Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jun 22, 2020 10:01:01 GMT
Bitterness knows no boundaries So no thoughts on what the SC ought to do now? Will they withdraw the threat of legal action? Will they go to the fans who keep them in place and have an election or appoint a new fans director as has been on offer since Masters had to step down and was offered again in the share statement? Will the Presidents Club be open as to its membership numbers and why it feels it should have such a say in the future of BRFC. Any thoughts on John's offer to the BRSC? Be very interested to hear. Literally the only way I can see out of this for the SC is for Jim to throw himself at Weal's mercy and ask if he's prepared, for the sake of the SC membership and to maintain the historical links between the FC and the SC, to issue a joint statement saying that they've held 'clear the air' talks and now understand each other's positions and are happy to put previous issues behind them and work together in the best interests of the FC that we all love etc etc. The SC shouldn't fall because of Jim's poor judgement or whatever happened between the FC hierarchy and Masters. Even then the SC still have all their work ahead of them, because if they don't modernise they are as good as finished anyway.
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irishrover
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Post by irishrover on Jun 22, 2020 10:19:45 GMT
Swiss - rather grudging recognition of the largest individual investment in our entire history. From someone who thought the for sale signs would be placed outside the Mem and that we would be facing Armageddon. It is rather churlish to ask for Wael to show the colour of his money for future Stadium plans. The answer is that we don't know yet. I am not going to chew on the bone of future doubters, as it just a bone with no meat of evidence on it. Wael comes across as not the most bullish in interviews. Some previous ones have been disasters. But let me remind you of his assertion that actions speak louder than words, at a time when lower league football is facing the greatest crisis in its history. While I agree this is a substantial move I'd disagree it is an investment. There's a big difference between giving someone £10,000 as a house deposit and giving someone £10,000 to pay off their credit card. What I will say though is it gives the club a clean slate and that's incredibly important. There still needs to be wholesale changes in the way the club is run because we cannot get in that sort of position again and expect a bail out. I've been very critical of the AQ tenure, I think rightfully so at times. The main issue for me with the old structure is not everyone was pulling in the right direction. Now we have a clear leadership structure and ultimately it will all fall on one man. There's no more excuses, no more whispers of what's happening behind the scenes, this is it now. In my life time the only thing that is up there with this moment is the Mem purchase and we can't f this up like we did that. This is the right approach I think.
Generally we need to be a bit more grown-up and on the level about our attitude to ownership (whoever is in charge). There's still this tendency to get stuck into a binary narrative - is this bloke good or bad? If you're critical of Wael then you must love Higgs (as if there's only 2 possible owners in the world) etc. Modern football just isn't like that. Fans have never been more distant from those who are in charge (case in point the SC who still behave like its 1995). If we're treated like consumers then I think we should behave and assess like consumers which mean it's rarely an all or nothing situation. Sometimes the fans interests will be aligned with the owners (like they are now) and sometimes they won't (the previous 18 months or so). To me the attitude has to be a hard-headed 'what have you done for me lately?' coupled with a fair minded attitude towards the things they actually do.
So in this case my overall is - great, this is fantastic.....what's next? How are we going to take advantage of this position to advance the club/put it on a more sustainable footing? I think the good thing is Wael recognising that even though this feels like a significant moment in its own right it only actually becomes that if its treated as a starting point for success or we go right back to where we started from.
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womble
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Post by womble on Jun 22, 2020 10:21:29 GMT
So no thoughts on what the SC ought to do now? Will they withdraw the threat of legal action? Will they go to the fans who keep them in place and have an election or appoint a new fans director as has been on offer since Masters had to step down and was offered again in the share statement? Will the Presidents Club be open as to its membership numbers and why it feels it should have such a say in the future of BRFC. Any thoughts on John's offer to the BRSC? Be very interested to hear. Literally the only way I can see out of this for the SC is for Jim to throw himself at Weal's mercy and ask if he's prepared, for the sake of the SC membership and to maintain the historical links between the FC and the SC, to issue a joint statement saying that they've held 'clear the air' talks and now understand each other's positions and are happy to put previous issues behind them and work together in the best interests of the FC that we all love etc etc. The SC shouldn't fall because of Jim's poor judgement or whatever happened between the FC hierarchy and Masters. Even then the SC still have all their work ahead of them, because if they don't modernise they are as good as finished anyway. I don’t know any of the SC hierarchy. Do you think it’s likely that they are willing to swallow their pride and try and reach some sort of rapprochement?
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jun 22, 2020 10:36:26 GMT
Literally the only way I can see out of this for the SC is for Jim to throw himself at Weal's mercy and ask if he's prepared, for the sake of the SC membership and to maintain the historical links between the FC and the SC, to issue a joint statement saying that they've held 'clear the air' talks and now understand each other's positions and are happy to put previous issues behind them and work together in the best interests of the FC that we all love etc etc. The SC shouldn't fall because of Jim's poor judgement or whatever happened between the FC hierarchy and Masters. Even then the SC still have all their work ahead of them, because if they don't modernise they are as good as finished anyway. I don’t know any of the SC hierarchy. Do you think it’s likely that they are willing to swallow their pride and try and reach some sort of rapprochement? Jim is at a crossroads. I don't think it's overstating the position that the SC finds itself in to say that its future could be on the line here. I haven't spoken with John Malyckyj since the news broke about Wael's investment a few days ago, but he's a smart guy, he understands the landscape and the politics involved and is able to think calmly and strategically, so my best advice to Jim would be to speak to John. There's still a window of opportunity for the SC, but it needs careful management, just pretending that nothing has happened isn't going to work here, in time Jim will get a message saying that the SC help selling programmes isn't required, away travel will be taken away from them so that the FC profits directly from that, and it'll be the end of the SC, they'll have literally nothing left to offer apart from a badly photocopied newsletter and a Christmas raffle.
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Peter Parker
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Richard Walker
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Post by Peter Parker on Jun 22, 2020 10:58:44 GMT
I don’t know any of the SC hierarchy. Do you think it’s likely that they are willing to swallow their pride and try and reach some sort of rapprochement? Jim is at a crossroads. I don't think it's overstating the position that the SC finds itself in to say that its future could be on the line here. I haven't spoken with John Malyckyj since the news broke about Wael's investment a few days ago, but he's a smart guy, he understands the landscape and the politics involved and is able to think calmly and strategically, so my best advice to Jim would be to speak to John. There's still a window of opportunity for the SC, but it needs careful management, just pretending that nothing has happened isn't going to work here, in time Jim will get a message saying that the SC help selling programmes isn't required, away travel will be taken away from them so that the FC profits directly from that, and it'll be the end of the SC, they'll have literally nothing left to offer apart from a badly photocopied newsletter and a Christmas raffle. Away travel is interesting. According to the last SC accounts profit on transport (I assume this is away travel as what else could it be) was £6432. Not massive granted, but anv revenue and profit the club can generate will surely be looked at
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jun 22, 2020 11:06:26 GMT
Jim is at a crossroads. I don't think it's overstating the position that the SC finds itself in to say that its future could be on the line here. I haven't spoken with John Malyckyj since the news broke about Wael's investment a few days ago, but he's a smart guy, he understands the landscape and the politics involved and is able to think calmly and strategically, so my best advice to Jim would be to speak to John. There's still a window of opportunity for the SC, but it needs careful management, just pretending that nothing has happened isn't going to work here, in time Jim will get a message saying that the SC help selling programmes isn't required, away travel will be taken away from them so that the FC profits directly from that, and it'll be the end of the SC, they'll have literally nothing left to offer apart from a badly photocopied newsletter and a Christmas raffle. Away travel is interesting. According to the last SC accounts profit on transport (I assume this is away travel as what else could it be) was £6432. Not massive granted, but anv revenue and profit the club can generate will surely be looked at Is that it, for the entire season? Not sure what's normal, but that doesn't seem very much. Anyway, back to the point, ITB has been very quiet, that may mean one of two things, he's either realised what a mammoth task he was taking on and has thought better of it, or he's actually doing it.
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Post by o2o2bo2ba on Jun 22, 2020 11:36:35 GMT
....but surely dignitaries of unofficial official bodies such as Presidents Club and Supporters Club, Helpline should issue a response on the major news that has broke in last week?
It doesn't require alot, costs even less and is dignified.. ?
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Post by shineongas on Jun 22, 2020 11:47:24 GMT
Away travel is interesting. According to the last SC accounts profit on transport (I assume this is away travel as what else could it be) was £6432. Not massive granted, but anv revenue and profit the club can generate will surely be looked at Is that it, for the entire season? Not sure what's normal, but that doesn't seem very much. Anyway, back to the point, ITB has been very quiet, that may mean one of two things, he's either realised what a mammoth task he was taking on and has thought better of it, or he's actually doing it. Me & my son used the SC coach to Crewe a few years ago. One coach only - run by a small clique apparently for themselves (I noticed that they were given all of the players complementary tickets to distribute as they saw fit). When we left Kingswood I thought that the team were going to have a poor following that day. Totally wrong - obviously other supporters had had their own experience of SC travel and made their own way to Gresty Road. Over 1500 gasheads in the stadium and only 50 via the 'official transport'. We have not used the transport since and have not been SC members for the last three seasons due to our poor experience. Clearly there is an opportunity for the Football Club to take over the away transport and make it more sustainable and profitable.
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Angas
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Post by Angas on Jun 22, 2020 13:13:42 GMT
....but surely dignitaries of unofficial official bodies such as Presidents Club and Supporters Club, Helpline should issue a response on the major news that has broke in last week? It doesn't require alot, costs even less and is dignified.. ? Maybe they're consulting their members
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eppinggas
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Post by eppinggas on Jun 22, 2020 14:12:39 GMT
Away travel is interesting. According to the last SC accounts profit on transport (I assume this is away travel as what else could it be) was £6432. Not massive granted, but anv revenue and profit the club can generate will surely be looked at Is that it, for the entire season? Not sure what's normal, but that doesn't seem very much. Anyway, back to the point, ITB has been very quiet, that may mean one of two things, he's either realised what a mammoth task he was taking on and has thought better of it, or he's actually doing it. To be fair ITB is a Mod at the other place... I would imagine he will actually be doing something rather than nothing. And he'll get a lot of support from here (with a couple of exceptions)... Fingers crossed. It's great chance to unite and all pull in the same direction. UTG.
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Post by a more piratey game on Jun 22, 2020 14:18:49 GMT
Is that it, for the entire season? Not sure what's normal, but that doesn't seem very much. Anyway, back to the point, ITB has been very quiet, that may mean one of two things, he's either realised what a mammoth task he was taking on and has thought better of it, or he's actually doing it. To be fair ITB is a Mod at the other place... I would imagine he will actually be doing something rather than nothing. And he'll get a lot of support from here (with a couple of exceptions)... Fingers crossed. It's great chance to unite and all pull in the same direction. UTG. I would have thought that, any lockdown limitations notwithstanding, the recent developments make this the perfect time for him to push ahead with whatever it is that he's working on
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Post by Bath Gas on Jun 22, 2020 14:52:17 GMT
Is that it, for the entire season? Not sure what's normal, but that doesn't seem very much. Anyway, back to the point, ITB has been very quiet, that may mean one of two things, he's either realised what a mammoth task he was taking on and has thought better of it, or he's actually doing it. Me & my son used the SC coach to Crewe a few years ago. One coach only - run by a small clique apparently for themselves (I noticed that they were given all of the players complementary tickets to distribute as they saw fit). When we left Kingswood I thought that the team were going to have a poor following that day. Totally wrong - obviously other supporters had had their own experience of SC travel and made their own way to Gresty Road. Over 1500 gasheads in the stadium and only 50 via the 'official transport'. We have not used the transport since and have not been SC members for the last three seasons due to our poor experience. Clearly there is an opportunity for the Football Club to take over the away transport and make it more sustainable and profitable. I've experienced similar in the past - apart from an elderly chap called Geoff (now sadly passed away), the SC hierarchy made no effort to make people not in the clique feel welcome. Rovers have some very intelligent, savvy and personable supporters in their 20's and 30's, I think the club should try and get people like this involved in facilitating a supporters club - they'd have much more chance of modernisation and thereby increasing membership.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jun 22, 2020 15:04:40 GMT
To be fair ITB is a Mod at the other place... I would imagine he will actually be doing something rather than nothing. And he'll get a lot of support from here (with a couple of exceptions)... Fingers crossed. It's great chance to unite and all pull in the same direction. UTG. I would have thought that, any lockdown limitations notwithstanding, the recent developments make this the perfect time for him to push ahead with whatever it is that he's working on Soon we'll be able to get within a meter of other people, so he can crack on, not sure what the delay has been anyway, I've met a lot of you, 2 meters is more than close enough thank you very much! In reply to epping. Why would anybody not want a revamped SC that engages with all ages of supporters and offers modern communication? I wonder if some people worry that a modern SC would exclude them from something that's been part of their life for years? I hope that wouldn't be the case, if it happens it should cater for everybody, not least the older 'traditional' supporter.
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eppinggas
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Post by eppinggas on Jun 22, 2020 16:13:57 GMT
I would have thought that, any lockdown limitations notwithstanding, the recent developments make this the perfect time for him to push ahead with whatever it is that he's working on Soon we'll be able to get within a meter of other people, so he can crack on, not sure what the delay has been anyway, I've met a lot of you, 2 meters is more than close enough thank you very much! In reply to epping. Why would anybody not want a revamped SC that engages with all ages of supporters and offers modern communication? I wonder if some people worry that a modern SC would exclude them from something that's been part of their life for years? I hope that wouldn't be the case, if it happens it should cater for everybody, not least the older 'traditional' supporter. I guess the options are: 1. A total overhaul of the existing SC, or 2. Start a new SC with a clean slate. I think the second is a neater solution. And Wael is in a position of real power now, with pretty much all supporters behind him. Given the history of the SC and Wael Al-Qadi... why would he bother engaging with specific individuals who have been openly acting against him for years? Bye Jim. Bye Ken. Get rid - start again. We could have an open top bus tour of Horfield to celebrate. I'm sure there would be a way of accommodating the any SC members in the new model who actually want to support the Club rather than under-mine it.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jun 22, 2020 16:45:44 GMT
Soon we'll be able to get within a meter of other people, so he can crack on, not sure what the delay has been anyway, I've met a lot of you, 2 meters is more than close enough thank you very much! In reply to epping. Why would anybody not want a revamped SC that engages with all ages of supporters and offers modern communication? I wonder if some people worry that a modern SC would exclude them from something that's been part of their life for years? I hope that wouldn't be the case, if it happens it should cater for everybody, not least the older 'traditional' supporter. I guess the options are: 1. A total overhaul of the existing SC, or 2. Start a new SC with a clean slate. I think the second is a neater solution. And Wael is in a position of real power now, with pretty much all supporters behind him. Given the history of the SC and Wael Al-Qadi... why would he bother engaging with specific individuals who have been openly acting against him for years? Bye Jim. Bye Ken. Get rid - start again. We could have an open top bus tour of Horfield to celebrate. I'm sure there would be a way of accommodating the any SC members in the new model who actually want to support the Club rather than under-mine it. This isn't just about Jim and Ken, or even Wael. Our SC has a long history of supporting the FC and being there in hours of need. Severing all ties should be a last resort, in my opinion of course.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jun 22, 2020 16:56:11 GMT
....but surely dignitaries of unofficial official bodies such as Presidents Club and Supporters Club, Helpline should issue a response on the major news that has broke in last week? It doesn't require alot, costs even less and is dignified.. ? Maybe they're consulting their members Rumour has it he is crofting in Scotland🤔
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eppinggas
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Post by eppinggas on Jun 22, 2020 17:00:22 GMT
I'm sure there would be a way of accommodating the any SC members in the new model who actually want to support the Club rather than under-mine it. This isn't just about Jim and Ken, or even Wael. Our SC has a long history of supporting the FC and being there in hours of need. Severing all ties should be a last resort, in my opinion of course. I don't disagree Bambi. If I was Wael though - I'd be asserting my authority one way or the other, right now. The in-fighting has been detrimental to the Club and I think we all can agree it has to stop.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 22, 2020 17:04:09 GMT
This isn't just about Jim and Ken, or even Wael. Our SC has a long history of supporting the FC and being there in hours of need. Severing all ties should be a last resort, in my opinion of course. I don't disagree Bambi. If I was Wael though - I'd be asserting my authority one way or the other, right now. The in-fighting has been detrimental to the Club and I think we all can agree it has to stop. Absolutely. Stronger together and all that. I still have no idea what happened with Ken or what Ken told Jim, but it's hard to think that somebody just got it into their head to ban Ken from half of the ground for no reason and then follow that up by inviting the SC to put forward a replacement for him. Everything always comes out in the wash, we'll find out what went on, all in good time.
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Post by droitwichgas on Jun 22, 2020 17:44:20 GMT
I don't disagree Bambi. If I was Wael though - I'd be asserting my authority one way or the other, right now. The in-fighting has been detrimental to the Club and I think we all can agree it has to stop. Absolutely. Stronger together and all that. I still have no idea what happened with Ken or what Ken told Jim, but it's hard to think that somebody just got it into their head to ban Ken from half of the ground for no reason and then follow that up by inviting the SC to put forward a replacement for him. Everything always comes out in the wash, we'll find out what went on, all in good time. I thought the rumours were KM & SH become so disillusioned with new stadium plans falling at the last hurdle they dealt directly with the FM developers, hence the rumour Wael did not have any real info about the FM deal when he announced that was the club's preferred site, even Total Produce tweet seemed to confirm that. Unfortunately it all went wrong for KM & co when Wael inherited his late father's money and found himself in a far stronger negotiating position, so wasn't just going to sell up to the developers and walk away, hence the recent fall out. If there's any truth in this rumour I can't see anyway back for JC/KM, if so, either both quit or the SC will have to be replaced. Possibly JC & KM were acting in the club's best interests but now their both victims of the change in circumstances, there still seems no way back for at least KM as Wael still seems insistent he's replaced on the Board.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jun 22, 2020 17:48:18 GMT
Absolutely. Stronger together and all that. I still have no idea what happened with Ken or what Ken told Jim, but it's hard to think that somebody just got it into their head to ban Ken from half of the ground for no reason and then follow that up by inviting the SC to put forward a replacement for him. Everything always comes out in the wash, we'll find out what went on, all in good time. I thought the rumours were KM & SH become so disillusioned with new stadium plans falling at the last hurdle they dealt directly with the FM developers, hence the rumour Wael did not have any real info about the FM deal when he announced that was the club's preferred site, even Total Produce tweet seemed to confirm that. Unfortunately it all went wrong for KM & co when Wael inherited his late father's money and found himself in a far stronger negotiating position, so wasn't just going to sell up to the developers and walk away, hence the recent fall out. If there's any truth in this rumour I can't see anyway back for JC/KM, if so, either both quit or the SC will have to be replaced. Possibly JC & KM were acting in the club's best interests but now their both victims of the change in circumstances, there still seems no way back for at least KM as Wael still seems insistent he's replaced on the Board. I don't know anything about those rumours, but in that scenario Ken and Jim wouldn't be victims, quite the opposite. But it's probably all just beer talk anyway.
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