eppinggas
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Ian Alexander
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Post by eppinggas on Dec 7, 2020 11:01:53 GMT
Some very interesting views expressed in the thread. Please remember to keep it polite, and play nicely. And maybe, just maybe, we can find a position that can accommodate a vast majority of views. You may say I'm a dreamer, but I'm not the only one.
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Deleted
Joined: January 1970
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Post by Deleted on Dec 7, 2020 11:07:52 GMT
We’ve been brought up to fear equality in this country. I wonder why? And for whose benefit? It’s a real head scratcher that one.... We are probably the most inclusive country in the world. I wasn’t talking about racially, I was referring to the disparity of wealth which is one of the worst in Europe and frankly embarrassing for a nation of our output. The wealth accumulates at the top more than ever before and we’ve been conditioned to think that that’s the most efficient form of capitalism that there is.
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Rex
Predictions League
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Post by Rex on Dec 7, 2020 11:14:27 GMT
Some very interesting views expressed in the thread. Please remember to keep it polite, and play nicely. And maybe, just maybe, we can find a position that can accommodate a vast majority of views. You may say I'm a dreamer, but I'm not the only one. Bollocks
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Post by mangogas15 on Dec 7, 2020 11:38:14 GMT
Some very interesting views expressed in the thread. Please remember to keep it polite, and play nicely. And maybe, just maybe, we can find a position that can accommodate a vast majority of views. You may say I'm a dreamer, but I'm not the only one. 40th anniversary of his death tomorrow
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Post by mangogas15 on Dec 7, 2020 11:40:39 GMT
Just watch any episode of The Crown season 3 or 4 and I for one am glad I work to live in 2020 rather than back then.
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Deleted
Joined: January 1970
Posts: 0
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Post by Deleted on Dec 7, 2020 11:54:50 GMT
Just watch any episode of The Crown season 3 or 4 and I for one am glad I work to live in 2020 rather than back then. Well yeah, I thank my lucky stars every day that I’m not off to a Victorian workhouse but that doesn’t mean I’m going to be content with stagnant wages for the lowest percentile of the country whilst those at the top use their already existing wealth and privilege to generate more wealth and privilege. As an advanced nation academically and economically we should be better than that ideologically and we should want better than that. I don’t think we do though, I get the impression that there are plenty in the UK who, if offered ten pounds with the caveat that their neighbour also got ten pounds would prefer to be given five pounds with the caveat that their neighbour gets nothing.
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Post by Global Gas on Dec 7, 2020 12:18:03 GMT
Wow, what a difference, the great, often classier superior sport of rugby. Ha! Vive le France! Some black people are sick of being seen as a victim. Maybe they're sick to death of white middle class metaphorically 'patting them on the head' and going 'ahhh'. I could ask why the deadly dull,virtue signalling liberals don't do for our white working class,as they do our black and brown people? Eg,a foreign country gets an apparent bad deal somewhere on earth and up they jump,as uppity as you like. Liberal UK ask,why are you wrecking the neighbourhood? What bothers? It's your culture is'nt it. Oh,me too,I hate Israel. Yes,Churchill was an evil rascist. Hmmm.I understand and I'll make sure I talk about it at my next dinner party. The dreaded awful white working class dare to voice an opinion of discontent and our stinking ,virtue signalling liberal hypocrites point and scream at them "rascist scum"!"Ban them"!""Shut them down"! Get BLM out of our game. See this is part of the problem. And we all do it. We attach the actions of a minority to the will of the majority. Personally, I think there are darker forces at work to make us attack each other and stay in our lanes. Lots of money is spent on telling us immigrants are dangerous. Lots of money is spent on telling us all who voted for BREXIT are racist. Lots of money is spent on putting you and I at odds. My point is, I think the majority want the same thing, equality for all. Yet we're told via interest vested media that these guys are against equality for this group. This group is keeping you down. This group is prioritised over you. This guy with nothing is pitted against this guy with nothing while the guys with it all fan the flames so that no one looks at what they've got.
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eppinggas
Administrator
Ian Alexander
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Post by eppinggas on Dec 7, 2020 12:32:03 GMT
See this is part of the problem. And we all do it. We attach the actions of a minority to the will of the majority. Personally, I think there are darker forces at work to make us attack each other and stay in our lanes. Lots of money is spent on telling us immigrants are dangerous. Lots of money is spent on telling us all who voted for BREXIT are racist. Lots of money is spent on putting you and I at odds.My point is, I think the majority want the same thing, equality for all. Yet we're told via interest vested media that these guys are against equality for this group. This group is keeping you down. This group is prioritised over you. This guy with nothing is pitted against this guy with nothing while the guys with it all fan the flames so that no one looks at what they've got.Nope - I just don't subscribe to this particular conspiracy theory. For those who truly believe "dark and mysterious forces" are at work to keep down the proletarian rabble... James O'Brien is available 10am-1pm weekdays on LBC.
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Deleted
Joined: January 1970
Posts: 0
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Post by Deleted on Dec 7, 2020 12:47:05 GMT
Ha! Vive le France! Some black people are sick of being seen as a victim. Maybe they're sick to death of white middle class metaphorically 'patting them on the head' and going 'ahhh'. I could ask why the deadly dull,virtue signalling liberals don't do for our white working class,as they do our black and brown people? Eg,a foreign country gets an apparent bad deal somewhere on earth and up they jump,as uppity as you like. Liberal UK ask,why are you wrecking the neighbourhood? What bothers? It's your culture is'nt it. Oh,me too,I hate Israel. Yes,Churchill was an evil rascist. Hmmm.I understand and I'll make sure I talk about it at my next dinner party. The dreaded awful white working class dare to voice an opinion of discontent and our stinking ,virtue signalling liberal hypocrites point and scream at them "rascist scum"!"Ban them"!""Shut them down"! Get BLM out of our game. See this is part of the problem. And we all do it. We attach the actions of a minority to the will of the majority. Personally, I think there are darker forces at work to make us attack each other and stay in our lanes. Lots of money is spent on telling us immigrants are dangerous. Lots of money is spent on telling us all who voted for BREXIT are racist. Lots of money is spent on putting you and I at odds. My point is, I think the majority want the same thing, equality for all. Yet we're told via interest vested media that these guys are against equality for this group. This group is keeping you down. This group is prioritised over you. This guy with nothing is pitted against this guy with nothing while the guys with it all fan the flames so that no one looks at what they've got. Yep, it’s in the vested interests of the people at the top of the pile in the U.K. for the average workers in the country to be at each other’s throats over all sorts of social justice issues: race, gender, sexual orientation, trans rights etc etc. It’s going bloody well so far. Sadly the one thing we don’t get angry about is economic inequality and the ironic thing is that I think we might find that if we did we would be united as a nation more than we have ever been in a long time.
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eppinggas
Administrator
Ian Alexander
Don't care
Joined: June 2014
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Post by eppinggas on Dec 7, 2020 13:37:35 GMT
See this is part of the problem. And we all do it. We attach the actions of a minority to the will of the majority. Personally, I think there are darker forces at work to make us attack each other and stay in our lanes. Lots of money is spent on telling us immigrants are dangerous. Lots of money is spent on telling us all who voted for BREXIT are racist. Lots of money is spent on putting you and I at odds. My point is, I think the majority want the same thing, equality for all. Yet we're told via interest vested media that these guys are against equality for this group. This group is keeping you down. This group is prioritised over you. This guy with nothing is pitted against this guy with nothing while the guys with it all fan the flames so that no one looks at what they've got. Yep, it’s in the vested interests of the people at the top of the pile in the U.K. for the average workers in the country to be at each other’s throats over all sorts of social justice issues: race, gender, sexual orientation, trans rights etc etc. It’s going bloody well so far. Sadly the one thing we don’t get angry about is economic inequality and the ironic thing is that I think we might find that if we did we would be united as a nation more than we have ever been in a long time. I understand the frustration. Successive Governments (left and right) have failed to address economic inequality. However people seem to think it's issue specific to the UK. It's not (or show me some data that reflects that). Have a look at this: www.indexmundi.com/facts/indicators/SI.POV.GINI/map/europe. The first result out of a google search. In general we do better than southern Europe (Greece, Italy, Spain) about the same as 'central' Europe (France, Ireland Switzerland) and not as good as Scandinavia, Germany. It's not a UK problem. Unless the conspiracy theorists will have you believe it's a global conspiracy. Then we're into "the establishment and world leaders are all really lizards" territory.
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topman
Joined: June 2014
Posts: 187
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Post by topman on Dec 7, 2020 13:46:29 GMT
Being late sixties if I had my time over again I think I would have opted to work and live in a different country
I don't like how the country is these days:
No political concensus / long term planning over crucial matters like education / NHS / infrastructure etc
Too many people ignoring societal responsibilities
People cannot discuss matters sensibly and with respect without shouting either verbally or as a keyboard 'warrior'
Constantly criticising past historical events and decisions
Lack of respect for police / authorities
Jumped up celebrities who have little or no talent fawned over by media
Constantly treading on eggshells in case someone is 'offended' by the slightest issue
I will stop now before I depress myself too much!
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Deleted
Joined: January 1970
Posts: 0
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Post by Deleted on Dec 7, 2020 14:24:42 GMT
Yep, it’s in the vested interests of the people at the top of the pile in the U.K. for the average workers in the country to be at each other’s throats over all sorts of social justice issues: race, gender, sexual orientation, trans rights etc etc. It’s going bloody well so far. Sadly the one thing we don’t get angry about is economic inequality and the ironic thing is that I think we might find that if we did we would be united as a nation more than we have ever been in a long time. I understand the frustration. Successive Governments (left and right) have failed to address economic inequality. However people seem to think it's issue specific to the UK. It's not (or show me some data that reflects that). Have a look at this: www.indexmundi.com/facts/indicators/SI.POV.GINI/map/europe. The first result out of a google search. In general we do better than southern Europe (Greece, Italy, Spain) about the same as 'central' Europe (France, Ireland Switzerland) and not as good as Scandinavia, Germany. It's not a UK problem. Unless the conspiracy theorists will have you believe it's a global conspiracy. Then we're into "the establishment and world leaders are all really lizards" territory. You’re right, I won’t argue. Essentially better than some but not than others. But that’s still like saying “well it’s not that bad” instead of “it should be better”. Everyone in this thread no doubt aspires for the U.K. to be the best in the world in terms of social inclusion but I don’t get the sense at all that we aspire to rival the likes of Finland and Denmark in terms of happiness and financial equality because we’ve been fed a message of anti-Marxism and capitalism as extreme competition for resources between ourselves to the point that we *want* other people to have less so it bolster’s our own position. Finland shows that when financial inequality is less, happiness of the nation goes up. There is also other data found in the book “the spirit level” that illustrates that self reporting of happiness shows diminishing returns as people earn over ~£30,000 - ergo the endless pursuit of money by the rich is not making their lives any better in a spiritual sense.
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Post by lostinspace on Dec 7, 2020 14:41:09 GMT
Recurring incedent at Colchester v Grimsby, can't all be Milwall or WHU fans with a lack of inetlligence and ignorance then, Chairman has offered a ST refund to those who don't wish to support the bended knee at his club
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basel
Joined: May 2014
Posts: 3,064
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Post by basel on Dec 7, 2020 15:01:37 GMT
It's being reported West Ham fans did'nt boo.The Daily Express printed the report,but have since back tracked.
Is what I've heard.
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Deleted
Joined: January 1970
Posts: 0
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Post by Deleted on Dec 7, 2020 15:17:06 GMT
Recurring incedent at Colchester v Grimsby, can't all be Milwall or WHU fans with a lack of inetlligence and ignorance then, Chairman has offered a ST refund to those who don't wish to support the bended knee at his club www.cu-fc.com/news/2020/december/club-statement/
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eppinggas
Administrator
Ian Alexander
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Post by eppinggas on Dec 7, 2020 16:33:05 GMT
Recurring incedent at Colchester v Grimsby, can't all be Milwall or WHU fans with a lack of inetlligence and ignorance then, Chairman has offered a ST refund to those who don't wish to support the bended knee at his club www.cu-fc.com/news/2020/december/club-statement/Sadly every Club (even ours) will have an element who are bone-headed racists. Millwall and West Ham probably have a larger percentage than most. But it exists everywhere. It's how you deal with it. And "taking the knee" is not working.
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Post by lostinspace on Dec 7, 2020 16:50:43 GMT
Sadly every Club (even ours) will have an element who are bone-headed racists. Millwall and West Ham probably have a larger percentage than most. But it exists everywhere. It's how you deal with it. And "taking the knee" is not working. My view is that when it was done initially it made a lot of people take note of what it was about, since then happening only in front of the cameras, and no reaction enabled from fans due to non attendance , since then it has been a "matter of fact" gesture and some have got fed up of it, ....and now with some in attendance the few are making their feelings heard ,just a few in each instance reported but enough to stir the emotion and for others to show their anger/disgust at this ,
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Post by emperorsuperbus on Dec 7, 2020 16:56:05 GMT
The right thing is whatever our colour, judge each other on character not skin colour. Start from the base we are all brother and sisters. But if your socialised into believing certain people are wrong uns, you will remain with that bias, even unconsciously. Because the first thing you see is skin colour, police uniform, red and white bobble hat, or hear the Protestant or Catholic name, what chance do you get to go beyond that to character, and a different opinion?
There is no way prejudice can be beaten. No way to stamp out racism entirely, though improved overall in a place that is by no means certain to stay improving, because it’s based on being socialised into believing certain people are wrong uns.
The actual point of the thread is does the continued kneeling actually help.
I’m not sure it does. Copying what kapernik done for different reasons he done it. Meaning something to him than to us. Tackle racism instead instead at the socialisation level. Show your disgust at racial prejudice by funding education into unconscious bias. Retire taking the knee as a sporting ritual.
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Post by badbloodash on Dec 7, 2020 21:00:04 GMT
Recurring incedent at Colchester v Grimsby, can't all be Milwall or WHU fans with a lack of inetlligence and ignorance then, Chairman has offered a ST refund to those who don't wish to support the bended knee at his club I lived / worked in Bermondsey early 80s it was literally a no go area for whites after dark ( except drunken paddies ) who did what ever they wanted I find it quite ironic that the areas where this happens are densely populated by bame its way for middle classes to tut and say how awful but they don’t live amongst it inner city life is hard and people react to being overlooked
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Rex
Predictions League
Joined: June 2014
Posts: 3,287
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Post by Rex on Dec 7, 2020 23:06:47 GMT
See this is part of the problem. And we all do it. We attach the actions of a minority to the will of the majority. Personally, I think there are darker forces at work to make us attack each other and stay in our lanes. Lots of money is spent on telling us immigrants are dangerous. Lots of money is spent on telling us all who voted for BREXIT are racist. Lots of money is spent on putting you and I at odds.My point is, I think the majority want the same thing, equality for all. Yet we're told via interest vested media that these guys are against equality for this group. This group is keeping you down. This group is prioritised over you. This guy with nothing is pitted against this guy with nothing while the guys with it all fan the flames so that no one looks at what they've got. Nope - I just don't subscribe to this particular conspiracy theory. For those who truly believe "dark and mysterious forces" are at work to keep down the proletarian rabble... James O'Brien is available 10am-1pm weekdays on LBC. Well, while I'm not entirely convinced that the Eton educated elite deliberately keep us down as some sort of sinister plot against the working class, I am pretty sure that if someone came up with a fantastically fair and democratic plan to share the wealth between everyone in the UK, then those who do run the country - and lets not forget that of the 55 British PMs we have had, 20 were educated at Eton and 7 at Harrow- then I suspect that all of a sudden there may be a bit of twitchiness in the corridors of power.
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