Bridgeman
Alfie Biggs
Joined: May 2014
Posts: 3,549 
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Post by Bridgeman on Dec 30, 2015 18:48:57 GMT
What a fantastic team display to secure victory in Durban against the World ranked no.1 test team and we've got Anderson coming back for the next test....well played
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irishrover
Global Moderator
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Post by irishrover on Dec 31, 2015 1:56:58 GMT
I think that's the best win England have had in quite a few years - definitely the best in the Alistair Cook era. South Africa do seem to be a bit vulnerable and somewhat in transition so this is probably a very good time to be playing them. But to beat South Africa in South Africa is pretty tough and they are still packed full of quality players. Broad was superb but I think it is Finn and Ali's performances that should be most heartening for England fans in the sense that they showed we can win without Anderson. I remain a bit surprised that we went with Compton and Hales. That seemed a bit odd when you'd think that the natural choice would be one or the other. Compton showed that there is always something to be gained by giving a batsman a second dig at a test career - he gives us some much needed glue. Listening to Graeme Swann it's pretty obvious that one of the reasons that he wasn't given more of a run is that he wasn't liked. This is something I've heard about Compton - that's he's not much of a team man. But he potentially offers England some much needed stability and he is clearly desperate for success. Bairstow also made a point. With Steyn injured I think we really have South Africa in a lot of trouble here although they still have the quality to launch a major comeback.
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jackthegas
David Pritchard
Joined: May 2014
Posts: 313
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Post by jackthegas on Dec 31, 2015 14:27:26 GMT
A good win for sure but beating India a away a few years ago was better I think.
I like the balance the England batting line up has. If Hales can succeed at playing his natural game he should be a good foil for Cook. Root and Taylor are both gritty and busy players and then we've got some players who can take the game away from the opposition in a session at 6-9. Much better than the one paced top order we have had recently (although I remain to be convinced that Hales will succeed or that Compton can adapt his game if we're 150-1) and more steel in the middle order than we've had since Collingwood retired.
I thought all of our bowlers were excellent. Even Woakes looked the part. Pace, control and he moved the ball just enough. I think that, in contrast to Moeen and Finn he is an unlucky bowler. We do seem to have a good group of quick bowlers now though which is an improvement on where were last year. If we can find an opener and the recent additions continue to improve then we should have a good 10 years or so.
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brizzle
Lindsay Parsons
No Buy . . . No Sell!
Joined: May 2014
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Post by brizzle on Dec 31, 2015 15:20:02 GMT
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Deleted
Joined: January 1970
Posts: 0
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Post by Deleted on Dec 31, 2015 15:20:15 GMT
I think this 'adapting your game if we're 150/1' thing is a bit of a red herring; firstly, it doesn't matter if he plays his natural game in that situation, as we've still got the whackers to come in after him, and secondly, when was the last time we were anywhere near 150/1?!
He's earned his chance, let him get on with it. And fortunately, it no longer matters a jot whether Graham Swann liked him and the influence of the 'old guard' will wane as time goes on anyway.
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jackthegas
David Pritchard
Joined: May 2014
Posts: 313
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Post by jackthegas on Dec 31, 2015 15:43:08 GMT
I think this 'adapting your game if we're 150/1' thing is a bit of a red herring; firstly, it doesn't matter if he plays his natural game in that situation, as we've still got the whackers to come in after him, and secondly, when was the last time we were anywhere near 150/1?! He's earned his chance, let him get on with it. And fortunately, it no longer matters a jot whether Graham Swann liked him and the influence of the 'old guard' will wane as time goes on anyway. Maybe. I'm glad he's back in the side and he's a safe pair of hands but i do think that in the long term we will need someone a bit more adaptable at 3. He is capable of being a bit more expansive when the situation calls for it though. I think the key for him is not being paralysed by fear of failure. Adaptability, or at least showing willing is important. Blocking when we're well ahead would be no different to KP giving it away in the past when we were trying to save games. I did think Swann had a bit of an agenda in the first innings though. I was watching Compton bat when he was on 40 odd and I thought he looked safe as houses. BBC live text kept quoting Swann as saying that he was struggling though. |
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Bridgeman
Alfie Biggs
Joined: May 2014
Posts: 3,549
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Post by Bridgeman on Dec 31, 2015 18:01:13 GMT
I thought it was interesting that Compton in his interview reminded the interviewer that he had averaged 40 before he was dropped, so maybe there was a bit of an agenda between him and some of the old guard.
Really pleased to see James Taylor putting in a good performance too, they are clearly hoping that giving Hales an opportunity will develop the skills he requires to become a test opener, lets hope the selectors bravery pays off.
Are there any Gas out there, I haven't personally seen any flags.
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irishrover
Global Moderator
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Post by irishrover on Jan 1, 2016 23:59:36 GMT
I think this 'adapting your game if we're 150/1' thing is a bit of a red herring; firstly, it doesn't matter if he plays his natural game in that situation, as we've still got the whackers to come in after him, and secondly, when was the last time we were anywhere near 150/1?! He's earned his chance, let him get on with it. And fortunately, it no longer matters a jot whether Graham Swann liked him and the influence of the 'old guard' will wane as time goes on anyway. Maybe. I'm glad he's back in the side and he's a safe pair of hands but i do think that in the long term we will need someone a bit more adaptable at 3. He is capable of being a bit more expansive when the situation calls for it though. I think the key for him is not being paralysed by fear of failure. Adaptability, or at least showing willing is important. Blocking when we're well ahead would be no different to KP giving it away in the past when we were trying to save games. I did think Swann had a bit of an agenda in the first innings though. I was watching Compton bat when he was on 40 odd and I thought he looked safe as houses. BBC live text kept quoting Swann as saying that he was struggling though. I don't think it matter much either - but I think it is pretty clear that Compton's face didn't fit with key players in the dressing room last time around.
My view is that in the long run he will either end up Cook's opening partner or that will be it for his Test career. I could be wrong but I don't see his long term future as a number 3. It works here because he's insurance for Hales but I don't really see it. Not too worried about the pace of scoring thing really - we do have other attacking players and Trott was very much in that mould and was successful at 3 for years. More importantly though as I get older I get increasingly intolerant of the OCD of batsman where they must have a defined position the order. I had a 19 year old tell me in a game that I skippered last year that he saw himself more as a number 5 than a number 4! It's ridiculous. What you are really describing is a game situation and that it makes sense to deploy different batsman at different stages in the game. I can't think of any other sport that allows this indulgent psychobabble to get in the way of sensible game strategy. As a bowler I can't get away with saying 'I don't like being 1st change etc' - I bowl when the captain damn well tells me to bowl according to the strategy that he thinks is going to best win us the game. The same should apply to batsman in my mind. It's the one aspect of the sport that remains stuck in a different era.
Of course it makes sense to promote another batsman above Compton if we were 150-1. Likewise it would make good sense to drop him down the order so that we had someone with opening experience to face the 2nd New Ball etc. All this would be common sense in other sports - in cricket it seems like dangerous radicalism!
I'd forgotten the India away series happened under Cook - it's such a treadmill that it's hard to keep track of what happened when these days. But, I agree, that was probably a better victory; an victory in Asia is really. Having said that our record in South Africa is just as bad.
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Deleted
Joined: January 1970
Posts: 0
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Post by Deleted on Jan 2, 2016 11:24:43 GMT
We're going OK today, Hales has just brought up a rather streaky 50. 93/1
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Bridgeman
Alfie Biggs
Joined: May 2014
Posts: 3,549
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Post by Bridgeman on Jan 2, 2016 12:10:48 GMT
Currently 128-1  |
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Deleted
Joined: January 1970
Posts: 0
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Post by Deleted on Jan 2, 2016 13:29:57 GMT
Seems we're getting out at regular intervals even though the batsman are looking set when they're in.
I hope we don't have a collapse this evening because in these conditions against a very depleted attack 400 should be the absolute minimum, I'd have thought.
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Deleted
Joined: January 1970
Posts: 0
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Post by Deleted on Jan 3, 2016 8:58:17 GMT
Well we didn't collapse and we're making hay this morning. 500 looks on after all!
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Deleted
Joined: January 1970
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Post by Deleted on Jan 3, 2016 10:23:10 GMT
Incredible stuff from Stokes this morning, and the 500 is up already. An amazing innings.
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Post by lostinspace on Jan 3, 2016 11:22:33 GMT
phenomenal stuff from Stokes,,, M Vaughan was uttering just as he [Stokes] came in yesterday "he needed to decide what strokes he needs to concentrate on to make that big score"!! wonder what he will come up with next
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Deleted
Joined: January 1970
Posts: 0
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Post by Deleted on Jan 3, 2016 12:02:24 GMT
Bairstow has been brilliant too. I can't remember seeing a partnership quite like this. Cook/Trott put some big ones on in the Ashes a few years ago, but it wasn't like this!
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Bridgeman
Alfie Biggs
Joined: May 2014
Posts: 3,549
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Post by Bridgeman on Jan 3, 2016 15:47:16 GMT
Incredible batting by Stokes he just took the bowling attack apart, great innings by Bairstow too.
Just making some small inroads into their batting line up but it's still a good batting track so a draw is looking likely providing South Africa don't do anything stupid.
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Deleted
Joined: January 1970
Posts: 0
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Post by Deleted on Jan 3, 2016 15:54:20 GMT
Yes, taking twenty wickets looks like it might be an issue even with three days left!
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irishrover
Global Moderator
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Post by irishrover on Jan 3, 2016 19:41:48 GMT
Yes, taking twenty wickets looks like it might be an issue even with three days left! It depends how much fight South Africa have in them really. These are their best 2 batsmen at the wicket - the rest look potentially vulnerable to me so while it looks a flat pitch and hard work for the bowlers I'm not sure it would take all that much for us to put them deep in the mire to be honest. It's going to take a couple of monumental innings to save this match - Amla is definitely more than capable but he's been out of nick. There have to be question marks over the rest. I honestly don't think their batting looks up to much. |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jan 4, 2016 18:23:48 GMT
Plenty of fight, it would seem!
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irishrover
Global Moderator
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Post by irishrover on Jan 4, 2016 18:58:58 GMT
Plenty of fight, it would seem! Yep! I think Amla may have just saved his captaincy as well as the match with that innings. Mind you the way they batted suggested that they didn't really have much faith in the rest of their batsmen either. Flat pitch or not that is a magnificently disciplined rearguard effort from 2 of the best in the World. |
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