trymer
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Post by trymer on May 17, 2023 12:44:15 GMT
Conflicting news stories about the missile / drone attacks on Kiev, one says that the Patriot missile systems destroyed Russian hypersonic missiles,another that a Patriot system was damaged or destroyed. I still believe that these attacks are to make sure the Ukes have to keep the Patriot systems around Kiev and this will leave their spring offensive concentration areas and supply dumps vulnerable to missile attack....the answer would be more Patriot systems. The Patriot system is not just one unit/vehicle. It comprises multiple units which would be widely dispersed. I suspect parts of it were damaged but it is highly unlikely the whole system was destroyed. Whether that damage makes it un-operational or not we'll not be told. I suspect that the radar unit would have been hit, as any system like this gives it's position away when the radar is activated in the hope that they hit anything heading towards it. With a large system like Patriot it's not easy to keep moving location, so the Russians may have been getting the location over a number of days. However lessons learnt and all that, and the US will be looking at how the Russian weapon got through and will take steps/upgrades to stop it happening again. I was reading about the battle in WW2 between British and German electronics experts to detect/disrupt each others radar and electronics signals (RAF bombers and Luftwaffe night fighters) most of it goes over my head but I can see that its only a matter of time before some clever Chinese or Russian or Iranian bloke finds a way to use the Patriots radar signal to home a missile onto it. I read a while back that the Ukes were using the Leopard flakpanzers given to them and found that they were good at destroying drones but that all the available ammunition had been used up and that as it had been out of production for a while they would have to wait for a new production set up to make more..... ...of course this could all be b0llox but having seen videos in the past of the flakpanzer and knowing that it had 2 radar systems I thought that the part about it being capable of destroying drones could be true.
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Post by Nobbygas on May 17, 2023 22:34:22 GMT
You are correct. Any radar system can be detected. Patriot works on the principle that it has enough defence rockets to stop anything incoming. Off the top of my head each Patriot system can have something like seven launchers with each one carrying six warheads. So that's forty two warheads. If the enemy fire forty three warheads at it, then that extra one may get through. However, does the cost in weapons resources make this viable?I We, and the Ukes have a weapon called HARM. It is designed to target radar systems.
Also, the Gepard has plenty of ammo, don't worry about that.
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Post by Nobbygas on May 22, 2023 19:11:54 GMT
Very interesting news today. Russians have.....um.....err......invaded Russia.
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Ukraine
May 23, 2023 7:42:22 GMT
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Post by lostinspace on May 23, 2023 7:42:22 GMT
Very interesting news today. Russians have.....um.....err......invaded Russia. Is that a miniscule start of anti Spewtin from within?
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Post by Nobbygas on May 23, 2023 8:19:36 GMT
Very interesting news today. Russians have.....um.....err......invaded Russia. Is that a miniscule start of anti Spewtin from within? From what I can gather they are non-Ukrainians. Mostly Russians or 'other' nationals unhappy with Putin's regime. It looks like a raid rather than an invasion, designed to draw Russian resources from other areas to deal with it. They have been equipped by Ukraine and crossed the border from Ukraine. This must have set the alarm bells ringing for the Russians in that a relatively small group can cross the border and cause such mayhem. It reinforces the belief that the Ukes can decide where and when they break the Russian defensive line. If a small group can do this imagine what an armoured brigade could do, and apparently the Ukes have about 12 of them lurking somewhere,
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trymer
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Post by trymer on May 24, 2023 8:29:58 GMT
Is that a miniscule start of anti Spewtin from within? From what I can gather they are non-Ukrainians. Mostly Russians or 'other' nationals unhappy with Putin's regime. It looks like a raid rather than an invasion, designed to draw Russian resources from other areas to deal with it. They have been equipped by Ukraine and crossed the border from Ukraine. This must have set the alarm bells ringing for the Russians in that a relatively small group can cross the border and cause such mayhem. It reinforces the belief that the Ukes can decide where and when they break the Russian defensive line. If a small group can do this imagine what an armoured brigade could do, and apparently the Ukes have about 12 of them lurking somewhere, I saw a couple of pictures of Humvees that the raiders had left behind stuck in ditch or trench,they had the open turret with .50 Browning,the Russians will say this proves Western involvment,who knows maybe the Russians put them there,could have been captured elsewhere. Probably more of a propaganda raid although I agree that they will hope that it will make the Russians spread their troops around,however they might start some kind of Home guard to make people in Russia adopt a siege mentality if they havent already. I could see the Russians making a false flag raid on a Russian village and killing the children in a school or burning a hospital and then playing victim to the Worlds media,also they could crack down on 'terrorist' groups...meaning anyone the government doesnt like. Of course Russia could make raids themselves,they did that in WW2 into Finland,some brutal massacres and no doubt the Finns anti partisan units were firm in their reaction to the raids. Russians fighting Russians probably goes back to the Russian revolution, hundreds of thousands of Russians (and Ukrainians) fought alongside the Germans in WW2,I only learnt recently of a Russian unit in the Japanese army,odd seeing Europeans wearing Japanese army uniforms.
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Post by Nobbygas on May 24, 2023 10:14:29 GMT
"I only learnt recently of a Russian unit in the Japanese army,odd seeing Europeans wearing Japanese army uniforms." - When I was a kid our family didn't have much money and we got all our clothes from the Army & Navy surplus store. I was the only Japanese General in our school !
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oldie
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Post by oldie on May 24, 2023 11:10:00 GMT
"I only learnt recently of a Russian unit in the Japanese army,odd seeing Europeans wearing Japanese army uniforms." - When I was a kid our family didn't have much money and we got all our clothes from the Army & Navy surplus store. I was the only Japanese General in our school ! ššWhen I finished school at 18 I went Hitch Hiking around Europe. For that I bought a pair of boots from the Army Surplus store in Old Market. They never wore out, they were amazing
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trymer
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Post by trymer on May 24, 2023 12:43:33 GMT
"I only learnt recently of a Russian unit in the Japanese army,odd seeing Europeans wearing Japanese army uniforms." - When I was a kid our family didn't have much money and we got all our clothes from the Army & Navy surplus store. I was the only Japanese General in our school ! Thats one of the few Bernard Manning jokes that you can get away with telling these days.
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trymer
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Post by trymer on May 29, 2023 17:05:26 GMT
Russia pounding Kiev with drones and missiles again this week,apparently each Patriot missile is $4 million ! but I cant find any information on how long each missile takes to manufacture. Russia seem to want to deplete Patriot stocks, Switzerland refusing to break their neutral status by supplying ammunition for the flakpanzers which have been reported to be the answer to drones. Shells and missiles (anti missile and anti tank) will be needed in massive quantities for as long as the war continues,will be interesting to see if manufacture keeps up with consumption.
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Ukraine
May 30, 2023 7:03:14 GMT
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Post by lostinspace on May 30, 2023 7:03:14 GMT
Attacks on Moscow via drones are reported with minimal damage,following more attacks on the Ukraine capital , escalation time !!
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Cheshiregas
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Post by Cheshiregas on May 30, 2023 12:18:08 GMT
Attacks on Moscow via drones are reported with minimal damage, following more attacks on the Ukraine capital , escalation time !! Hardly scratched the surface. Either local dissidents, or false flags is my gut feeling. Russia looking for any excuse to escalate.
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Post by Nobbygas on May 30, 2023 12:55:50 GMT
Attacks on Moscow via drones are reported with minimal damage, following more attacks on the Ukraine capital , escalation time !! Hardly scratched the surface. Either local dissidents, or false flags is my gut feeling. Russia looking for any excuse to escalate. Agree with you Terry. It's a long way for a drone to fly, meaning the warhead has to be small. I don't think the Ukes would waste valuable resources doing this. The Ukes are highly critical of the Russians attacking civilian targets so morally I cannot see their High Command doing this. However, I do believe the Uke offensive will start any day now.
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Ukraine
May 30, 2023 14:57:37 GMT
via mobile
Post by lostinspace on May 30, 2023 14:57:37 GMT
Hardly scratched the surface.Ā Either local dissidents, or false flags is my gut feeling. Russia looking for any excuse to escalate. Agree with you Terry. It's a long way for a drone to fly, meaning the warhead has to be small. I don't think the Ukes would waste valuable resources doing this. The Ukes are highly critical of the Russians attacking civilian targets so morally I cannot see their High Command doing this. However, I do believe the Uke offensive will start any day now. [br So referring back to the ruskies mouthpiece from last week and his implication of " we haven't really started yet" and the awaited Uke's offense, how much of a changer will the western hardware make, assuming it is all in the right places,and .... not sure if you seen a video of many pre 90's ruskies tanks on railway lines heading towards the conflict, straight out of storage with no apparent on board updates regards ammunition capabilities ..more duck shoot times ?
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trymer
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Post by trymer on May 30, 2023 17:41:06 GMT
Read a very interesting article...The New Yorker..Two weeks at the front in Ukraine. WW1 type trench warfare,poor bloody infantry.
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kingswood Polak
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Post by kingswood Polak on Jun 3, 2023 13:40:46 GMT
Dear God. There are some videos on the internet showing Russian's castrating captured Ukrainian soldier's. Anyone who suggests appeasement towards Russia should be forced to watch one. As the son of Polish parents, the Russians have used this and mass rape as a means of lowering bloodlines and adding Russian DNA to countries, the stories i have heard, from the war generation are behind horrific, seems they have not stopped. Barbaric does not cover it
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kingswood Polak
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Post by kingswood Polak on Jun 3, 2023 14:11:22 GMT
I don't think it was a problem for the Ukes to get men and supplies to Bahkmut. I know for a fact that units have been rotated in/out. Even Zelensky visited the place about three weeks ago. One of the problems the Russians face is their military doctrine. It has been developed to only include advancing. They have just not trained or are not prepared, for defence. It's a concept they never envisaged. We can see that they have developed some static defenses in places, but a modern arm will just turn these places into death traps for the defenders. History has already shown that static defenses just don't really work. Do the Russians have a QRF capability behind the front line? They may have it but will it be any good? Yes the Ukes were getting men into Bakhmut and I think that was what the Russians wanted,for the Ukes to keep pushing men into the meat grinder, could the Russians have cut the roads ? maybe they could but maybe they didnt want to,we will only know when the history books are written, the casualty ratio figures will be interesting. I agree that the Russians fight a very aggressive war,lots of artillery and rocket bombardments not worrying about civilian casualties, attacking without caring about the losses as long as they win. Western commanders would have to keep their eye on the casualty list because our societies would not put up with huge losses,Montgomery knew that in Normandy and NW Europe campaign and itās still true. Monty was viewed very dimly by the Americans and the command structure was drastically changed as he was viewed as inept, after operation Market garden. He was viewed as too slow and wasteful of soldiers lives. Our strategy on civilian lives changed, drastically, when we had ābomberā Harris take command of bombing Germany. Driving through Dresden in 1989 had me tearing up. I was very shocked.
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trymer
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Post by trymer on Jun 4, 2023 11:07:06 GMT
Yes the Ukes were getting men into Bakhmut and I think that was what the Russians wanted,for the Ukes to keep pushing men into the meat grinder, could the Russians have cut the roads ? maybe they could but maybe they didnt want to,we will only know when the history books are written, the casualty ratio figures will be interesting. I agree that the Russians fight a very aggressive war,lots of artillery and rocket bombardments not worrying about civilian casualties, attacking without caring about the losses as long as they win. Western commanders would have to keep their eye on the casualty list because our societies would not put up with huge losses,Montgomery knew that in Normandy and NW Europe campaign and itās still true. Monty was viewed very dimly by the Americans and the command structure was drastically changed as he was viewed as inept, after operation Market garden. He was viewed as too slow and wasteful of soldiers lives. Our strategy on civilian lives changed, drastically, when we had ābomberā Harris take command of bombing Germany. Driving through Dresden in 1989 had me tearing up. I was very shocked. Got to disagree here KP, Montgomery was replaced by Eisenhower at the beginning of September (before Market Garden) this had been agreed before D day because the build up of American troops now meant that they outnumbered the British (and Canadians etc) so Montgomery couldnt really stay in command. He was viewed as too slow and cautious but that was because he coulnt afford to be wasteful with soldiers lives,in fact he was short of infantry for the whole NW Europe campaign,remember British troops were fighting in Italy and Burma so trained infantry were in demand. The Americans did think that he was inept in Normandy (Goodwood) and he admits that he made a mistake with not prioritising the port of Antwerp. Although the idea of Market Garden was to shorten the war the plan was dependant on XXX corps advancing up one road ! no fault of the men involved that it didnt work,it was just a poor plan. All you need to know about Harris was that his men referred to him as 'the butcher' (of aircrew) I worked with a bloke who flew in Lancasters over Germany in 1944/45 and he put me onto a few books to read on the subject.
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trymer
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Post by trymer on Jun 4, 2023 11:10:53 GMT
Dear God. There are some videos on the internet showing Russian's castrating captured Ukrainian soldier's. Anyone who suggests appeasement towards Russia should be forced to watch one. As the son of Polish parents, the Russians have used this and mass rape as a means of lowering bloodlines and adding Russian DNA to countries, the stories i have heard, from the war generation are behind horrific, seems they have not stopped. Barbaric does not cover it I wonder if this castration, the rapes and the shooting of prisoners and civilians is intended to terrorise the opposition ? This brutality isnt new,various units in various wars have had reputations for not taking prisoners but as the duke of Wellington was fond of saying "two can play at that game".
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kingswood Polak
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Post by kingswood Polak on Jun 5, 2023 7:33:13 GMT
As the son of Polish parents, the Russians have used this and mass rape as a means of lowering bloodlines and adding Russian DNA to countries, the stories i have heard, from the war generation are behind horrific, seems they have not stopped. Barbaric does not cover it I wonder if this castration, the rapes and the shooting of prisoners and civilians is intended to terrorise the opposition ? This brutality isnt new,various units in various wars have had reputations for not taking prisoners but as the duke of Wellington was fond of saying "two can play at that game". I would say that it definitely is intended to scare them into giving uo , for sure. from personal experience, i remember my dad talking of getting order that certain days were no prisoner days, i was too young to understand this fully. I thought it meant troops found their way to the detention camps, it wasnāt until i went to Normandy that i found out what it meant. Dad hardly ever spoke of the war but opened up once i had spoken to those who did and, i guess, to out his side of the story into me. Awful bloody war.
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