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Post by CountyGroundHotel on Sept 8, 2017 15:41:34 GMT
Sorry should have also added about the MENA region is Wael raising the profile of Rovers in that region or is he using Rovers to raise his profile in the region? Either way I can't see much legs in it.
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Post by CountyGroundHotel on Sept 8, 2017 15:38:58 GMT
I can't see where Wareham'unease about Rovers fitting into this model comes from. We have new owners and we don't know what their ultimate motives or plans for Rovers are. What we do know is we haven't been purchased by some benevolent dyed in the wool gashead who we could all understand their motives. Whether we are part of a bigger group or not we are already in the era of football clubs being used to enhance the owners wealth. We can only hope that their objectives lead to a favourable outcome for us as fans. Would we really kick up a storm if Red Bull (apart from the 3rd letter swear word) buy us and plonk £50m on the table for a new stadium and infrastructure? So what DC might not like having players given to him (though I suspect that was what happened with the Chelsea lads last season) but he either accepts it or resigns, the next manager would take the job knowing exactly what his remit was. Not really unease about any model. More about surprise that there was no plan B when Wael must have known for sometime that the UWE was about to collapse. And of course owners will try to make money out of the club they own and I have no problem with them trying to spread interest in the area they come from. And as fans we all hope that they lead us to better "outcomes". My point in this thread has been that I was surprised that we were looking to expand in the "MENA" region, perhaps I shouldn't have been. But I was, surprised, not uneasy about it. And whilst I agree with much of what you've said and yes suggesting that DC could either accept and put up with having players given to him or resign is probably true, at the moment DC is probably our biggest asset and our owners would be unwise to start interfering in footballing matters. As his interview said last week he's allowed to run the footballing side without interference, how he likes it. Perhaps he's more aware of the vision of the owners after all and that was his marker!!😀 UTG! There was a plan B redevelop the Mem but the plan was probably amongst all the papers that were destroyed before wael and Co moved in so you can hardly blame him for not really knowing what plan b was. To be honest it doesn't appear that he had much idea about the plan A he inherited
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Post by CountyGroundHotel on Sept 8, 2017 10:44:47 GMT
I can't see where Wareham'unease about Rovers fitting into this model comes from. We have new owners and we don't know what their ultimate motives or plans for Rovers are. What we do know is we haven't been purchased by some benevolent dyed in the wool gashead who we could all understand their motives. Whether we are part of a bigger group or not we are already in the era of football clubs being used to enhance the owners wealth. We can only hope that their objectives lead to a favourable outcome for us as fans. Would we really kick up a storm if Red Bull (apart from the 3rd letter swear word) buy us and plonk £50m on the table for a new stadium and infrastructure? So what DC might not like having players given to him (though I suspect that was what happened with the Chelsea lads last season) but he either accepts it or resigns, the next manager would take the job knowing exactly what his remit was.
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Post by CountyGroundHotel on Sept 4, 2017 12:36:08 GMT
You're sprouting rubbish. A commercial deal has broken down happens everyday. Don't recall the UWE promising rovers fans a new stadium just the current and previous owners doing that. Put quite simply if a deal isn't done then don't try to hoodwink the fans that it's a done deal. Admittedly most rovers fans don't require much hoodwinking What if it was a done deal? I don't believe that we are the injured party here and that UWE's disbelief was genuine. So therefore Wael and Co should be explaining exactly why they pulled out of a deal? Put simply if say BT and Vodafone are negotiating a deal and Vodafone pull out it isn't the responsibility of BT to explain to Vodafone shareholders why Vodafone pulled out.
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Post by CountyGroundHotel on Sept 4, 2017 9:50:16 GMT
Fail to see why anyone thinks UWE needed this development. They sit on a prime piece of real estate and senior people have spoken about concentrating on building business schools and not stadiums. As to interviews should the BBC et Al be interviewing every land owner who doesn't complete a land sale. The fact, that some people desperately won't accept, is the responsibility for making this deal happen is on our owners. After all it was them that let Hamer make the ridiculous 'landing lights are on' statement. I just presume Hamer mistook the landing lights for the M32 I don't believe UWE needed the development, that doesn't mean they don't have questions to answer though IMO.
The stadium was always (originally at least) portrayed as a joint venture. I don't know what either side wanted out of it come the end, or if either side wanted it at all.
Let's pretend/assume UWE changed their mind and don't want the stadium. It's in their interest to say given what The Al-Qadi's have said they are still open to discussion knowing it won't happen and trying to make BRFC/Dwane look bad. Perhaps we were trying to negotiate with people who didn't really want it.
We will see if any sports stadia. be it 5,000 or 20,000 gets built there or something else.
No one knows the truth and unless someone asks question of all parties than we will never know, but lets all s*** on the Al-Qadi's because of 2nd, 3rd,4th hand evidence. spouted on the internet. It may be true, but would be nice to have real information
You're sprouting rubbish. A commercial deal has broken down happens everyday. Don't recall the UWE promising rovers fans a new stadium just the current and previous owners doing that. Put quite simply if a deal isn't done then don't try to hoodwink the fans that it's a done deal. Admittedly most rovers fans don't require much hoodwinking
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Post by CountyGroundHotel on Sept 4, 2017 8:13:27 GMT
Fail to see why anyone thinks UWE needed this development. They sit on a prime piece of real estate and senior people have spoken about concentrating on building business schools and not stadiums. As to interviews should the BBC et Al be interviewing every land owner who doesn't complete a land sale.
The fact, that some people desperately won't accept, is the responsibility for making this deal happen is on our owners. After all it was them that let Hamer make the ridiculous 'landing lights are on' statement. I just presume Hamer mistook the landing lights for the M32
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Post by CountyGroundHotel on Aug 26, 2017 20:56:57 GMT
Do you really think what Ken & BSS do or say is 'no business' of Rovers fans who aren't in the supporters club or share scheme? They are both BRSC reps and as such ONLY represent views etc of BRSC members ....a bit like being in a trade union and the non members don't pay subscriptions so are NOT represented by Union reps
SIMPLES
You're a better class of fan than the rest of us Mike
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Post by CountyGroundHotel on Aug 24, 2017 16:45:10 GMT
Yes but the last set of accounts showed that we are already owing approx £7m under the facility. As it's a Revolving Credit Facility you can only then borrow thst £7m again if you've first repaid it. Di you believe we've repaid anything since the last set if accounts? As you point out many companies have these facilities available but not many companies that have consistently negative cadhflow have them. Of course not many companies are spending the proceeds of there only asset in that situation luckily for us our owners are happy to lend us that money knowing it's covered by the security they have arranged. What a great wheeze that is Presumably that credit is only borrowed as its paid out, so would never show as cash in the bank (or only fleetingly). It would be shown as borrowings and expenditure in the year end accounts. Or have I got that wrong?
Totally agree your last paragraph, and it worries me. Why are the fans directors not enquiring as to the future financial security of the club? I'd want to know the answer to the above question before buying a tenner's worth of shares in a business, let alone the amount that the supporter's club has put in. I've invested in loss-making companies before, but I want to know the turnaround plan and short, medium and long term cashflow and credit situation first and be comfortable with it.
I'd imagine in a cashflow negative business like this it'll only touch the bank account briefly. The only evidence will be the growing liability on the balance sheet, certainly not an asset in the bank account
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Post by CountyGroundHotel on Aug 24, 2017 14:38:37 GMT
Don't ask Henbury difficult questions like that it'll make his head hurt My head defo hurts after reading all the rubbish posted on both forums, with consortium offers, administration, DC leaving, UWE crap etc etc Whatever we say or do on hear and the other place will not make one difference to what our owners do or say and for the life of me i cant get excited about any of it Come Saturday, i will be at the game watching the best football team in League 1 play and i will give one jot about the politics of the club I take it all you lot will be at the game ? For someone who cares not a jot you have a hell of a posting record on both forums. I'll just take that you are living in cloud cuckoo land
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Post by CountyGroundHotel on Aug 24, 2017 14:37:13 GMT
Well there was no £10m pot of cash sat on the balance sheet at the last accounts, when Dwane had already put in place the Revolving Credit Facility. So where has the loan cash gone? Spent on the training ground? So you're saying we've borrowed £10m from the owners of the training ground to then spend on increasing the value of their asset? Whiffs of fraud dies that or asset stripping. Or actually cash was required to pay off loans. Wonga ex directors etc, and to meet the regular, negative, cadhflow of the business. If you believe the £10m is for the training ground (cost and expenses to date £1m? Of which Dwane paid the cost of £1m as they have unequivocally said they own the site) your living in cloud cuckoo land or the club is sat with £9-10m in its bank account. Which do you think is the likely answer. Surely if its a credit facility, it's there to be drawn on as required and wouldn't be shown as cash immediately? Like an overdraft facility with a bank?
Credit facilities are perfectly normal, I don't think i own shares in asingle company without some agreed dredit facility with a bank, venture capitalists etc. However, with the strong posiblity of £10m being used up fairly quickly, if I was a Director of Bristol Rovers FC I would want to know what contingency is in place for when it does run out.
Yes but the last set of accounts showed that we are already owing approx £7m under the facility. As it's a Revolving Credit Facility you can only then borrow thst £7m again if you've first repaid it. Di you believe we've repaid anything since the last set if accounts? As you point out many companies have these facilities available but not many companies that have consistently negative cadhflow have them. Of course not many companies are spending the proceeds of there only asset in that situation luckily for us our owners are happy to lend us that money knowing it's covered by the security they have arranged. What a great wheeze that is
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Post by CountyGroundHotel on Aug 24, 2017 12:32:01 GMT
I am well aware of previous treads on this subject, my question is, do we have any proof that the money raised against this charge has been spent on day to day running of the club or as I've been told, is to cover the cost of development of the Colony Complex If c£15M was being used to pay for the training ground, you reckon they could dip into it to pay off the looming creditors and nip that in the bud, wouldn't you? Don't ask Henbury difficult questions like that it'll make his head hurt
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Post by CountyGroundHotel on Aug 24, 2017 12:30:06 GMT
f me yes the charge is registered and available to view on Companies House website. A fact you well know, but desperately try to ignore as you dislike the truth, as there was a ten page thread on the other forum. Go on go read it again just search for Companies House. Amazing that people prefer to believe rumour and half truths over facts I am well aware of previous treads on this subject, my question is, do we have any proof that the money raised against this charge has been spent on day to day running of the club or as I've been told, is to cover the cost of development of the Colony Complex Well there was no £10m pot of cash sat on the balance sheet at the last accounts, when Dwane had already put in place the Revolving Credit Facility. So where has the loan cash gone? Spent on the training ground? So you're saying we've borrowed £10m from the owners of the training ground to then spend on increasing the value of their asset? Whiffs of fraud dies that or asset stripping. Or actually cash was required to pay off loans. Wonga ex directors etc, and to meet the regular, negative, cadhflow of the business. If you believe the £10m is for the training ground (cost and expenses to date £1m? Of which Dwane paid the cost of £1m as they have unequivocally said they own the site) your living in cloud cuckoo land or the club is sat with £9-10m in its bank account. Which do you think is the likely answer.
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Post by CountyGroundHotel on Aug 24, 2017 11:41:27 GMT
With the possible exception of the training ground all funded against a loan secured against the Mem ie the club is very busy spending it's only asset to make all these improvements. Scary when you think about it isn't it? It akin to you remortgaging your house for the maximum amount so you can have expensive holidays and a new car. Do you have any Evidence that this is happening ? f**k me yes the charge is registered and available to view on Companies House website. A fact you well know, but desperately try to ignore as you dislike the truth, as there was a ten page thread on the other forum. Go on go read it again just search for Companies House. Amazing that people prefer to believe rumour and half truths over facts
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Post by CountyGroundHotel on Aug 24, 2017 10:59:56 GMT
Fitting together the pieces of the jigsaw to try to reveal a clear picture is anything but boring to me but I accept we are all different. The facts are in the accounts which show that for an outlay of £6.2 million Dwane Sports acquired a business with an asset which had been recently valued by Sainsburys at £29 million and which, even if you considered the Sainsburys offer unreal, would probably have been thought to be worth at least £15 million. Why did Wael use the term "amazing value" to describe the deal he got ? Did he think the league 2 team he purchased was amazing value at £6.2 million ? Or was it the business operation that was losing over £1 million per year when he bought it ? Perhaps it was the opportunity offered by the UWE planning permission that he thought was worth so much. But I think most people would conclude that the amazing value he was talking about was getting £15 million worth of land for £6.2 million with a football club thrown in. We all know Wael's priority and passion was for the football club but he was only able to sell the idea to his family because of the land. My supposition is that too much emphasis was placed on the "amazing value" and not enough forethought was given to how the ongoing project was to be managed and financed. The disappearance of the three experts pictured with Wael soon after the deal was completed was a first indication that no clear plan was being followed. Events since then support the theory that they wanted the deal done because it was "amazing value" and would see what they could make of it afterwards. Forethought and planning does not seem to be one of our owners strengths as witnessed by the vacuum which occurred in the aftermath of the UWE Stadium abandonment. Like everyone else I wish Wael and Steve had been ready with an inspiring plan to cheer us all up and give us realistic hope for the future but the fact is they were not. On the other hand there is also lots of evidence of strategic thinking and planning; bringing in Cunnah and co bringing in the moneyball man from Germany buying the training ground setting up the development squad, with good people investing in medical/fitness staff and nutrition 5 year deal for DC biggish signings by our standards a different 'tone' and culture about the place etc etc it's just the money for the stadium and maybe training ground development that is missing, not a lack of forethought and planning? With the possible exception of the training ground all funded against a loan secured against the Mem ie the club is very busy spending it's only asset to make all these improvements. Scary when you think about it isn't it? It akin to you remortgaging your house for the maximum amount so you can have expensive holidays and a new car.
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Post by CountyGroundHotel on Aug 24, 2017 7:57:37 GMT
Just a load of supposition from you. Might just as well be "snow white and the 7 dwarfs" in terms of reality. Wael was "hypnotised by the value of land" i mean bankers are especially vulnerable to this! are they? Got any facts? These guesswork fairy tales are a bit boring. Fitting together the pieces of the jigsaw to try to reveal a clear picture is anything but boring to me but I accept we are all different. The facts are in the accounts which show that for an outlay of £6.2 million Dwane Sports acquired a business with an asset which had been recently valued by Sainsburys at £29 million and which, even if you considered the Sainsburys offer unreal, would probably have been thought to be worth at least £15 million. Why did Wael use the term "amazing value" to describe the deal he got ? Did he think the league 2 team he purchased was amazing value at £6.2 million ? Or was it the business operation that was losing over £1 million per year when he bought it ? Perhaps it was the opportunity offered by the UWE planning permission that he thought was worth so much. But I think most people would conclude that the amazing value he was talking about was getting £15 million worth of land for £6.2 million with a football club thrown in. We all know Wael's priority and passion was for the football club but he was only able to sell the idea to his family because of the land. My supposition is that too much emphasis was placed on the "amazing value" and not enough forethought was given to how the ongoing project was to be managed and financed. The disappearance of the three experts pictured with Wael soon after the deal was completed was a first indication that no clear plan was being followed. Events since then support the theory that they wanted the deal done because it was "amazing value" and would see what they could make of it afterwards. Forethought and planning does not seem to be one of our owners strengths as witnessed by the vacuum which occurred in the aftermath of the UWE Stadium abandonment. Like everyone else I wish Wael and Steve had been ready with an inspiring plan to cheer us all up and give us realistic hope for the future but the fact is they were not. Unfortunately Swiss there are a lot of happy clappy idiots that don't like reasoned analysis unless it comes to the same conclusion that they have already been fed by the owners
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Post by CountyGroundHotel on Aug 22, 2017 13:40:46 GMT
Only another 7 years and it will have dragged on as long as the UWE saga
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Post by CountyGroundHotel on Aug 22, 2017 12:35:25 GMT
I had yet another hospital appointment yesterday and I asked my Srilankan specialist why we don't see hardly any Asians at football and he simple answer was that they are not brought up really interested in it and that cricket is the sport they near worship. He also said that the parents look at football badly. I don't know the answer but it seems we do have a reputation problem, going on his answer and he is around 40, very well dressed and I'd love to see him and more like him at the gas Fail to see how we have a reputation problem in what you have posted. Are BRFC now responsible for the cultural upbringing of Asian children. Think what you have posted backs up the point made by people that some groups don't come to football because it doesn't interest them. Perhaps they should be forced to watch football to Culturally integrate? All reminds me of the claims that 1 in 10 footballers are gay. Which they have to be so the gay community can feel justified.
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Post by CountyGroundHotel on Aug 22, 2017 10:29:19 GMT
11000 people through the gates is 11000 people. It only seems to matter to you what there race or religion is. How do you prioritise getting new fans from a particular racial background over another without some form of discrimination? Yes but it could be 11,500 because a section of our society clearly are not going to rovers matches. The best thing i can think of is more effort in the communities/schools that have large ethnic groups. Its funny how people get very tetchy over any sign of positive discrimination after not giving a damn about discrimination of minorities for decades and more. Discrimination is discrimination, obviously you're a supporter of discrimination. Sad
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Post by CountyGroundHotel on Aug 22, 2017 8:03:41 GMT
More diversity at the mem would be a financial boom to bristol rovers so just from a commercial point of view some sort of break through in this area would be great for the club. In any other situation where you could increase your fan base and therefore probably your playing budget you could count on universal support. But on this particular way of improving the club there will be plenty that dont like the idea one little bit. Strange isnt it? 11000 people through the gates is 11000 people. It only seems to matter to you what there race or religion is. How do you prioritise getting new fans from a particular racial background over another without some form of discrimination?
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Post by CountyGroundHotel on Aug 21, 2017 14:03:58 GMT
Perhaps the mods should've acted when posters started calling others racist. Oops isn't that what the administrator was doing as well? My initial post was in response to a poster's comments on thewhether the club should attempt to attract fans from underrepresented parts of the Bristol population. Both relevant to Bristol Rovers and an accurate portrayal of that poster's opinions. Not a single piece of racist name calling. I don't think we've ever removed serious chat when it specifically relates to Bristol Rovers, it's only when those topics veer away from the stated aims of the forum that we act. Good to see you've taken me off ignore by the way No but unfortunately your crap comes up on quotes. Good to know as an administrator you won't condemn or moderate poster's calling others racist, guess all insults are therefore acceptable
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