|
|
Post by chelt_gas on Dec 14, 2016 6:37:07 GMT
With the January transfer window only a matter of weeks away it'll will be interesting to see what happens regarding the keeper position. We are paying for three keepers in Roos, Pudding and Mildenhall yet there is suspicion that none of these players are to the standard which DC is aiming for.
Therefore, will the club sanction a move for a fourth keeper? Will we see any of the current three keeps move on from the club? Who would perhaps come in?
I then remembered that Rovers once had an international (youth) class keeper in Matt Macey a few years back and wondered what of his progress. On reading his Wikipedia page I was surprised to read that he is 22 (23 in September) and has played a grand total of 4 games of first-team league football ever. And that was for Accrington Stanley in league 2 in 2015. Compare this to a few of our local young players in Lockyer, Leadbetter, Clarke and Harrison then the exposure of first-team football is proportionately greater. Therefore, which route is a better path to take: the premier league route of sponsored headphones and immaculate academy pitches or the lower-league first-team action where there is more relevance in each game played and therefore it helps the muscle memory.
If I were Macey I would be jealous of Lockyer et al since they are playing games. Perhaps Lockyer et al may be jealous of Macey sharing dressing rooms with the Premier elite but then it doesn't appear to be helping his career giving that he hasn't played competitive football since joining Arsenal.
It got me thinking to my job - I work for a small business but in a big industry. It's always been this way. I find the best employees over time are the ones that rise from position to position and are the proverbial David in a Goliath's world. Whenever I have recruited a person from a large company they seem to talk the talk but they don't necessarily have the appetite to succeed. If I were Macey I'd be thinking about my next move - having Arsenal on your CV is nice but having no evidence of achievement questions your ability for watching clubs. How about joining Rovers on loan to prove you are a good keeper and in the surroundings of a club you are familiar with and with players that can give you good grounding (so long as you lose those headphones!)
|
|
Peter Parker
Global Moderator
Richard Walker
You have been sentenced to DELETION!
Joined: May 2014
Posts: 4,920 
|
Post by Peter Parker on Dec 14, 2016 7:51:48 GMT
I am pretty sure Roos' (or any season loan)loan can be cancelled by agreement in January
|
|
|
|
Post by matealotblue on Dec 14, 2016 8:05:40 GMT
I am pretty sure Roos' (or any season loan)loan can be cancelled by agreement in January But don't we have an issue with Gosling in that he has come back to his parent club during his agreed legal an spell but can't play for us as he is still "loaned" to Cambridge until January? Not a season loan I grant you but are the rules the same for both? |
|
|
|
Post by CountyGroundHotel on Dec 14, 2016 8:20:36 GMT
I still feel Macey made the right choice. There is a gross difference in the lower leagues between how outfield players and goalkeepers are treated, clubs will take a chance on outfield players but goalkeepers are kept on the bench then when the first choice is injured the club loans in a new first choice. Macey could've looked at recent history to see how many times Mike Green was on the bench against actual appearances, there was then another kid I can't remember the name (Gouge maybe, big, blond), before that Ryan Clarke. Then you have the highly rated Keiron Preston and you could probably go on.
|
|
dido
Predictions League
Peter Aitken
Joined: May 2014
Posts: 1,883
|
Post by dido on Dec 14, 2016 8:43:13 GMT
Leadbetter is Leadbitter.
Leadbitter is not local.
Leadbitter is not young.
|
|
warehamgas
Predictions League
Joined: May 2014
Posts: 3,442
|
Post by warehamgas on Dec 14, 2016 9:20:29 GMT
Difficult to compare. Would Macey have had any more chances at Rovers as a keeper than he has at Arsenal? If he had been given the chance and made as many appearances as Lockyer then we could say he's made the wrong decision but I'm nor sure under DC he would have done. Unfortunately I suspect that many youngsters would rather have the big contract and the illusion of Premier League than the reality of lower league football. So his bank account may look healthy and he may drive a flash car but few people have ever heard of him. But I don't know the young man and that may be unfair. According to Accrington fans they would not have him back. I'm not sure that youth and development football is a good preparation for league football. To answer the op we've seen how our current loanees are talented players but perhaps struggle against the more physical aspects of our league. TL and OC have earns their reputations the hard way, they have both been part of two promotions and have a very good cv. Me, I'd rather have done it their way than get splinters in your backside sitting on the bench and not playing any meaningful football over that time but I guess that's up to the individual concerned.
UTG!
|
|
Deleted
Joined: January 1970
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Dec 14, 2016 9:52:46 GMT
Matt Macey is 22 and has made four league appearances in four year professional career.
|
|
Peter Parker
Global Moderator
Richard Walker
You have been sentenced to DELETION!
Joined: May 2014
Posts: 4,920
|
Post by Peter Parker on Dec 14, 2016 9:54:02 GMT
I am pretty sure Roos' (or any season loan)loan can be cancelled by agreement in January But don't we have an issue with Gosling in that he has come back to his parent club during his agreed legal an spell but can't play for us as he is still "loaned" to Cambridge until January? Not a season loan I grant you but are the rules the same for both? I sure it's only to do with the transfer window period. So Roos' deal could be mutually terminated in January between us and Derby and Roos would be free to move on to another club (or play for Derby) because it's the next window. |
|
Deleted
Joined: January 1970
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Dec 14, 2016 10:00:23 GMT
Difficult to compare. Would Macey have had any more chances at Rovers as a keeper than he has at Arsenal? If he had been given the chance and made as many appearances as Lockyer then we could say he's made the wrong decision but I'm nor sure under DC he would have done. Unfortunately I suspect that many youngsters would rather have the big contract and the illusion of Premier League than the reality of lower league football. So his bank account may look healthy and he may drive a flash car but few people have ever heard of him. But I don't know the young man and that may be unfair. According to Accrington fans they would not have him back. I'm not sure that youth and development football is a good preparation for league football. To answer the op we've seen how our current loanees are talented players but perhaps struggle against the more physical aspects of our league. TL and OC have earns their reputations the hard way, they have both been part of two promotions and have a very good cv. Me, I'd rather have done it their way than get splinters in your backside sitting on the bench and not playing any meaningful football over that time but I guess that's up to the individual concerned. UTG! Although I agree with you,we have to remember that we are fans / supporters and its these blokes job,they have a time limited career to make their money. Tom Mcallister was a great goalkeeper but he went to West Ham as Parkes back up,maybe he would have more appearances had he stayed at a lower level but I bet he got more money at West Ham. I know that its a different time now but I do feel sad when I hear of players who were well known even household names still working in pretty crap jobs into their 60s and 70s,I know that the money wasnt available then as it is now but I dont blame any player wanting to earn as much as he can,playing games or sat on the bench. |
|
Igitur
Joined: June 2014
Posts: 2,294
|
Post by Igitur on Dec 14, 2016 10:47:37 GMT
Initially the aim for young players is to get to a big club, which Macey has done; then comes the money. Is he getting more money than Puddy I suspect he may be, is he getting better training than Puddy I think he definitely is. There are many players who have made a 'career' of bench warming, and at least he is still on the books (until 2018) as opposed to being released and falling away into obscurity as hundreds do. He is bound to get another club, but he will soon find that having Arsenal on the CV means nothing.
|
|
warehamgas
Predictions League
Joined: May 2014
Posts: 3,442
|
Post by warehamgas on Dec 14, 2016 11:27:32 GMT
I agree with what both of you are saying. Of course you are going to move for more money. Most of us have done that and you can't blame them, it is as you say trymer, a short career and players have to maximise the time. I think the problem is the huge gap that has developed between the PL and the rest, but that's another thread probably!
Whatever, good luck to the young man and perhaps he could find his way back here because as you say Igitur, he will have had much better training at Arsenal and should be a far superior keeper than the ones we've had. But that doesn't always happen does it?
UTG!
|
|
|
|
Post by CountyGroundHotel on Dec 14, 2016 11:42:33 GMT
Initially the aim for young players is to get to a big club, which Macey has done; then comes the money. Is he getting more money than Puddy I suspect he may be, is he getting better training than Puddy I think he definitely is. There are many players who have made a 'career' of bench warming, and at least he is still on the books (until 2018) as opposed to being released and falling away into obscurity as hundreds do. He is bound to get another club, but he will soon find that having Arsenal on the CV means nothing. Mostly agree with that but disagree about the cv. If a club like ours looks for a new young keeper they'll almost always pick one released from a big club, regardless of appearances, over a similar aged player at a lower league club. Look at Stewart Taylors career ex Arsenal minimal appearances always had a club. Heard of any of our young keepers who have been released, only Clarke has carved out a reasonable career. |
|
Igitur
Joined: June 2014
Posts: 2,294
|
Post by Igitur on Dec 14, 2016 11:51:51 GMT
Initially the aim for young players is to get to a big club, which Macey has done; then comes the money. Is he getting more money than Puddy I suspect he may be, is he getting better training than Puddy I think he definitely is. There are many players who have made a 'career' of bench warming, and at least he is still on the books (until 2018) as opposed to being released and falling away into obscurity as hundreds do. He is bound to get another club, but he will soon find that having Arsenal on the CV means nothing. Mostly agree with that but disagree about the cv. If a club like ours looks for a new young keeper they'll almost always pick one released from a big club, regardless of appearances, over a similar aged player at a lower league club. Look at Stewart Taylors career ex Arsenal minimal appearances always had a club. Heard of any of our young keepers who have been released, only Clarke has carved out a reasonable career. Maybe my point was badly made, and it comes after the "soon find" bit, for if a keeper makes howlers then, Arsenal or not, he will get dropped, was what I was trying to imply. |
|
irishrover
Global Moderator
Joined: June 2014
Posts: 3,372
|
Post by irishrover on Dec 15, 2016 12:39:20 GMT
The system might be crap but that doesn't Macey neccesarily made the wrong decision.
He'll have had better training, better money and better opportunities being at Arsenal even if he doesn't end up making it. The system encourages top clubs to hoover up talent which makes the league less fun but I'm not sure it's neccessarily the wrong decision for the individual. It is a bit surprising that he hasn't gone out on loan more though - is it that no one is interested or have Arsenal used him elsewhere?
|
|
Deleted
Joined: January 1970
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Dec 15, 2016 13:41:19 GMT
Initially the aim for young players is to get to a big club, which Macey has done; then comes the money. Is he getting more money than Puddy I suspect he may be, is he getting better training than Puddy I think he definitely is. There are many players who have made a 'career' of bench warming, and at least he is still on the books (until 2018) as opposed to being released and falling away into obscurity as hundreds do. He is bound to get another club, but he will soon find that having Arsenal on the CV means nothing. Exactly, bench warmer for early round Coca Cola cup fixtures doesn't help much on a CV. A couple of weeks back Arse did a feature on their 'up and coming young keeper', it included an interview with Cech, who said all the right things about his potential, how hard he works etc etc etc. Only problem is, it wasn't Matt, it was Emiliano Martinez, at the end of the interview Cech was asked about Matt, he looked a bit confused for a second and then said something nice about him as well. My hunch is that unless either Matt improves (a lot) in the near future or Arse have some kind of crises then his days there are already numbered. Would be nice if he could make 1 first team appearance, we would probably get some money for that, but behind Cech they have Ospina, then Martinez, so it doesn't look hugely promising. |
|
|
|
Post by CountyGroundHotel on Dec 15, 2016 14:21:46 GMT
Initially the aim for young players is to get to a big club, which Macey has done; then comes the money. Is he getting more money than Puddy I suspect he may be, is he getting better training than Puddy I think he definitely is. There are many players who have made a 'career' of bench warming, and at least he is still on the books (until 2018) as opposed to being released and falling away into obscurity as hundreds do. He is bound to get another club, but he will soon find that having Arsenal on the CV means nothing. Exactly, bench warmer for early round Coca Cola cup fixtures doesn't help much on a CV. A couple of weeks back Arse did a feature on their 'up and coming young keeper', it included an interview with Cech, who said all the right things about his potential, how hard he works etc etc etc. Only problem is, it wasn't Matt, it was Emiliano Martinez, at the end of the interview Cech was asked about Matt, he looked a bit confused for a second and then said something nice about him as well. My hunch is that unless either Matt improves (a lot) in the near future or Arse have some kind of crises then his days there are already numbered. Would be nice if he could make 1 first team appearance, we would probably get some money for that, but behind Cech they have Ospina, then Martinez, so it doesn't look hugely promising. Still think he had a better chance of becoming Bristol Rovers no 1 by leaving for arsenal and then returning rather than just staying. |
|
Deleted
Joined: January 1970
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Dec 15, 2016 14:32:17 GMT
Exactly, bench warmer for early round Coca Cola cup fixtures doesn't help much on a CV. A couple of weeks back Arse did a feature on their 'up and coming young keeper', it included an interview with Cech, who said all the right things about his potential, how hard he works etc etc etc. Only problem is, it wasn't Matt, it was Emiliano Martinez, at the end of the interview Cech was asked about Matt, he looked a bit confused for a second and then said something nice about him as well. My hunch is that unless either Matt improves (a lot) in the near future or Arse have some kind of crises then his days there are already numbered. Would be nice if he could make 1 first team appearance, we would probably get some money for that, but behind Cech they have Ospina, then Martinez, so it doesn't look hugely promising. Still think he had a better chance of becoming Bristol Rovers no 1 by leaving for arsenal and then returning rather than just staying. If memory serves, when he went didn't Arse have that clown Wojciech Szczęsny as their No 1? If so, Matt could have been forgiven for thinking that he had a fighting chance of taking the No 1 jersey in the near future. |
|
|
|
Post by CountyGroundHotel on Dec 15, 2016 14:51:20 GMT
Still think he had a better chance of becoming Bristol Rovers no 1 by leaving for arsenal and then returning rather than just staying. If memory serves, when he went didn't Arse have that clown Wojciech Szczęsny as their No 1? If so, Matt could have been forgiven for thinking that he had a fighting chance of taking the No 1 jersey in the near future. That's the point I'm making he had more of a fighting chance to be no 1 at arsenal than he did at Bristol Rovers |
|
warehamgas
Predictions League
Joined: May 2014
Posts: 3,442
|
Post by warehamgas on Dec 15, 2016 14:52:45 GMT
The system might be crap but that doesn't Macey neccesarily made the wrong decision. He'll have had better training, better money and better opportunities being at Arsenal even if he doesn't end up making it. The system encourages top clubs to hoover up talent which makes the league less fun but I'm not sure it's neccessarily the wrong decision for the individual. It is a bit surprising that he hasn't gone out on loan more though - is it that no one is interested or have Arsenal used him elsewhere? He went out on loan to Accrington the season before last I think although it might have been the start of last season. I don't think it was a total success I seem to remember the Stanley forum being fairly critical of him. I think he made a couple of big mistakes that led to goals and for a keeper that's a fairly unforgiving offence in fans' eyes, esp if they've come up from Arsenal! It's unfair as keepers have to learn and their mistakes are always magnified because they usually result in goals against whereas if a midfielder messes up it may not be noticed. But like you I'm surprised that he hasn't gone out on loan again. Perhaps he's lined up for January! UTG! |
|
kingswood Polak
Without music life would be a mistake
Joined: May 2014
Posts: 10,263
|
Post by kingswood Polak on Dec 16, 2016 18:51:46 GMT
Still think he had a better chance of becoming Bristol Rovers no 1 by leaving for arsenal and then returning rather than just staying. If memory serves, when he went didn't Arse have that clown Wojciech Szczęsny as their No 1? If so, Matt could have been forgiven for thinking that he had a fighting chance of taking the No 1 jersey in the near future. Like Tomaszewski ? |
|
