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Post by Deleted on Oct 11, 2019 10:59:36 GMT
Its called a home equity credit line Vertigo and this is how you do it. Find a vulnerable person with a home worth say 200 000 who is at their wits end struggling to pay their way and use your charm to get them to sell it to you for say 70 000. Borrow the 70 000 secured against the property and take out a home equity credit line for say 100 000. Now if you are not keen on wine, women and song you could always have a wonderful time spending the money on, say, international travel, giving sinecures to your friends and making sure you always had the latest mega mega mega pixel phone so your selfies were sure to be top notch, plus of course paying the interest on the loan. Now all good things come to an end and at some point the money will run out. But just before it does you sell the house, pay off the credit lines and go looking for another vulnerable person to repeat the exercise. The most incredible thing about all this is that you can live perpetually in dreamland but it won’t ever cost you a penny. Absolutely spot on Swissgas. This reminds me of a book called Rich Dad Poor Dad which gave a view about why some people get on financially whilst others struggle. It was full of this sort of thing. It wasn't a very good book.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 11, 2019 12:44:17 GMT
So confusing this stuff. I mean can i charge myself 6% interest on my flat to cover for myself spending all my money on wine and women until the value of my flat is used up and then claim my interest back on myself. I just want to get on and do that if its as easy as you and others say it is. Its called a home equity credit line Vertigo and this is how you do it. Find a vulnerable person with a home worth say 200 000 who is at their wits end struggling to pay their way and use your charm to get them to sell it to you for say 70 000. Borrow the 70 000 secured against the property and take out a home equity credit line for say 100 000. Now if you are not keen on wine, women and song you could always have a wonderful time spending the money on, say, international travel, giving sinecures to your friends and making sure you always had the latest mega mega mega pixel phone so your selfies were sure to be top notch, plus of course paying the interest on the loan. Now all good things come to an end and at some point the money will run out. But just before it does you sell the house, pay off the credit lines and go looking for another vulnerable person to repeat the exercise. The most incredible thing about all this is that you can live perpetually in dreamland but it won’t ever cost you a penny. Thanks for the plausible explanation. There are issues that are still cloudy i would say. Are you certain higgs sold the club massively undervalued? Did wael and co pay off the high interest loan the club had with the previous owners? With the equity on the mem all used If the owners are here 6 months from now does that mean you and others have got it all horribly wrong? Also what is wael selling? surely the club has no value?
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Post by Deleted on Oct 11, 2019 12:48:40 GMT
So confusing this stuff.I mean can i charge myself 6% interest on my flat to cover for myself spending all my money on wine and women until the value of my flat is used up and then claim my interest back on myself. I just want to get on and do that if its as easy as you and others say it is. It's really not. So why didn't the bury owner use this simple financial trick? Also if the owners are still here 6 months from now make sure you come back and eat humble pie.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 11, 2019 16:50:28 GMT
I believe he is on about Antonio Fargas , you're on about gashead1981. I didn’t want to use forum names. I just left it for others to make their own judgment. As I say, I’ve learned a bit from being here. I do follow the other place but mainly on match days. That's fair enough KP sorry, it's just you were talking about two different people i believe.
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Post by eppinggas on Oct 12, 2019 9:02:53 GMT
It's really not. So why didn't the bury owner use this simple financial trick? Also if the owners are still here 6 months from now make sure you come back and eat humble pie. Because as far as I'm aware there is no equity in Bury FC. If Dwane Sports are still here in 6 months time BRFC will be an additional (at current run rate) £1.5mil in debt. The only reason that they will still be here, is that they cannot find a buyer. The prospect of this is very worrying. I don't quite see how this qualifies me to "eat humble pie". UTG.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 12, 2019 9:55:34 GMT
So why didn't the bury owner use this simple financial trick? Also if the owners are still here 6 months from now make sure you come back and eat humble pie. Because as far as I'm aware there is no equity in Bury FC. If Dwane Sports are still here in 6 months time BRFC will be an additional (at current run rate) £1.5mil in debt. The only reason that they will still be here, is that they cannot find a buyer. The prospect of this is very worrying. I don't quite see how this qualifies me to "eat humble pie". UTG. You and others have been saying that once the equity on the mem is used up the owners will not put money in to keep the club running. Swissgas has reliably informed us the equity is used up so so we will now discover if swiss,you and others were correct. Its all over according to swiss,you and others right?
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Post by swissgas on Oct 12, 2019 14:06:22 GMT
Because as far as I'm aware there is no equity in Bury FC. If Dwane Sports are still here in 6 months time BRFC will be an additional (at current run rate) £1.5mil in debt. The only reason that they will still be here, is that they cannot find a buyer. The prospect of this is very worrying. I don't quite see how this qualifies me to "eat humble pie". UTG. You and others have been saying that once the equity on the mem is used up the owners will not put money in to keep the club running. Swissgas has reliably informed us the equity is used up so so we will now discover if swiss,you and others were correct. Its all over according to swiss,you and others right? It will be all over if Hani turns the cash tap off and it would be foolish to pretend this won’t happen, especially if the reasons cited are “they are honorable people” or “Wael is a true Gashead” . The family didn’t get where they are by being sentimental and I suspect the Council and Fruit Market developers will now be fully aware of that.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 12, 2019 16:28:00 GMT
Because as far as I'm aware there is no equity in Bury FC. If Dwane Sports are still here in 6 months time BRFC will be an additional (at current run rate) £1.5mil in debt. The only reason that they will still be here, is that they cannot find a buyer. The prospect of this is very worrying. I don't quite see how this qualifies me to "eat humble pie". UTG. You and others have been saying that once the equity on the mem is used up the owners will not put money in to keep the club running.Swissgas has reliably informed us the equity is used up so so we will now discover if swiss,you and others were correct. Its all over according to swiss,you and others right? To be fair, I don't remember, apart from Swiss speculating a couple of days back that this may happen, anybody saying that they knew what exactly was going to happen when debt exceeds the value of the asset. It's been discussed, but I think that we all agree, we don't know.
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Post by eppinggas on Oct 13, 2019 15:21:00 GMT
Because as far as I'm aware there is no equity in Bury FC. If Dwane Sports are still here in 6 months time BRFC will be an additional (at current run rate) £1.5mil in debt. The only reason that they will still be here, is that they cannot find a buyer. The prospect of this is very worrying. I don't quite see how this qualifies me to "eat humble pie". UTG. You and others have been saying that once the equity on the mem is used up the owners will not put money in to keep the club running. Swissgas has reliably informed us the equity is used up so so we will now discover if swiss,you and others were correct. Its all over according to swiss,you and others right? As per swiss and bambi. We do not know exactly when the debts will exceed the value of the credit facility (the credit facility being essentially the equity within the Memorial Stadium). Swiss has taken apart the last few years of accounts and I think has concluded that this time is nearly upon us. And then we will get to see if the four members of the Al-Qadi family will take it in turn to write out cheques to the sum of £65k a week. Or whether they don't. At this point I would like to remind you that they are bankers. They are not a charity.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 13, 2019 15:35:14 GMT
You and others have been saying that once the equity on the mem is used up the owners will not put money in to keep the club running. Swissgas has reliably informed us the equity is used up so so we will now discover if swiss,you and others were correct. Its all over according to swiss,you and others right? As per swiss and bambi. We do not know exactly when the debts will exceed the value of the credit facility (the credit facility being essentially the equity within the Memorial Stadium). Swiss has taken apart the last few years of accounts and I think has concluded that this time is nearly upon us. And then we will get to see if the four members of the Al-Qadi family will take it in turn to write out cheques to the sum of £65k a week. Or whether they don't. At this point I would like to remind you that they are bankers. They are not a charity. Well condensed and explained. I would add to that, I would be worried about the judgement of anybody who would take on a yo-yo 3rd / 4th tier club and have to build a stadium, and then have the starting point being somewhere ITRO -£60m. Why would you do this? Just buy a Championship club, or wait for the next Bolton and save yourself the ball ache of building a stadium. I smell self-interest with little regard for the future of BRFC being played out in front of us.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 13, 2019 22:26:16 GMT
You and others have been saying that once the equity on the mem is used up the owners will not put money in to keep the club running. Swissgas has reliably informed us the equity is used up so so we will now discover if swiss,you and others were correct. Its all over according to swiss,you and others right? As per swiss and bambi. We do not know exactly when the debts will exceed the value of the credit facility (the credit facility being essentially the equity within the Memorial Stadium). Swiss has taken apart the last few years of accounts and I think has concluded that this time is nearly upon us. And then we will get to see if the four members of the Al-Qadi family will take it in turn to write out cheques to the sum of £65k a week. Or whether they don't. At this point I would like to remind you that they are bankers. They are not a charity. The owners situation is the same as most clubs in the country in that the club relies on them to prop up a loss making football club. I have no idea if they will continue to fund the club but neither do you or swiss.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 13, 2019 22:41:49 GMT
As per swiss and bambi. We do not know exactly when the debts will exceed the value of the credit facility (the credit facility being essentially the equity within the Memorial Stadium). Swiss has taken apart the last few years of accounts and I think has concluded that this time is nearly upon us. And then we will get to see if the four members of the Al-Qadi family will take it in turn to write out cheques to the sum of £65k a week. Or whether they don't. At this point I would like to remind you that they are bankers. They are not a charity. The owners situation is the same as most clubs in the country in that the club relies on them to prop up a loss making football club. I have no idea if they will continue to fund the club but neither do you or swiss. I think that one of the bits of evidence Swiss used was the accounts from the owners' primary business.
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Post by swissgas on Oct 14, 2019 1:09:34 GMT
The owners situation is the same as most clubs in the country in that the club relies on them to prop up a loss making football club. I have no idea if they will continue to fund the club but neither do you or swiss. I think that one of the bits of evidence Swiss used was the accounts from the owners' primary business. Yes, since the takeover in February 2016 I have been following the fortunes of AJIB and it’s performance has been poor to say the least. Annual profits then were about 20 million and have fallen every quarter since and this year may only reach 12 million. The Al Qadi family dividend income has fallen proportionately. In 2018 the bank took a loan from the central bank to maintain liquidity and it was reported that its BBB credit rating (with negative outlook) was only maintained because it was felt the central bank would continue to support AJIB. I am not deriding AJIB or saying that Hani Al Qadi will not turn things around. But this decline is bound to affect the family’s relationship with Rovers. One view would be that Hani owes it to the bank’s other shareholders to get out of Rovers as quickly as possible so he can concentrate on AJIB. Another view would be that, because of their loss of income and net worth due to the bank’s decline, the family need to get as much out of Rovers as they can and will hold out to gain the maximum from the value of the land at the Mem.
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Post by CabbagePatchBlues on Oct 14, 2019 4:44:46 GMT
You and others have been saying that once the equity on the mem is used up the owners will not put money in to keep the club running. Swissgas has reliably informed us the equity is used up so so we will now discover if swiss,you and others were correct. Its all over according to swiss,you and others right? As per swiss and bambi. We do not know exactly when the debts will exceed the value of the credit facility (the credit facility being essentially the equity within the Memorial Stadium). Swiss has taken apart the last few years of accounts and I think has concluded that this time is nearly upon us. And then we will get to see if the four members of the Al-Qadi family will take it in turn to write out cheques to the sum of £65k a week. Or whether they don't. At this point I would like to remind you that they are bankers. They are not a charity. Who the hell uses cheques these days?
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Post by mangogas15 on Oct 14, 2019 6:17:07 GMT
As per swiss and bambi. We do not know exactly when the debts will exceed the value of the credit facility (the credit facility being essentially the equity within the Memorial Stadium). Swiss has taken apart the last few years of accounts and I think has concluded that this time is nearly upon us. And then we will get to see if the four members of the Al-Qadi family will take it in turn to write out cheques to the sum of £65k a week. Or whether they don't. At this point I would like to remind you that they are bankers. They are not a charity. Who the hell uses cheques these days? I think we discussed cheques earlier on.. Half of people over 55
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Post by eppinggas on Oct 14, 2019 6:49:33 GMT
As per swiss and bambi. We do not know exactly when the debts will exceed the value of the credit facility (the credit facility being essentially the equity within the Memorial Stadium). Swiss has taken apart the last few years of accounts and I think has concluded that this time is nearly upon us. And then we will get to see if the four members of the Al-Qadi family will take it in turn to write out cheques to the sum of £65k a week. Or whether they don't. At this point I would like to remind you that they are bankers. They are not a charity. The owners situation is the same as most clubs in the country in that the club relies on them to prop up a loss making football club. I have no idea if they will continue to fund the club but neither do you or swiss. "continue"? No. I believe the word you are looking for is "begin". So far all Dwane Sports have done is spent the equity that existed within the Memorial Stadium. Previous owners did indeed put their hands in their pockets to cover annual losses (though of course these annual losses were tiny in relation to what Dwane Sports have managed to rack up). Under Nick Higgs the others directors patience (and cash) ran out when he started to pursue Sainsbury's through the courts... hence the wonga loan. I think we are owned by bankers, who value profit (or at least avoiding losses) above anything else. Some people cling to the belief that Wael is a benevolent Gashead and that he is in it "for the long run". It's a free country. Think what you like.
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Post by Peter Parker on Oct 14, 2019 7:04:31 GMT
The owners situation is the same as most clubs in the country in that the club relies on them to prop up a loss making football club. I have no idea if they will continue to fund the club but neither do you or swiss. "continue"? No. I believe the word you are looking for is "begin". So far all Dwane Sports have done is spent the equity that existed within the Memorial Stadium. Previous owners did indeed put their hands in their pockets to cover annual losses (though of course these annual losses were tiny in relation to what Dwane Sports have managed to rack up). Under Nick Higgs the others directors patience (and cash) ran out when he started to pursue Sainsbury's through the courts... hence the wonga loan. I think we are owned by bankers, who value profit (or at least avoiding losses) above anything else. Some people cling to the belief that Wael is a benevolent Gashead and that he is in it "for the long run". It's a free country. Think what you like. Well we are playing semantics. Until Dwane Sports actually recoup any money from The Mem, the cash is coming from somewhere in the meantime
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Post by Henbury Gas on Oct 14, 2019 7:17:02 GMT
So confusing this stuff. I mean can i charge myself 6% interest on my flat to cover for myself spending all my money on wine and women until the value of my flat is used up and then claim my interest back on myself. I just want to get on and do that if its as easy as you and others say it is. Its called a home equity credit line Vertigo and this is how you do it. Find a vulnerable person with a home worth say 200 000 who is at their wits end struggling to pay their way and use your charm to get them to sell it to you for say 70 000. Borrow the 70 000 secured against the property and take out a home equity credit line for say 100 000. Now if you are not keen on wine, women and song you could always have a wonderful time spending the money on, say, international travel, giving sinecures to your friends and making sure you always had the latest mega mega mega pixel phone so your selfies were sure to be top notch, plus of course paying the interest on the loan. Now all good things come to an end and at some point the money will run out. But just before it does you sell the house, pay off the credit lines and go looking for another vulnerable person to repeat the exercise. The most incredible thing about all this is that you can live perpetually in dreamland but it won’t ever cost you a penny. Even i can understand that principe Now can i ask your opinion on equity release mortgages please
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Post by Henbury Gas on Oct 14, 2019 7:21:12 GMT
As per swiss and bambi. We do not know exactly when the debts will exceed the value of the credit facility (the credit facility being essentially the equity within the Memorial Stadium). Swiss has taken apart the last few years of accounts and I think has concluded that this time is nearly upon us. And then we will get to see if the four members of the Al-Qadi family will take it in turn to write out cheques to the sum of £65k a week. Or whether they don't. At this point I would like to remind you that they are bankers. They are not a charity. Well condensed and explained. I would add to that, I would be worried about the judgement of anybody who would take on a yo-yo 3rd / 4th tier club and have to build a stadium, and then have the starting point being somewhere ITRO -£60m. Why would you do this? Just buy a Championship club, or wait for the next Bolton and save yourself the ball ache of building a stadium. I smell self-interest with little regard for the future of BRFC being played out in front of us. Which of these two scenarios is the worst possible outcome in your opinion ?
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Post by Deleted on Oct 14, 2019 9:31:22 GMT
As per swiss and bambi. We do not know exactly when the debts will exceed the value of the credit facility (the credit facility being essentially the equity within the Memorial Stadium). Swiss has taken apart the last few years of accounts and I think has concluded that this time is nearly upon us. And then we will get to see if the four members of the Al-Qadi family will take it in turn to write out cheques to the sum of £65k a week. Or whether they don't. At this point I would like to remind you that they are bankers. They are not a charity. Who the hell uses cheques these days? DVLA do. In fact, for a range of their services there's no other payment option.
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