers, club secretaries and players. We also didnt have 25 year old uni grads as Finance Directors and a cousin who thinks he is Bristol Rovers answer to Juni Calafat. The nepotism is as bad as the scouse mafia and we know how that played out. So the circumstances are also very different as is the behaviour. In 2020 circumstances conspired to put Wael in a position where he could take full control of the club whereas previously his father had installed mechanisms designed to help him succeed but also to prevent him from falling down due to inexperience. At the time I posted that this could be a good thing for Rovers so long as Wael brought the right people into the club and was willing to take good advice because otherwise we could be going down a rocky road. We went down the rocky road and ended up with the Al-Saeeds.I think some of the mechanisms prevented the ALQ family and in the long term from Wael succeding, with the mechanism being Hani and Hamer. Hamer threw the company credit card around frivilously and yet Hani refused to build the UWE stadium insisting it was a bad financial deal for the club, which was a total nonsense. Martyn Starnes (employed by Wael), for some of his faults, was a decent man, who sussed out that Hamer was feathering his own nest and was a 2 faced liar. He got hold of the company finances and stopped most of the leaks as well as bringing a bit of professionalism to the boardroom. However that itself caused its own issues with Hamer now with his nose out of joint trying to force a coup d'etat with the SC and PC who had the sum total of ÂŁ100k to "rescue" the club from Jordanian hands. We all know the fall out from there. If the ALQs had built the UWE and spent ÂŁ30m 8 years ago, and I fully believe if it was Wael's decision he would have done it, (an opinion which DC has too) we would be in a vastly superior position. Had Hamer not at the last minute of the take over, gone to Hani and insisted that Nick and Ed (who were to stay on as directors to see the UWE project through) be removed or the plug on the takeover will be pulled, the club would have had some "fan representation" on the board as well as all the knowledge of getting the stadium built. It was no surprise that as soon as Wael took full control he tried to resurrect the UWE arrangement, but they were no longer interested in working with us having been strung along for so many years. Now Steve Hamer was meant to be, or presented himself as the polished footballing executive once of Swansea. What he actually turned out to be was a fraud and a ****house who played a part in the huge failure of how the club was run after the ALQ take over, the split between SC/PC and the club, and played a part in the failure of the UWE stadium project by sidelining the very people we needed because be over inflated ego felt threatened. That sliding doors moment in itself would have meant we wouldnt be down such a rocky road with the AlSaeeds now. Now we appear to be facing similar circumstances but the good thing is that Hussain is still around and so we can try to persuade him to make changes but this has to be done in a constructive way.
We cannot go down the route of only bringing in people who are "yes men" and who's only attribute is that they praise "the boss" at every opportunity. Tom Gorringe thought this was the way to the top and was duped into believing that he was a world beater. When he was encouraged to speak at conferences and give podcast to tell us how a football club should be run it was cringeworthy. What we got was "cheese grater" professionalism and one look at the accounts showed the mess the club was in. If he decides to stay in football I hope he goes back at the right level and learns from his experience at Rovers.
I agree on some of your points here. If Hussain is in this for the long term then he has a chance now to persuade Abdullatif to accept that this adventure will only be successful if he brings in experienced people and allows them to run the business in a financially disciplined way and the club is prepared to be transparent with stakeholders. There may be friction and disagreements along the way but if the right people are recruited Abdullatif will learn from them and hone his skill set so that in a few years he really will become an effective leader of a professional football club.
It needs to start with him acting like "the owner" for starters and controlling his seemingly out of control son with his uni mates playing championship manager with us. I agree we need 2 experienced business hands, preferably with footballing knowledge to come in and run the club. That transparency has to include answering the question hanging over the training ground project about whether selling land for someone to build 70 houses and at the same time constructing a new training ground there with sufficient additional room for the academy and the womens team with a big new building housing an indoor pitch is pie in the sky. Looking at an aerial view of the site, it's shape and the nature of the terrain suggests to me that it is.We certainly wont be getting "13 pitches" in on the site even without selling the land. So far, I dont believe a word of what Abdul says which is why we need more commincation from Hussain. The other question is about the development of the Mem because a successful business always takes great care to establish priorities and to my way of thinking increasing capacity for the sake of it is way down the list. To contemplate putting in more structures like the South Stand and surrounding them with student apartments to pay for it doesn't make sense to me.
Agree to a point, but the Mem is a crumbling ramshackle of a stadium with awul facilities. So we need to do something and if it isnt a new stadium, then we have to model the Mem around a business plan. |
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Post by rowdenhill on Oct 10, 2024 11:08:55 GMT
We should keep on at them in unsparing terms until they either get cracking or sell to someone with understanding.
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Post by a more piratey game on Oct 10, 2024 11:28:41 GMT
Do you get the irony of what you have written ?
" These are inexperienced silver spoon kids with no idea of the real world, no idea how to treat and talk to people and zero idea how to run a football club."
If you are saying that the ALQ family and Wael as president was the same when he first came in, then I would agree with you Wael had no FC experience but was a bit older, had worked in the football industry and was well connected. He also didnt come in, raise prices and isolate football managers, club secretaries and players. We also didnt have 25 year old uni grads as Finance Directors and a cousin who thinks he is Bristol Rovers answer to Juni Calafat. The nepotism is as bad as the scouse mafia and we know how that played out. So the circumstances are also very different as is the behaviour. In 2020 circumstances conspired to put Wael in a position where he could take full control of the club whereas previously his father had installed mechanisms designed to help him succeed but also to prevent him from falling down due to inexperience. At the time I posted that this could be a good thing for Rovers so long as Wael brought the right people into the club and was willing to take good advice because otherwise we could be going down a rocky road. We went down the rocky road and ended up with the Al-Saeeds.I think some of the mechanisms prevented the ALQ family and in the long term from Wael succeding, with the mechanism being Hani and Hamer. Hamer threw the company credit card around frivilously and yet Hani refused to build the UWE stadium insisting it was a bad financial deal for the club, which was a total nonsense. Martyn Starnes (employed by Wael), for some of his faults, was a decent man, who sussed out that Hamer was feathering his own nest and was a 2 faced liar. He got hold of the company finances and stopped most of the leaks as well as bringing a bit of professionalism to the boardroom. However that itself caused its own issues with Hamer now with his nose out of joint trying to force a coup d'etat with the SC and PC who had the sum total of ÂŁ100k to "rescue" the club from Jordanian hands. We all know the fall out from there. If the ALQs had built the UWE and spent ÂŁ30m 8 years ago, and I fully believe if it was Waels decision he would have done it too (an opinion which DC has too). Had Hamer not at the last minute of the take over, gone to Hani and insisted that Nick and Ed (who were to stay on as directors to see the UWE project through) been kept on, the club would have had some "fan representation" on the board as well as all the knowledge of getting the stadium built. It was no surprise that as soon as Wael took full control he tried to resurrect the UWE arrangement, but they were no longer interested in working with us having been strung along for so many years. That sliding doors moment in itself would have meant we wouldnt be down such a rocky road with the AlSaeeds now. Now we appear to be facing similar circumstances but the good thing is that Hussain is still around and so we can try to persuade him to make changes but this has to be done in a constructive way.
We cannot go down the route of only bringing in people who are "yes men" and who's only attribute is that they praise "the boss" at every opportunity. Tom Gorringe thought this was the way to the top and was duped into believing that he was a world beater. When he was encouraged to speak at conferences and give podcast to tell us how a football club should be run it was cringeworthy. What we got was "cheese grater" professionalism and one look at the accounts showed the mess the club was in. If he decides to stay in football I hope he goes back at the right level and learns from his experience at Rovers.
I agree on some of your points here. If Hussain is in this for the long term then he has a chance now to persuade Abdullatif to accept that this adventure will only be successful if he brings in experienced people and allows them to run the business in a financially disciplined way and the club is prepared to be transparent with stakeholders. There may be friction and disagreements along the way but if the right people are recruited Abdullatif will learn from them and hone his skill set so that in a few years he really will become an effective leader of a professional football club.
It needs to start with him acting like "the owner" for starters and controlling his seemingly out of control son with his uni mates playing championship manager with us. I agree we need 2 experienced business hands, preferably with footballing knowledge to come in and run the club. That transparency has to include answering the question hanging over the training ground project about whether selling land for someone to build 70 houses and at the same time constructing a new training ground there with sufficient additional room for the academy and the womens team with a big new building housing an indoor pitch is pie in the sky. Looking at an aerial view of the site, it's shape and the nature of the terrain suggests to me that it is.We certainly wont be getting "13 pitches" in on the site even without selling the land. So far, I dont believe a word of what Abdul says which is why we need more commincation from Hussain. The other question is about the development of the Mem because a successful business always takes great care to establish priorities and to my way of thinking increasing capacity for the sake of it is way down the list. To contemplate putting in more structures like the South Stand and surrounding them with student apartments to pay for it doesn't make sense to me.
Agree to a point, but the Mem is a crumbling ramshackle of a stadium with awul facilities. So we need to do something and if it isnt a new stadium, then we have to model the Mem around a business plan. that's a very interesting post IMO |
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Post by a more piratey game on Oct 10, 2024 15:17:09 GMT
bits I remember are: Abdullatif said to be interfering in team selection, leading to a rift with MT. MT told to play Brown at the end of last season to 'put him in the shop window for sale' Jack Hunt caught in the middle. MT told not to play him, but decided to anyway last match as the writing might have been on the wall so MT had little to lose. Maybe told not to play him as it would trigger an extra contract payment - I'm not sure Some mention of a rift between MT and George Friend. Some mention of MT having 'lost the dressing room' Pick the bones of truth out of the soup of bollocks? If the bit about picking Hunt is true, and it’s a very big IF, then MT is on borrowed time I really hope not - I remain very hopeful about him, Friend, and the squad, and think that this has the potential to build very nicely |
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Post by swissgas on Oct 10, 2024 16:53:03 GMT
Do you get the irony of what you have written ?
" These are inexperienced silver spoon kids with no idea of the real world, no idea how to treat and talk to people and zero idea how to run a football club."
If you are saying that the ALQ family and Wael as president was the same when he first came in, then I would agree with you Wael had no FC experience but was a bit older, had worked in the football industry and was well connected. He also didnt come in, raise prices and isolate football managers, club secretaries and players. We also didnt have 25 year old uni grads as Finance Directors and a cousin who thinks he is Bristol Rovers answer to Juni Calafat. The nepotism is as bad as the scouse mafia and we know how that played out. So the circumstances are also very different as is the behaviour. In 2020 circumstances conspired to put Wael in a position where he could take full control of the club whereas previously his father had installed mechanisms designed to help him succeed but also to prevent him from falling down due to inexperience. At the time I posted that this could be a good thing for Rovers so long as Wael brought the right people into the club and was willing to take good advice because otherwise we could be going down a rocky road. We went down the rocky road and ended up with the Al-Saeeds.I think some of the mechanisms prevented the ALQ family and in the long term from Wael succeding, with the mechanism being Hani and Hamer. Hamer threw the company credit card around frivilously and yet Hani refused to build the UWE stadium insisting it was a bad financial deal for the club, which was a total nonsense. Martyn Starnes (employed by Wael), for some of his faults, was a decent man, who sussed out that Hamer was feathering his own nest and was a 2 faced liar. He got hold of the company finances and stopped most of the leaks as well as bringing a bit of professionalism to the boardroom. However that itself caused its own issues with Hamer now with his nose out of joint trying to force a coup d'etat with the SC and PC who had the sum total of ÂŁ100k to "rescue" the club from Jordanian hands. We all know the fall out from there. If the ALQs had built the UWE and spent ÂŁ30m 8 years ago, and I fully believe if it was Wael's decision he would have done it. (an opinion which DC has too). Had Hamer not at the last minute of the take over, gone to Hani and insisted that Nick and Ed (who were to stay on as directors to see the UWE project through) be removed or the plug on the takeover will be pulled, the club would have had some "fan representation" on the board as well as all the knowledge of getting the stadium built. It was no surprise that as soon as Wael took full control he tried to resurrect the UWE arrangement, but they were no longer interested in working with us having been strung along for so many years. Now Steve Hamer was meant to be, or presented himself as the polished footballing executive once of Swansea. What he actually turned out to be was a fraud and a ****house who played a part in the huge failure of how the club was run after the ALQ take over, the split between SC/PC and the club, and played a part in the failure of the UWE stadium project by sidelining the very people we needed because be over inflated ego felt threatened. That sliding doors moment in itself would have meant we wouldnt be down such a rocky road with the AlSaeeds now. Now we appear to be facing similar circumstances but the good thing is that Hussain is still around and so we can try to persuade him to make changes but this has to be done in a constructive way.
We cannot go down the route of only bringing in people who are "yes men" and who's only attribute is that they praise "the boss" at every opportunity. Tom Gorringe thought this was the way to the top and was duped into believing that he was a world beater. When he was encouraged to speak at conferences and give podcast to tell us how a football club should be run it was cringeworthy. What we got was "cheese grater" professionalism and one look at the accounts showed the mess the club was in. If he decides to stay in football I hope he goes back at the right level and learns from his experience at Rovers.
I agree on some of your points here. If Hussain is in this for the long term then he has a chance now to persuade Abdullatif to accept that this adventure will only be successful if he brings in experienced people and allows them to run the business in a financially disciplined way and the club is prepared to be transparent with stakeholders. There may be friction and disagreements along the way but if the right people are recruited Abdullatif will learn from them and hone his skill set so that in a few years he really will become an effective leader of a professional football club.
It needs to start with him acting like "the owner" for starters and controlling his seemingly out of control son with his uni mates playing championship manager with us. I agree we need 2 experienced business hands, preferably with footballing knowledge to come in and run the club. That transparency has to include answering the question hanging over the training ground project about whether selling land for someone to build 70 houses and at the same time constructing a new training ground there with sufficient additional room for the academy and the womens team with a big new building housing an indoor pitch is pie in the sky. Looking at an aerial view of the site, it's shape and the nature of the terrain suggests to me that it is.We certainly wont be getting "13 pitches" in on the site even without selling the land. So far, I dont believe a word of what Abdul says which is why we need more commincation from Hussain. The other question is about the development of the Mem because a successful business always takes great care to establish priorities and to my way of thinking increasing capacity for the sake of it is way down the list. To contemplate putting in more structures like the South Stand and surrounding them with student apartments to pay for it doesn't make sense to me.
Agree to a point, but the Mem is a crumbling ramshackle of a stadium with awul facilities. So we need to do something and if it isnt a new stadium, then we have to model the Mem around a business plan. So, to summarise, you believe the failure between 2016 and 2023 was all down to Hani Al-Qadi and Steve Hamer and in 2024 it is down to Abdullatif Al-Saeed. And as a result of the aforementioned mismanagement Rovers are in complete disarray with the manager, coaches, players and office staff all totally demoralized, our reputation is in tatters, we have a ramshackle stadium with awful facilities and we should not believe a word of what is being claimed about the development of the training ground. The solution you seem to be putting forward is to persuade the affable Hussain that Wael must be brought back into the fold and that if he does come back then Rovers will finally start on the road to success because we will benefit from Wael's extensive business and football knowledge. And your cunning method of achieving this goal is to go on social media and call Abdullatif all the names under the sun. I have to be honest ITB, I don't think it's going to work. |
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Post by a more piratey game on Oct 10, 2024 17:12:28 GMT
So, to summarise, you believe the failure between 2016 and 2023 was all down to Hani Al-Qadi and Steve Hamer and in 2024 it is down to Abdullatif Al-Saeed. And as a result of the aforementioned mismanagement Rovers are in complete disarray with the manager, coaches, players and office staff all totally demoralized, our reputation is in tatters, we have a ramshackle stadium with awful facilities and we should not believe a word of what is being claimed about the development of the training ground. The solution you seem to be putting forward is to persuade the affable Hussain that Wael must be brought back into the fold and that if he does come back then Rovers will finally start on the road to success because we will benefit from Wael's extensive business and football knowledge. And your cunning method of achieving this goal is to go on social media and call Abdullatif all the names under the sun. I have to be honest ITB, I don't think it's going to work. really struggling to see how you infer that from what ITB has written - which seemed clear enough to me the main prescription ITB wrote was.... 'chance now to persuade Abdullatif to accept that this adventure will only be successful if he brings in experienced people and allows them to run the business in a financially disciplined way and the club is prepared to be transparent with stakeholders. There may be friction and disagreements along the way but if the right people are recruited Abdullatif will learn from them and hone his skill set so that in a few years he really will become an effective leader of a professional football club. That transparency has to include answering the question hanging over the training ground project about whether selling land for someone to build'.....That seems to me to be very different to what you wrote |
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Post by swissgas on Oct 10, 2024 17:18:22 GMT
So, to summarise, you believe the failure between 2016 and 2023 was all down to Hani Al-Qadi and Steve Hamer and in 2024 it is down to Abdullatif Al-Saeed. And as a result of the aforementioned mismanagement Rovers are in complete disarray with the manager, coaches, players and office staff all totally demoralized, our reputation is in tatters, we have a ramshackle stadium with awful facilities and we should not believe a word of what is being claimed about the development of the training ground. The solution you seem to be putting forward is to persuade the affable Hussain that Wael must be brought back into the fold and that if he does come back then Rovers will finally start on the road to success because we will benefit from Wael's extensive business and football knowledge. And your cunning method of achieving this goal is to go on social media and call Abdullatif all the names under the sun. I have to be honest ITB, I don't think it's going to work. really struggling to see how you infer that from what ITB has written - which seemed clear enough to me the main prescription ITB wrote was.... 'chance now to persuade Abdullatif to accept that this adventure will only be successful if he brings in experienced people and allows them to run the business in a financially disciplined way and the club is prepared to be transparent with stakeholders. There may be friction and disagreements along the way but if the right people are recruited Abdullatif will learn from them and hone his skill set so that in a few years he really will become an effective leader of a professional football club. That transparency has to include answering the question hanging over the training ground project about whether selling land for someone to build'.....That seems to me to be very different to what you wrote That is the prescription I wrote Piratey. It's a little sideline I have if you're interested  |
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Post by irenestoyboy on Oct 10, 2024 17:18:27 GMT
So, to summarise, you believe the failure between 2016 and 2023 was all down to Hani Al-Qadi and Steve Hamer and in 2024 it is down to Abdullatif Al-Saeed. And as a result of the aforementioned mismanagement Rovers are in complete disarray with the manager, coaches, players and office staff all totally demoralized, our reputation is in tatters, we have a ramshackle stadium with awful facilities and we should not believe a word of what is being claimed about the development of the training ground. The solution you seem to be putting forward is to persuade the affable Hussain that Wael must be brought back into the fold and that if he does come back then Rovers will finally start on the road to success because we will benefit from Wael's extensive business and football knowledge. And your cunning method of achieving this goal is to go on social media and call Abdullatif all the names under the sun. I have to be honest ITB, I don't think it's going to work. Thats not what I have said at all, read what I have written again. Do you read what I post and then make up and add bits to suit to lever it in to a strange thought process, narrative or opnion you want to have of me? You said that Wael needed mechanisms to prevent his failure. I'm saying we had those mechanisms which failed us to start with which then sowed the seeds of further failure down the road when Wael was then majority owner. The biggest failure being not building the UWE stadium. In 2024 the only similarites are that the son of a rich man is running us but that is where the similarities end and Abduls interference and behaivour is unwelcome and distracting. My solution would be for Hussain to step up as our owner, both publicly and behind the scenes. Put a lid on his sons behaviour and interference in the football management sides of the business and allow MT and his team to get on with the job in hand. We also need to get some proper executive staff in that have experience of being leaders and building a structure into club to handle training ground and stadium plans/business models. Wael is no more in terms of controlling interest, so the solution is no longer his domain. The buck now stops at HAS door and its down to him to run us properly. If you think me calling Abdul a spoilt brat is offensive, then be offended snowflake! Its exactly how he has been behaving and if I had behaved in such a way, I could have expected a swift slap upside the head from my old man for being disrespectful to others, especially when you are a few years their junior. |
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Post by irenestoyboy on Oct 10, 2024 17:21:59 GMT
So, to summarise, you believe the failure between 2016 and 2023 was all down to Hani Al-Qadi and Steve Hamer and in 2024 it is down to Abdullatif Al-Saeed. And as a result of the aforementioned mismanagement Rovers are in complete disarray with the manager, coaches, players and office staff all totally demoralized, our reputation is in tatters, we have a ramshackle stadium with awful facilities and we should not believe a word of what is being claimed about the development of the training ground. The solution you seem to be putting forward is to persuade the affable Hussain that Wael must be brought back into the fold and that if he does come back then Rovers will finally start on the road to success because we will benefit from Wael's extensive business and football knowledge. And your cunning method of achieving this goal is to go on social media and call Abdullatif all the names under the sun. I have to be honest ITB, I don't think it's going to work. really struggling to see how you infer that from what ITB has written - which seemed clear enough to me the main prescription ITB wrote was.... 'chance now to persuade Abdullatif to accept that this adventure will only be successful if he brings in experienced people and allows them to run the business in a financially disciplined way and the club is prepared to be transparent with stakeholders. There may be friction and disagreements along the way but if the right people are recruited Abdullatif will learn from them and hone his skill set so that in a few years he really will become an effective leader of a professional football club. That transparency has to include answering the question hanging over the training ground project about whether selling land for someone to build'.....That seems to me to be very different to what you wrote I think on the subject of how we need to move forward we agree more than we disagree. If you could look past the brainwashing that has taken place that I am Waels spokesman or apologist and actually read in black and white what I have written you may actually see that. Feel free to disagree what I replied to you. I would actually be interested on your thoughts on it. |
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Post by a more piratey game on Oct 10, 2024 17:28:54 GMT
really struggling to see how you infer that from what ITB has written - which seemed clear enough to me the main prescription ITB wrote was.... 'chance now to persuade Abdullatif to accept that this adventure will only be successful if he brings in experienced people and allows them to run the business in a financially disciplined way and the club is prepared to be transparent with stakeholders. There may be friction and disagreements along the way but if the right people are recruited Abdullatif will learn from them and hone his skill set so that in a few years he really will become an effective leader of a professional football club. That transparency has to include answering the question hanging over the training ground project about whether selling land for someone to build'.....That seems to me to be very different to what you wrote That is the prescription I wrote Piratey. It's a little sideline I have if you're interested ah, yes! Silly me! My apologies swiss  that'll learn me (it probably won't!) |
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Post by a more piratey game on Oct 10, 2024 17:34:18 GMT
really struggling to see how you infer that from what ITB has written - which seemed clear enough to me the main prescription ITB wrote was.... 'chance now to persuade Abdullatif to accept that this adventure will only be successful if he brings in experienced people and allows them to run the business in a financially disciplined way and the club is prepared to be transparent with stakeholders. There may be friction and disagreements along the way but if the right people are recruited Abdullatif will learn from them and hone his skill set so that in a few years he really will become an effective leader of a professional football club. That transparency has to include answering the question hanging over the training ground project about whether selling land for someone to build'.....That seems to me to be very different to what you wrote I think on the subject of how we need to move forward we agree more than we disagree. If you could look past the brainwashing that has taken place that I am Waels spokesman or apologist and actually read in black and white what I have written you may actually see that. Feel free to disagree what I replied to you. I would actually be interested on your thoughts on it. if that's written to me (ie I'm not confused about this bit as well!) then.... I think the main point you are making is that Abdul and his buddies are behaving very poorly with deleterious effects on both the rest of the club and the club's wider reputation. I have no idea if that's right or not, or in what ways it might be right, so can't really comment which might be a relief to other readers on here |
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Post by irenestoyboy on Oct 10, 2024 17:59:08 GMT
APG,
All I'll say is what Roadman posted on the other forum is true. I heard exactly the same the very same day but from a completely different person who is employed at the club that wasn't Wael Al Qadi.
All I want is for us to be run properly with no egos or dramas, with professionalism and business savvy.
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Post by swissgas on Oct 10, 2024 18:15:21 GMT
So, to summarise, you believe the failure between 2016 and 2023 was all down to Hani Al-Qadi and Steve Hamer and in 2024 it is down to Abdullatif Al-Saeed. And as a result of the aforementioned mismanagement Rovers are in complete disarray with the manager, coaches, players and office staff all totally demoralized, our reputation is in tatters, we have a ramshackle stadium with awful facilities and we should not believe a word of what is being claimed about the development of the training ground. The solution you seem to be putting forward is to persuade the affable Hussain that Wael must be brought back into the fold and that if he does come back then Rovers will finally start on the road to success because we will benefit from Wael's extensive business and football knowledge. And your cunning method of achieving this goal is to go on social media and call Abdullatif all the names under the sun. I have to be honest ITB, I don't think it's going to work. Thats not what I have said at all, read what I have written again. Do you read what I post and then make up and add bits to suit to lever it in to a strange thought process, narrative or opnion you want to have of me? You said that Wael needed mechanisms to prevent his failure. I'm saying we had those mechanisms which failed us to start with which then sowed the seeds of further failure down the road when Wael was then majority owner. The biggest failure being not building the UWE stadium. In 2024 the only similarites are that the son of a rich man is running us but that is where the similarities end and Abduls interference and behaivour is unwelcome and distracting. My solution would be for Hussain to step up as our owner, both publicly and behind the scenes. Put a lid on his sons behaviour and interference in the football management sides of the business and allow MT and his team to get on with the job in hand. We also need to get some proper executive staff in that have experience of being leaders and building a structure into club to handle training ground and stadium plans/business models. Wael is no more in terms of controlling interest, so the solution is no longer his domain. The buck now stops at HAS door and its down to him to run us properly. If you think me calling Abdul a spoilt brat is offensive, then be offended snowflake! Its exactly how he has been behaving and if I had behaved in such a way, I could have expected a swift slap upside the head from my old man for being disrespectful to others, especially when you are a few years their junior. You say in this post " we had those mechanisms which failed us to start with which then sowed the seeds of further failure down the road when Wael was the majority owner. And in your previous posts you said "I think some of the mechanisms prevented the ALQ family and in the long term from Wael succeding, with the mechanism being Hani and Hamer " So there is no doubt you are blaming Hani and Hamer for the failures 2016-2023 and your activity in the last week shows you blame Abdullatif for the failures now. It's so clear you cannot bring yourself to attach any blame to Wael for the past failures but that is by the by because Gasheads are more concerned about what is going to happen in the future. And we are on the same page about wanting Hussain to bring in experienced management to run Rovers in a businesslike way and provide the manager and director of football with the support they need while at the same time improving morale and the public face of our club. So could you please try to persuade Wael that giving interviews like the one he recently gave to Reading FC doesn't help Rovers and only serves to show exactly why he failed. CEO's and DOF's are needed in the Premier League but not in the lower leagues ( he appointed two of each). I've always supported the manager, if he wanted a player I got him a player, for us it worked The new modern way of businessmen coming in who want that structure. Whoever tells you he has the key to success in football he's probably lying. Show me some club that's had success. Football is so random. Don't apply business rules into football. If Rovers are to ever succeed we can't go back to the randomness he talks about we've got to get a proper business structure at the club and operate on the same principles that successful businesses do. We both agree on that don't we ? |
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Post by irenestoyboy on Oct 10, 2024 21:29:08 GMT
Thats not what I have said at all, read what I have written again.  Do you read what I post and then make up and add bits to suit to lever it in to a strange thought process, narrative or opnion you want to have of me? You said that Wael needed mechanisms to prevent his failure.  I'm saying we had those mechanisms which failed us to start with which then sowed the seeds of further failure down the road when Wael was then majority owner.  The biggest failure being not building the UWE stadium. In 2024 the only similarites are that the son of a rich man is running us but that is where the similarities end and Abduls interference and behaivour is unwelcome and distracting. My solution would be for Hussain to step up as our owner, both publicly and behind the scenes.  Put a lid on his sons behaviour and interference in the football management sides of the business and allow MT and his team to get on with the job in hand.  We also need to  get some proper executive staff in that have experience of being leaders and building a structure into club to handle training ground and stadium plans/business models. Wael is no more in terms of controlling interest, so the solution is no longer his domain.  The buck now stops at HAS door and its down to him to run us properly.  If you think me calling Abdul a spoilt brat is offensive, then be offended snowflake!  Its exactly how he has been behaving and if I had behaved in such a way, I could have expected a swift slap upside the head from my old man for being disrespectful to others, especially when you are a few years their junior.  You say in this post " we had those mechanisms which failed us to start with which then sowed the seeds of further failure down the road when Wael was the majority owner. And in your previous posts you said "I think some of the mechanisms prevented the ALQ family and in the long term from Wael succeding, with the mechanism being Hani and Hamer " So there is no doubt you are blaming Hani and Hamer for the failures 2016-2023 and your activity in the last week shows you blame Abdullatif for the failures now. It's so clear you cannot bring yourself to attach any blame to Wael for the past failures but that is by the by because Gasheads are more concerned about what is going to happen in the future. And we are on the same page about wanting Hussain to bring in experienced management to run Rovers in a businesslike way and provide the manager and director of football with the support they need while at the same time improving morale and the public face of our club. So could you please try to persuade Wael that giving interviews like the one he recently gave to Reading FC doesn't help Rovers and only serves to show exactly why he failed. CEO's and DOF's are needed in the Premier League but not in the lower leagues ( he appointed two of each). I've always supported the manager, if he wanted a player I got him a player, for us it worked The new modern way of businessmen coming in who want that structure. Whoever tells you he has the key to success in football he's probably lying. Show me some club that's had success. Football is so random. Don't apply business rules into football. If Rovers are to ever succeed we can't go back to the randomness he talks about we've got to get a proper business structure at the club and operate on the same principles that successful businesses do. We both agree on that don't we ?  I think it's disingenuous and unfair to attribute the blame wholly to Wael for the way the club was run up to his father's death. The ALQ family made it abundantly clear that it was a family partnership with equal say in what should be done and the accounts sheet clearly showed that Hani was the money man and the one which the club relied upon for finances. So how much of an influence and say Wael had in major decisions was probably pretty minimal, even though by title he was our club president. I had a long chat with Darrell Clarke last year and one thing he said was that he was constantly fighting a battle between the 2 brothers and the dad. Wael said he could have something, Hani said no he couldn't. Him and Wael wanted to do something a certain way, Hani said it wasn't going to happen or if it did it would be his way. Who can forget DCs off the record comments about certain members of the board that were recorded by the Bristol Post saying that some of the board were lying to him. It certainly stacks up. Where Wael becomes fully accountable is from 2020 onwards when it was his show. His allowing MS more control to run the club in its entirety with Tommy W was a mistake as was the decision to not appoint another executive to the board to help him and eventually Tom leading to fiascos such as the south stand redevelopment. The appointment of JB that ultimately led to our relegation and the takeover of the scousers, even if ultimately that debt was partially repaid with promotion back to L1. So yes, Wael does have to answer for somethings, but not all, simply because he didn't have the power, influence or money to do anything about it and as I said, the silky football executive who was meant to be the one to lead the club with the ALQs money was a fraud and a liar which caused us more harm and trouble than any other person since Flook and Bradshaw. You may see that as me standing up for Wael, I simply see that as being fair and yes, I lay the first 4/5 years of the ALQs failure of ownership squarely at Hani's door. He didn't like football, wasn't interested in us, didn't see us as any form of investment or with any vision, was dragged along for the ride by the rest of the family, messed up our best chance of getting a new stadium that we'll ever have and then ditched us as soon as the old man died. I'm on the fence about a DOF. I feel that the club needs someone to handle the admin side of player transfers, dealing with agents, scouting players, reviewing data, building a structure of development of youth to first team which frees up the manager to coach and manage all first team affairs. What the manager and DOF need to do occasionally with owners is to say why they perhaps need to open the cheque book to obtain a player for a fee or for higher headroom on the wage budget and with the owner negotiate with the owners of other clubs. Having a good DOF, like Barry Fry for example, is priceless. One mistake Wael made was not taking Gary Penrice up on his offer to work for the club again. Penny would have loved to have come back but Wael dilly dallied and Penny went to Leeds instead. I totally agree that we need a proper business structure at the club to minimise the £4m a year loss we currently have. BTW, it's very rare I speak to Wael, and if I do, it's mainly at games where we say a quick hello and we ask after each others families etc. I'm in no position to persuade him to do anything, ask him for anything and least of all what to do and say on any particular pod cast. Regarding whom I'm blaming for current failures, it's HAS. Hes our owner and chairman, he's the money man and the one with the majority of influence. Hes also Abdul's father and he should be able to control the activities of his son and counsel him on any flaws in his personality which may be causing conflict. However, Abdul is over 18 and should know how to behave and quite frankly, he's being childish in his behaviour currently. |
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Post by swissgas on Oct 11, 2024 0:28:33 GMT
You say in this post " we had those mechanisms which failed us to start with which then sowed the seeds of further failure down the road when Wael was the majority owner. And in your previous posts you said "I think some of the mechanisms prevented the ALQ family and in the long term from Wael succeding, with the mechanism being Hani and Hamer " So there is no doubt you are blaming Hani and Hamer for the failures 2016-2023 and your activity in the last week shows you blame Abdullatif for the failures now. It's so clear you cannot bring yourself to attach any blame to Wael for the past failures but that is by the by because Gasheads are more concerned about what is going to happen in the future. And we are on the same page about wanting Hussain to bring in experienced management to run Rovers in a businesslike way and provide the manager and director of football with the support they need while at the same time improving morale and the public face of our club. So could you please try to persuade Wael that giving interviews like the one he recently gave to Reading FC doesn't help Rovers and only serves to show exactly why he failed. CEO's and DOF's are needed in the Premier League but not in the lower leagues ( he appointed two of each). I've always supported the manager, if he wanted a player I got him a player, for us it worked The new modern way of businessmen coming in who want that structure. Whoever tells you he has the key to success in football he's probably lying. Show me some club that's had success. Football is so random. Don't apply business rules into football. If Rovers are to ever succeed we can't go back to the randomness he talks about we've got to get a proper business structure at the club and operate on the same principles that successful businesses do. We both agree on that don't we ? I think it's disingenuous and unfair to attribute the blame wholly to Wael for the way the club was run up to his father's death. The ALQ family made it abundantly clear that it was a family partnership with equal say in what should be done and the accounts sheet clearly showed that Hani was the money man and the one which the club relied upon for finances. So how much of an influence and say Wael had in major decisions was probably pretty minimal, even though by title he was our club president. I had a long chat with Darrell Clarke last year and one thing he said was that he was constantly fighting a battle between the 2 brothers and the dad. Wael said he could have something, Hani said no he couldn't. Him and Wael wanted to do something a certain way, Hani said it wasn't going to happen or if it did it would be his way. Who can forget DCs off the record comments about certain members of the board that were recorded by the Bristol Post saying that some of the board were lying to him. It certainly stacks up. Where Wael becomes fully accountable is from 2020 onwards when it was his show. His allowing MS more control to run the club in its entirety with Tommy W was a mistake as was the decision to not appoint another executive to the board to help him and eventually Tom leading to fiascos such as the south stand redevelopment. The appointment of JB that ultimately led to our relegation and the takeover of the scousers, even if ultimately that debt was partially repaid with promotion back to L1. So yes, Wael does have to answer for somethings, but not all, simply because he didn't have the power, influence or money to do anything about it and as I said, the silky football executive who was meant to be the one to lead the club with the ALQs money was a fraud and a liar which caused us more harm and trouble than any other person since Flook and Bradshaw. You may see that as me standing up for Wael, I simply see that as being fair and yes, I lay the first 4/5 years of the ALQs failure of ownership squarely at Hani's door. He didn't like football, wasn't interested in us, didn't see us as any form of investment or with any vision, was dragged along for the ride by the rest of the family, messed up our best chance of getting a new stadium that we'll ever have and then ditched us as soon as the old man died. I'm on the fence about a DOF. I feel that the club needs someone to handle the admin side of player transfers, dealing with agents, scouting players, reviewing data, building a structure of development of youth to first team which frees up the manager to coach and manage all first team affairs. What the manager and DOF need to do occasionally with owners is to say why they perhaps need to open the cheque book to obtain a player for a fee or for higher headroom on the wage budget and with the owner negotiate with the owners of other clubs. Having a good DOF, like Barry Fry for example, is priceless. One mistake Wael made was not taking Gary Penrice up on his offer to work for the club again. Penny would have loved to have come back but Wael dilly dallied and Penny went to Leeds instead. I totally agree that we need a proper business structure at the club to minimise the £4m a year loss we currently have. BTW, it's very rare I speak to Wael, and if I do, it's mainly at games where we say a quick hello and we ask after each others families etc. I'm in no position to persuade him to do anything, ask him for anything and least of all what to do and say on any particular pod cast. Regarding whom I'm blaming for current failures, it's HAS. Hes our owner and chairman, he's the money man and the one with the majority of influence. Hes also Abdul's father and he should be able to control the activities of his son and counsel him on any flaws in his personality which may be causing conflict. However, Abdul is over 18 and should know how to behave and quite frankly, he's being childish in his behaviour currently. Do you agree with Wael when he says “ don’t apply business rules into football” ? There is a lot of common ground between us because we both believe that having a proper business structure in place provides the foundations for sustained football success but Wael believes the opposite. He thinks football success is completely random so sometimes you win and sometimes you lose but it has nothing to do with the way a club is run off the pitch. This wouldn’t matter if he remained in the background and kept his thoughts to himself or offered advice to Hussain privately but he’s not doing that. He’s used the Reading interview to openly challenge the Al- Saeeds and their plan to run the club in a more businesslike way and his sudden reappearance as Mr Popular is a clear attempt at undermining his partner. But once again he’s misjudged the situation because although many Gasheads are unhappy with the way the Al- Saeeds are running the club and disagree with Abdullatif being given a free rein to do things his own way they are not prepared to say “ bring back Wael”. And that’s because the love in is over and fans know that Wael had his chance and no matter how many excuses you make for him he blew it badly. If we want what’s best for Rovers we’ve got to look forward and try to find a way of persuading Hussain that he should put a business structure in place and let Abdullatif be guided by more experienced people. I know it may hurt you and other Gasheads to hear it but Wael’s experiment with “ randomness” failed and now Rovers have to move on from that. |
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