oldie
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Post by oldie on Feb 16, 2024 7:46:12 GMT
Was that a Tory Party supporter peeking through the curtains this morning? Probably wondering if it's safe to come out after last night's election results
ðŸ¤ðŸ¤ðŸ˜‚😂😂
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trymer
Joined: November 2018
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Post by trymer on Feb 16, 2024 8:51:41 GMT
For once I agree with Sir Keir "people want a change" yes they do,the depressing news for Sir Keir is that after 5 or 10 years of Labour the people would want another change.
The tories are unpopular and got stuffed last night,not really unexpected,the BIG news was Reform beating the Lib Dems and the Greens into 3rd place in both by elections.
That really matters because for the first time Reform get over 10% and show the polls about them are correct,also the Lib Dems and Greens are established parties with experience in many elections,canvassing teams etc....Reform are a young party just getting started and on the way up,its hard work,just ask Anna Soubrey.
I will vote for Reform unless they make the mistake of letting tory ministers join.
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eppinggas
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Post by eppinggas on Feb 16, 2024 9:42:45 GMT
For once I agree with Sir Keir "people want a change" yes they do,the depressing news for Sir Keir is that after 5 or 10 years of Labour the people would want another change. The tories are unpopular and got stuffed last night,not really unexpected,the BIG news was Reform beating the Lib Dems and the Greens into 3rd place in both by elections. That really matters because for the first time Reform get over 10% and show the polls about them are correct,also the Lib Dems and Greens are established parties with experience in many elections,canvassing teams etc....Reform are a young party just getting started and on the way up,its hard work,just ask Anna Soubrey. I will vote for Reform unless they make the mistake of letting tory ministers join. The Labour Party and the Tory Party face the same old problem. They are both broad churches and battle to keep the extreme elements of the party under control. There is no credible alternative for Labour voters. Marxists, Socialist Workers, and Communists have all been proven unappealing to the British public. Reform is a credible alternative for Conservative voters. I think a few high profile right wing Tories defecting there would increase their vote share (might annoy you trymer). Problem is that politically a Tory heading to Reform would be a massive risk. The Conservative Party is the single most successful political party in Western Europe over the last couple of centuries. Actually - make that the world www.economist.com/britain/2019/12/21/britains-tories-are-the-worlds-most-successful-party-heres-whyBetter to stick with them long term than jump to Reform - which could well just go 'pop' in a couple of years. Either way the Conservatives faces an existential crisis right now. If Reform poll around 10-15%, the Tories could very easily win less than 100 seats in the General Election. Odds on that are still 7-1. You heard it hear first. |
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ltdgas
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Post by ltdgas on Feb 16, 2024 10:46:45 GMT
Nothing changed for me , still 100% reform
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oldie
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Post by oldie on Feb 16, 2024 15:24:16 GMT
I would love it if Reform thinks they have a chance. They will have to come out of the shadows and articulate a policy.
That should be a laugh
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Post by Nobbygas on Feb 16, 2024 15:55:10 GMT
I would love it if Reform thinks they have a chance. They will have to come out of the shadows and articulate a policy. That should be a laugh No, Reform don't 'have a chance'. They are building for the future. They have policies. I gave you the link earlier. What is funny is that you still think the old tired two parties can govern this country successfully. |
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ltdgas
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Post by ltdgas on Feb 16, 2024 16:11:36 GMT
I would love it if Reform thinks they have a chance. They will have to come out of the shadows and articulate a policy. That should be a laugh For you to be bringing them up your obviously rattled 😂😂,ive at no - point heard anyone from reform say they expect to win any election , there happy to give a home to voters who won’t vote tory or commy Policies , mine the beaches , capital punishment ( hanging ) , legislation to make a return to eu impossible , all national buildings to fly Union Jack , 10% of gdp on armaments , last I heard , may of changed of late , did hear a mention of 1in / 1 out on immigration , though can’t see many navigating the mines so won’t arrive anyway hopefully , though maybe the smugglers have heard this thats why migrants on Lorries is back in the news Watch gb news & you can hear the policies for yourself , Ben habib , ticey & nige farage are always on there , our boris is meant to be but not seen him yet |
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ltdgas
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Post by ltdgas on Feb 16, 2024 16:18:07 GMT
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oldie
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Post by oldie on Feb 16, 2024 16:21:02 GMT
I would love it if Reform thinks they have a chance. They will have to come out of the shadows and articulate a policy. That should be a laugh No, Reform don't 'have a chance'. They are building for the future. They have policies. I gave you the link earlier. What is funny is that you still think the old tired two parties can govern this country successfully. I don't think that. I do think we, as a country, are in a mess, politically and economically. The Tories just ramble on regardless and Labour say "yes that's true and will do....hold on we will tell you later...😂😂 Saw a Reform rep on TV this morning, it was hilarious. Guaranteeing GP appointments within a specified time scale, but couldn't say how...until Feb 24 apparently. Asked how they will fund raising the tax threshold from £12,500 to £20K...he couldn't answer. Cannot wait for one of them to stand up and tell the truth... |
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ltdgas
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Post by ltdgas on Feb 16, 2024 16:27:35 GMT
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oldie
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Post by oldie on Feb 16, 2024 20:19:35 GMT
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eppinggas
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Post by eppinggas on Feb 17, 2024 9:09:49 GMT
I would love it if Reform thinks they have a chance. They will have to come out of the shadows and articulate a policy. That should be a laugh No, Reform don't 'have a chance'. They are building for the future. They have policies. I gave you the link earlier. What is funny is that you still think the old tired two parties can govern this country successfully. The usual blind ignorance. I sent a link about a month back and summarised the main policies (objectively). But the far left didn't want to engage. Here it is (again). www.reformparty.uk/reformisessentialIt really wasn't very hard to find. I guess if you exclusively use links from the grauniad you might fail to locate it though. As for the Labour Party. It's just a picture of a pair of flip-flops isn't it? |
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trymer
Joined: November 2018
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Post by trymer on Feb 17, 2024 9:19:55 GMT
For once I agree with Sir Keir "people want a change" yes they do,the depressing news for Sir Keir is that after 5 or 10 years of Labour the people would want another change. The tories are unpopular and got stuffed last night,not really unexpected,the BIG news was Reform beating the Lib Dems and the Greens into 3rd place in both by elections. That really matters because for the first time Reform get over 10% and show the polls about them are correct,also the Lib Dems and Greens are established parties with experience in many elections,canvassing teams etc....Reform are a young party just getting started and on the way up,its hard work,just ask Anna Soubrey. I will vote for Reform unless they make the mistake of letting tory ministers join. The Labour Party and the Tory Party face the same old problem. They are both broad churches and battle to keep the extreme elements of the party under control. There is no credible alternative for Labour voters. Marxists, Socialist Workers, and Communists have all been proven unappealing to the British public. Reform is a credible alternative for Conservative voters. I think a few high profile right wing Tories defecting there would increase their vote share (might annoy you trymer). Problem is that politically a Tory heading to Reform would be a massive risk. The Conservative Party is the single most successful political party in Western Europe over the last couple of centuries. Actually - make that the world www.economist.com/britain/2019/12/21/britains-tories-are-the-worlds-most-successful-party-heres-whyBetter to stick with them long term than jump to Reform - which could well just go 'pop' in a couple of years. Either way the Conservatives faces an existential crisis right now. If Reform poll around 10-15%, the Tories could very easily win less than 100 seats in the General Election. Odds on that are still 7-1. You heard it hear first. Yes as soon as the phrase "broad church " is used you know that particular mob will spend most of their time fighting amongst themselves like rats in a sack. Just appealing to disgruntled Tory voters wont be enough,one area where Reform could score in traditional Labour areas that have been blitzed by crime is by really having draconian policies on crime and building new prisons. I think that letting to many Tories in would put some people off (me anyway) Boris Johnson has been mentioned,no doubt if he thought it was in his interest he would join Reform,he wasnt a Brexiteer until it seemed like a good idea for him to become one....blokes a ****,just interested in himself, for everyone who would vote for him half a dozen would be put off. |
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oldie
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Post by oldie on Feb 17, 2024 12:54:12 GMT
Rather than focus on whether voters becomes seduced by Tice and his wannabe libertarian chancers, how about a bit of reflection policy of the last decade (2010 in reality) and the outcomes? There are some interesting comparisons with the USA, especially within the context of the unrelenting personal attacks on Biden.
For example
"Several unique characteristics of the U.S. economy have sheltered it from recessionary storms, analysts say. The federal government provided about $5 trillion in pandemic aid in 2020 and 2021, far more than overseas counterparts, which left most households in much better financial shape and supported consumer spending well into 2023."
And
"The Biden administration has also subsidized more construction of manufacturing plants and infrastructure through additional legislation passed in 2021 and 2022 that was still having an impact last year. About a quarter of the U.S. economy’s solid 2.5% growth in 2023 was made up of government spending."
"Americans have been better protected from rising rates than U.K. counterparts, for example, because most U.S. homeowners with mortgages have long, 30-year fixed rates. As a result, the Federal Reserve’s rapid rate hikes of the past two years—which have lifted mortgage rates from around 3% to about 6.7%—have had little effect on many U.S. homeowners."
And, shock horror 😱😱
"Another benefit for the United States is that it experienced a surge in immigration in recent years, which has made it easier for businesses to fill jobs and potentially expand their operations, leading to more people earning wages and then spending those earnings."
Who would have thought it😂😂
In contrast
"Japan, by contrast, is rapidly aging and has seen its population shrink for years, as it is less open to foreign labor. A declining population can act as a powerful drag on economic growth."
Japan has now joined us in recession.
Compare and contrast to the words of Tice and his band of chancers or the tired old lags in the Tory Party. For balance, compare with the lack of courage on stated policy by the Labour Party.
Compare, lastly, with the comments on here.
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ltdgas
Joined: June 2014
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Post by ltdgas on Feb 17, 2024 13:31:03 GMT
Rather than focus on whether voters becomes seduced by Tice and his wannabe libertarian chancers, how about a bit of reflection policy of the last decade (2010 in reality) and the outcomes? There are some interesting comparisons with the USA, especially within the context of the unrelenting personal attacks on Biden. For example "Several unique characteristics of the U.S. economy have sheltered it from recessionary storms, analysts say. The federal government provided about $5 trillion in pandemic aid in 2020 and 2021, far more than overseas counterparts, which left most households in much better financial shape and supported consumer spending well into 2023." And "The Biden administration has also subsidized more construction of manufacturing plants and infrastructure through additional legislation passed in 2021 and 2022 that was still having an impact last year. About a quarter of the U.S. economy’s solid 2.5% growth in 2023 was made up of government spending." "Americans have been better protected from rising rates than U.K. counterparts, for example, because most U.S. homeowners with mortgages have long, 30-year fixed rates. As a result, the Federal Reserve’s rapid rate hikes of the past two years—which have lifted mortgage rates from around 3% to about 6.7%—have had little effect on many U.S. homeowners." And, shock horror 😱😱 "Another benefit for the United States is that it experienced a surge in immigration in recent years, which has made it easier for businesses to fill jobs and potentially expand their operations, leading to more people earning wages and then spending those earnings." Who would have thought it😂😂 In contrast "Japan, by contrast, is rapidly aging and has seen its population shrink for years, as it is less open to foreign labor. A declining population can act as a powerful drag on economic growth." Japan has now joined us in recession. Compare and contrast to the words of Tice and his band of chancers or the tired old lags in the Tory Party. For balance, compare with the lack of courage on stated policy by the Labour Party. Compare, lastly, with the comments on here. Well we’ve had a surge in immigration so what’s gone wrong then ? According to you we should all be prospering through it !!! You live in some bloody cuckoo land , How many more times , immigration suppresses working class people’s wages , the people you lefties are meant to care about , but you & your like don’t give a s**t , you don’t care people can’t get houses in this country because there using thousands for the people you say make our life’s better , 8 billion Pa on them the last I read If migration & the USA is so good move there , there’s nothing stopping you , other than you’re hatred of the place So away you go , I’m working class , list all the benifits I get from immigration ? |
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oldie
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Post by oldie on Feb 17, 2024 15:01:32 GMT
Rather than focus on whether voters becomes seduced by Tice and his wannabe libertarian chancers, how about a bit of reflection policy of the last decade (2010 in reality) and the outcomes? There are some interesting comparisons with the USA, especially within the context of the unrelenting personal attacks on Biden. For example "Several unique characteristics of the U.S. economy have sheltered it from recessionary storms, analysts say. The federal government provided about $5 trillion in pandemic aid in 2020 and 2021, far more than overseas counterparts, which left most households in much better financial shape and supported consumer spending well into 2023." And "The Biden administration has also subsidized more construction of manufacturing plants and infrastructure through additional legislation passed in 2021 and 2022 that was still having an impact last year. About a quarter of the U.S. economy’s solid 2.5% growth in 2023 was made up of government spending." "Americans have been better protected from rising rates than U.K. counterparts, for example, because most U.S. homeowners with mortgages have long, 30-year fixed rates. As a result, the Federal Reserve’s rapid rate hikes of the past two years—which have lifted mortgage rates from around 3% to about 6.7%—have had little effect on many U.S. homeowners." And, shock horror 😱😱 "Another benefit for the United States is that it experienced a surge in immigration in recent years, which has made it easier for businesses to fill jobs and potentially expand their operations, leading to more people earning wages and then spending those earnings." Who would have thought it😂😂 In contrast "Japan, by contrast, is rapidly aging and has seen its population shrink for years, as it is less open to foreign labor. A declining population can act as a powerful drag on economic growth." Japan has now joined us in recession. Compare and contrast to the words of Tice and his band of chancers or the tired old lags in the Tory Party. For balance, compare with the lack of courage on stated policy by the Labour Party. Compare, lastly, with the comments on here. Well we’ve had a surge in immigration so what’s gone wrong then ? According to you we should all be prospering through it !!! You live in some bloody cuckoo land , How many more times , immigration suppresses working class people’s wages , the people you lefties are meant to care about , but you & your like don’t give a s**t , you don’t care people can’t get houses in this country because there using thousands for the people you say make our life’s better , 8 billion Pa on them the last I read If migration & the USA is so good move there , there’s nothing stopping you , other than you’re hatred of the place So away you go , I’m working class , list all the benifits I get from immigration ? Take a break, good luck with the procedures you mentioned. |
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eppinggas
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Post by eppinggas on Feb 18, 2024 9:09:34 GMT
By-elections. Obviously a bloody nose for the Tories, no surprise there.
Reform performed very well. They polled 13% in Wellingborough and 10.4% in Kingswood.
Bookies are offering 4-5 that Reform poll 9% or over in the GE. As long as there is no electoral pact with the Tories, this looks good value.
If Farage throws support behind them - then those odds on this will tighten dramatically.
Lots of ifs and buts - but a Farage backed Reform Party could easily poll 15%+ and this wipes out the Tories in a huge number of constituencies.
Sky are offering 7-1 on Tories winning less than 100 seats in the GE. It's the wrong odds. Sadly punters are limited to a £17 stake. I tried a lot more...
The other thing of note is that the Libdems lost 3 and 3.5% of their vote share respectively. This is absolutely shocking for them.
Ed Davey has gone into hiding since his prominent role in the Post Office Horizon scandal. Last seen entering a bunker with Diane Abbott.
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eppinggas
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Post by eppinggas on Feb 18, 2024 9:26:55 GMT
Well we’ve had a surge in immigration so what’s gone wrong then ? According to you we should all be prospering through it !!! You live in some bloody cuckoo land , How many more times , immigration suppresses working class people’s wages , the people you lefties are meant to care about , but you & your like don’t give a s**t , you don’t care people can’t get houses in this country because there using thousands for the people you say make our life’s better , 8 billion Pa on them the last I read If migration & the USA is so good move there , there’s nothing stopping you , other than you’re hatred of the place So away you go , I’m working class , list all the benifits I get from immigration ? What an excellent question. "I’m working class , list all the benefits I get from immigration". That is a very tough one to answer. And the difficulty in answering that leads one to look at the remarkable performance of the anti-immigration parties - particularly Brexit (when it was the most popular political party in the 2019 MEP elections). The huge number of people who voted for them then, are still angry and frustrated. Nothing has changed. It's got worse. Net immigration numbers are higher, as is their degree of frustration. Coupled with the cost of living crisis - unavoidable given financially responsible Govt + Covid + Ukraine - you have a lot of very angry people out there. I guess if you've worked in the City, gained huge financial benefits from the pro-business Tory Governments of the 80's & 90's, and have retired to a leafy retreat in a hugely white area, you can feel more comfortable twisting reality and saying how marvelous mass immigration has been. Champagne socialists. Or is it Prossecco these days? As for the working class voice. You don't get to hear that. Anyone who questions mass immigration must be racist. 'Cos it's all the Tories fault. Innit bruv? |
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oldie
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Post by oldie on Feb 18, 2024 9:43:01 GMT
Well we’ve had a surge in immigration so what’s gone wrong then ? According to you we should all be prospering through it !!! You live in some bloody cuckoo land , How many more times , immigration suppresses working class people’s wages , the people you lefties are meant to care about , but you & your like don’t give a s**t , you don’t care people can’t get houses in this country because there using thousands for the people you say make our life’s better , 8 billion Pa on them the last I read If migration & the USA is so good move there , there’s nothing stopping you , other than you’re hatred of the place So away you go , I’m working class , list all the benifits I get from immigration ? What an excellent question. "I’m working class , list all the benefits I get from immigration". That is a very tough one to answer. And the difficulty in answering that leads one to look at the remarkable performance of the anti-immigration parties - particularly Brexit (when it was the most popular political party in the 2019 MEP elections). The huge number of people who voted for them then, are still angry and frustrated. Nothing has changed. It's got worse. Net immigration numbers are higher, as is their degree of frustration. Coupled with the cost of living crisis - unavoidable given financially responsible Govt + Covid + Ukraine - you have a lot of very angry people out there. I guess if you've worked in the City, gained huge financial benefits from the pro-business Tory Governments of the 80's & 90's, and have retired to a leafy retreat in a hugely white area, you can feel more comfortable twisting reality and saying how marvelous mass immigration has been. Champagne socialists. Or is it Prossecco these days? As for the working class voice. You don't get to hear that. Anyone who questions mass immigration must be racist. 'Cos it's all the Tories fault. Innit bruv? Perhaps to answer the question "I am working class, list all the benefits I get from immigration" we should define what is working class? As Ltd has emphasised his personal circumstances, let's carry that on, let's all define ourselves by class background. I will start Born in Southmead Brought up in Knowle, Queenshill Rd, Spring Gardens, council houses. Fishponds when my father went into the pub trade when I was 14. Maternal grandfather was a boiler maker in the shipyards, paternal grandfather was a dock worker.Father left school at 15 and became a printers apprentice at Everards. Me, Knowle Park Juniors and Hengrove Comprehensive. I left Bristol at 18. Does that background qualify me as Working Class? Can I speak as such? |
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oldie
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Post by oldie on Feb 19, 2024 20:07:04 GMT
What???
I am the only openly obvious working class person on here?
Or, ...what??
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