irishrover
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Joined: June 2014
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Post by irishrover on Aug 21, 2014 15:54:09 GMT
I think the players need a defining moment to 'get' Rovers and it's supporters. An away game where the noise levels are high, there's a big following and support is from the off. I feel that off the pitch and in players heads Monday could be huge. I think this is right. People are only human - I'mn very grateful that I moved to Manchester and have therefore only been able to get to maybe 10 games a season for the last 4 years. I think players are getting stick because fans are so utterly frustrated with where we find ourselves and that's the easiest way to express it. Probably is a bit harsh on them though - I was surprised at how much abuse players were getting at games I went to last year - far more than I can remember in the past (maybe rose-tinted specs though, you tend to try and blot out the crap times. I certainly remember Ollie's teams taking some abuse on the terraces from time to time). The point is that we are crying out for a momementum shifting moment - it's hard to argue against the view that it's been more or less straight downhill since we beat Southampton with that magical Andy Williams goal. Have we actually had a single memorable positive moment since then? I think that's as long as I can remember going as a Rovers fan without having at least something to cling on to. Even in the early - mid 00's when we were crap we still had moments. Agogo v Yeovil, the LDV Cup run where lost to Southend, turning round a game at home to Scunny when they were top of the league. These things stand out. I suppose the wins at Fleetwood and Rotherham 18 months ago were good moments but really we're desperately crying out for something like that; doubly so I think when there's a new set of players that need to win a very disgruntled fanbase over. I've never given any Rovers player any stick on a football field - if they're playing crap I normally feel sorry for them rather than angry; no one wants to play badly after all. Remember seeing Trevor Challis telling a fan to F-off for giving him abuse in front of the West Stand enclosure. Big mistake that was - everytime he got the ball in any game after that about 10-15 blokes would shout out 'F-off Trevor' at him. I'm always of the view that if fans give it out then they need to be prepared to take it back in kind.
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Gashead
Joined: May 2014
Posts: 260
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Post by Gashead on Aug 21, 2014 15:59:15 GMT
I think the players need a defining moment to 'get' Rovers and it's supporters. An away game where the noise levels are high, there's a big following and support is from the off. I feel that off the pitch and in players heads Monday could be huge. A win on Saturday and FGR away is huge. Could be a 'turning point', if I may use a worn out cliché. I'm not taking Telford for granted mind you - bearing in mind we lost on Saturday to a team who finished below them last season. They'll be determined, and I'm sure they'll want to make up for what was a poor performance on Sunday against Aldershot.
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Post by therealist on Aug 21, 2014 16:35:51 GMT
We lack confidence because we aren't playing well in the first few games and have a tactically inept, cry baby manager. It's little, or nothing, to do with the 7,000 fans who turned out against Grimsby to offer excellent support. I get the impression Wes your not to happy about our manager, care to expand why in more detail ?? You say he is tactically "inept", for us who are not qualified FA coaches, can you explain that a bit more in detail us plebs can understand ?? Hmm, let me see - failed as assistant, failed as manager during the last 8 games of the season (where he only had to collect a paltry 8 points). See the tactical shambles against Torquay and Mansfield last season for examples of his naivety. He's admittedly struggled in the transfer market and found it difficult to attract players. Need I go on?
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Deleted
Joined: January 1970
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Post by Deleted on Aug 21, 2014 17:40:26 GMT
I get the impression Wes your not to happy about our manager, care to expand why in more detail ?? You say he is tactically "inept", for us who are not qualified FA coaches, can you explain that a bit more in detail us plebs can understand ?? Hmm, let me see - failed as assistant, failed as manager during the last 8 games of the season (where he only had to collect a paltry 8 points). See the tactical shambles against Torquay and Mansfield last season for examples of his naivety. He's admittedly struggled in the transfer market and found it difficult to attract players. Need I go on? Yes please go on ! You explain the effect of his "inept tactics" but not the cause. I'm still non the wiser why you think he is inept. You state his tactics are inept you must know why ?? I wait with interest your answer so i can get a better understanding why you think he is inept ?? Anybody can say somebody is inept i would just like to know what you base that on
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Post by PeterHooper57 on Aug 21, 2014 17:52:41 GMT
Hmm, let me see - failed as assistant, failed as manager during the last 8 games of the season (where he only had to collect a paltry 8 points). See the tactical shambles against Torquay and Mansfield last season for examples of his naivety. He's admittedly struggled in the transfer market and found it difficult to attract players. Need I go on? Yes please go on ! You explain the effect of his "inept tactics" but not the cause. I'm still non the wiser why you think he is inept. You state his tactics are inept you must know why ?? I wait with interest your answer so i can get a better understanding why you think he is inept ?? Anybody can say somebody is inept i would just like to know what you base that on Players like continuity and familiarity, Clarke has none of that about his teams, he sets up and sends them out in a different team every game, the reason he ****** up at Barnet, was primarily because he left out too many of the players who did reasonably well against grimsby. The players are scared to make mistakes, he his constantly ********* them from the touch line. And why he thinks Gosling a left footer is going to beat his full back and provide crosses for the strikers on the right wing , when the lads natural instinct is always to cut inside is beyond me. etc etc etc. UTG
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Deleted
Joined: January 1970
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Post by Deleted on Aug 21, 2014 18:01:46 GMT
I think the players need a defining moment to 'get' Rovers and it's supporters. An away game where the noise levels are high, there's a big following and support is from the off. I feel that off the pitch and in players heads Monday could be huge. Like Dagenham and Redbridge two seasons ago? Oxford last season? D*cked on we were. Got naff all to do with what we do on the terrace. I'm not saying it's up to the supporters I'm saying that the quicker a rapport is built up between the supporters and players the better. If you ask anyone that has been successful with rovers what they loved and it was the atmosphere and relationship with the fans.
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Post by therealist on Aug 21, 2014 18:02:15 GMT
Hmm, let me see - failed as assistant, failed as manager during the last 8 games of the season (where he only had to collect a paltry 8 points). See the tactical shambles against Torquay and Mansfield last season for examples of his naivety. He's admittedly struggled in the transfer market and found it difficult to attract players. Need I go on? Yes please go on ! You explain the effect of his "inept tactics" but not the cause. I'm still non the wiser why you think he is inept. You state his tactics are inept you must know why ?? I wait with interest your answer so i can get a better understanding why you think he is inept ?? Anybody can say somebody is inept i would just like to know what you base that on Indecisiveness, tinkering with his tactics every 5 mins, pumping long balls up to Gillespie/Beardsley (Torquay) and similar tactics most games, out-numbered in midfield etc etc.
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Deleted
Joined: January 1970
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Post by Deleted on Aug 21, 2014 18:12:29 GMT
Yes please go on ! You explain the effect of his "inept tactics" but not the cause. I'm still non the wiser why you think he is inept. You state his tactics are inept you must know why ?? I wait with interest your answer so i can get a better understanding why you think he is inept ?? Anybody can say somebody is inept i would just like to know what you base that on Indecisiveness, tinkering with his tactics every 5 mins, pumping long balls up to Gillespie/Beardsley (Torquay) and similar tactics most games, out-numbered in midfield etc etc. But most successful do this !. Alex Ferguson was a great example of this - Premier league team different to his European champions team ?? Is that so wrong ?? Beardsley was and is still a good header of the ball why is that wrong ??
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Deleted
Joined: January 1970
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Post by Deleted on Aug 21, 2014 18:36:57 GMT
Yes please go on ! You explain the effect of his "inept tactics" but not the cause. I'm still non the wiser why you think he is inept. You state his tactics are inept you must know why ?? I wait with interest your answer so i can get a better understanding why you think he is inept ?? Anybody can say somebody is inept i would just like to know what you base that on Indecisiveness, tinkering with his tactics every 5 mins, pumping long balls up to Gillespie/Beardsley (Torquay) and similar tactics most games, out-numbered in midfield etc etc. I agree with you regarding Clarke tinkering with the squad/tactics,we need a settled team for sure. But the long ball is down to Clarke you think? If you go to games you will not see Clarke yelling at Parks,Mchrystal or Brown to lump it long. Quite the opposite. And there lies most of the problems from what I have seen this season. Our experienced defence lumping it long. Again. Maybe due to the fact that they see no one in front actually wanting the ball but also not wanting to have it too long at their feet either. Another Rovers problem since Stuart Campbell left imo. But if you take away the mistakes from our experienced defence the Rovers would not have played 3 and lost 2.
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Deleted
Joined: January 1970
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Post by Deleted on Aug 21, 2014 19:09:44 GMT
Of course we lump it long, we're in the Conference and that's the right tactic for this league. Messing around trying to play fancy Dan pretty football won't work, we need hard tackling mid fielders, no nonsense safety first defence and hard running forwards pressurising the channels and making their defence and midfield work hard in their half not ours. Physicality, hard work and commitment is what's need, not attempted deft touches and incisive passing from donkeys
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Post by Cosmic Pasty on Aug 21, 2014 19:11:41 GMT
This 'it's all the fans' fault' is starting to piss me off. Yes, the fans could do better, but that is obvious. Fans can always do better, because they are never perfect. But that doesn't mean as soon as they are less than perfect you can blame them. You don't get perfect fans; they're human beings who react to what's going on on the pitch. They're not mindless cheering machines. They are not obliged to be mindless cheering machines. Our fans have put up with a lot worse than most fans ever should and we have reacted better than most would, istm. Look at the Grimsby game, we couldn't have been hardly any better. It was amazing support considering the s*** we have had to take, and we got rewarded with a 0-0 against a very average side missing half their team. And we still cheered the team off at the end enthusiastically. We've had 4 s*** seasons, 4 seasons of real, proper s***, and 600 fans still go to support them at Barnet, and someone shouts something less than complimentary, and suddenly 'it's all the fans' fault' again. Honestly, this is a stupid idea that needs to stop. It's easy to say, but just having a few blokes (or even a load of blokes) berating the team doesn't make it the fans' fault. The responsibility lies with the Board, the manager, and the team. Arrange them in whatever order you wish, depending on your personal agenda. But the fans are last on that list. It's not the fans' fault. I totally agree. I've never shouted abuse at the players and wouldn't. When I think about it, poor performances usually just leave me speechless anyway. Torquay at home last season sticks in my mind for that. I can still remember the way we turned to each other in stunned silence after it was all over - I think we were halfway back to the car before anyone could bring themselves to say anything, and you'd have thought from the atmosphere on the way home that we were in convoy led by a hearse in front. What pees me off is that I could turn up as an individual and cheer my heart out in support of the lads and may even be in the majority, but it wouldn't matter in the finish because Darrell Clarke could still get on the radio at the end of it all and make our lads sound like a bunch of trembling pansies in order to justify a poor performance that he's had a major role in orchestrating, knowing that his words are being heard all across the west and will be repeated in the papers the next day. What a way to replace this alleged 'fear' with pride. Not. And we're the ones being urged by the chairman to think of the psychological damage we might be doing and get behind the team?
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Deleted
Joined: January 1970
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Post by Deleted on Aug 21, 2014 19:16:04 GMT
Of course we lump it long, we're in the Conference and that's the right tactic for this league. Messing around trying to play fancy Dan pretty football won't work, we need hard tackling mid fielders, no nonsense safety first defence and hard running forwards pressurising the channels and making their defence and midfield work hard in their half not ours. Physicality, hard work and commitment is what's need, not attempted deft touches and incisive passing from donkeys You say lumping it long is the right tactic then say we need hard tackling midfielders!! You obviously havent watched Rovers this season as its the defence who have been the cause of the defeats. Yep,lump it long and get it back with interest. very good tactics that. You brought a smile to my face tho. Comedy gold mate.
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Deleted
Joined: January 1970
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Post by Deleted on Aug 21, 2014 19:57:52 GMT
Of course we lump it long, we're in the Conference and that's the right tactic for this league. Messing around trying to play fancy Dan pretty football won't work, we need hard tackling mid fielders, no nonsense safety first defence and hard running forwards pressurising the channels and making their defence and midfield work hard in their half not ours. Physicality, hard work and commitment is what's need, not attempted deft touches and incisive passing from donkeys You say lumping it long is the right tactic then say we need hard tackling midfielders!! You obviously havent watched Rovers this season as its the defence who have been the cause of the defeats. Yep,lump it long and get it back with interest. very good tactics that. You brought a smile to my face tho. Comedy gold mate. There's 11 on a team, keep their defence under pressure and yours is having an easy time. Win the ball back as soon as and get it back down their end. A simple message for simple minds...works wonders in football the world over. Glad it brought a smile, it's adoption would probably bring many more UTG
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Deleted
Joined: January 1970
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Post by Deleted on Aug 22, 2014 0:53:34 GMT
This 'it's all the fans' fault' is starting to piss me off. Yes, the fans could do better, but that is obvious. Fans can always do better, because they are never perfect. But that doesn't mean as soon as they are less than perfect you can blame them. You don't get perfect fans; they're human beings who react to what's going on on the pitch. They're not mindless cheering machines. They are not obliged to be mindless cheering machines. Our fans have put up with a lot worse than most fans ever should and we have reacted better than most would, istm. Look at the Grimsby game, we couldn't have been hardly any better. It was amazing support considering the s*** we have had to take, and we got rewarded with a 0-0 against a very average side missing half their team. And we still cheered the team off at the end enthusiastically. We've had 4 s*** seasons, 4 seasons of real, proper s***, and 600 fans still go to support them at Barnet, and someone shouts something less than complimentary, and suddenly 'it's all the fans' fault' again. Honestly, this is a stupid idea that needs to stop. It's easy to say, but just having a few blokes (or even a load of blokes) berating the team doesn't make it the fans' fault. The responsibility lies with the Board, the manager, and the team. Arrange them in whatever order you wish, depending on your personal agenda. But the fans are last on that list. It's not the fans' fault. Historically at both Eastville and Twerton, it was always the unwritten rule that supporters did not get on players (or the teams) backs. I have witnessed on many occasions a supporter shout something that was intended not to be complimentary, and the people around him would tell him forcefully, and in no uncertain terms to be quiet. The general rule was that the team (and players) were doing their best and it was the job of the supporters to support them. That alone created atmosphere. But it's also fair to say that at the time we may not have had the best players in the Football League, but they were all trying to do their best for the good of the club. You've only to look at the list of players that have represented BRFC to realise the passion for the club that they had. Similarly with the managers, and I'm thinking particularly of Gerry Francis and Bobby Gould, they both used the limited resources that were available to them and produced results that should have been well beyond them and the team. But all of this seemed to produce an atmosphere around the club, that sadly appears to me to be missing today. There always seemed to be a siege mentality about the club, us versus them, and out of that adversity came fight and determination. Sadly that all seems to have passed into history now, and the end of that particular era was (in my opinion) when Gerry Francis finally gave up the ghost and left for QPR, and in doing so also took some of our best players with him for good luck. Now I do realise that there have been highs since then, but truth be told we were always going ever-so-slowly downhill from that point. I suppose that it could be argued that for many years the club was punching above its weight, and that the supporters became conditioned to watching successful teams. But with the passing of time, and managers and players, things have radically changed . . . but the expectation has not. But in any event we are where we are, and only results on the pitch can affect that, so it's a matter of of simply hanging on and hoping for the best because only the Board of Directors (aka the Custodians of BRFC) can affect that. We must trust that they can employ a manager (perhaps they have him already, who knows?) who can recruit, train and motivate a squad of players capable of restoring some of the ''feelgood factor'' to the club. My thought is that whoever the manager (or Board) of the day is, then he/they have a fair bit of ground to make up . . . in all respects. our fans have changed,probably because of several poor seasons,now were like city fans cheer when were winning and boo when were losing simple as that,thats what city fans have always done now were the same im sad about that
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Deleted
Joined: January 1970
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Post by Deleted on Aug 22, 2014 1:05:49 GMT
I get the impression Wes your not to happy about our manager, care to expand why in more detail ?? You say he is tactically "inept", for us who are not qualified FA coaches, can you explain that a bit more in detail us plebs can understand ?? Hmm, let me see - failed as assistant, failed as manager during the last 8 games of the season (where he only had to collect a paltry 8 points). See the tactical shambles against Torquay and Mansfield last season for examples of his naivety. He's admittedly struggled in the transfer market and found it difficult to attract players. Need I go on? no dont go on maybe just shut up for a bit? your relentless and bitter assault on the manager and players has no balance at all you are very boring
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Post by therealist on Aug 22, 2014 3:04:19 GMT
Indecisiveness, tinkering with his tactics every 5 mins, pumping long balls up to Gillespie/Beardsley (Torquay) and similar tactics most games, out-numbered in midfield etc etc. But most successful do this !. Alex Ferguson was a great example of this - Premier league team different to his European champions team ?? Is that so wrong ?? Beardsley was and is still a good header of the ball why is that wrong ?? We're not Manchester United. It's wrong because it clearly didn't work, both visually and statistically - 3 goals/1 assist in 28 apps for Beardsley. I'm obviously not blaming Clarke entirely, but he was part of the coaching staff for the whole season. Judging by the opening 3 games, those long ball tactics appear to have continued - 1 goal in 3 games suggests it's not working again. What was it that Einstein said about doing the same thing over and expecting different results?
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