Deleted
Joined: January 1970
Posts: 0
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Post by Deleted on Jun 13, 2019 12:40:43 GMT
Then again they do have a right to be concerned about the increasing debt, just a pity they didn't put their concerns across in a structured manner. Why didn't one shareholder take the lead and organise the questions beforehand instead of the meeting seemingly turning into a free for all. You mean like they did under Higgs? Silly me, the self same people backed Higgs and before that Geoff Dunford to the hilt, effectively silencing any of us who were even slightly critical. The stench of hypocrisy is strong, especially within the SC committee, many of whom have been there since Eastville let alone Twerton. Wait for it, any minute now someone like Mike will wade in and tell you that if this is how you feel you need to join the SC and modernise it from within, and if you aren't prepared to do that then you should just sit in a corner and keep quiet.
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harrybuckle
Always look on the bright side
Joined: May 2014
Posts: 5,394
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Post by harrybuckle on Jun 13, 2019 15:52:45 GMT
Think I may join, just so that I can go and watch this in action. We know it's at 7-30, all we don't know is the date! I am sure it is on the same night as the Prescot Cables FC Supporters AGM so you will be busy up North so you cant be at the Mem the same night thank goodness.
Must admit since the Supporters Club has lost their influence/support of BRFC I cannot see much progress being made to heal the wounds. Just continue buying the 50/50 tickets.
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Igitur
Joined: June 2014
Posts: 2,293
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Post by Igitur on Jun 13, 2019 16:38:24 GMT
You mean like they did under Higgs? Silly me, the self same people backed Higgs and before that Geoff Dunford to the hilt, effectively silencing any of us who were even slightly critical. The stench of hypocrisy is strong, especially within the SC committee, many of whom have been there since Eastville let alone Twerton. Yes - the SC seems to be trying to reinvent/reposition itself as a critical friend of the club (perhaps less the friend currently) and a champion of supporters concerns, which is exactly what it should always have been doing. The problem is that there is a lack of credibility in the eyes of many when it has spent most of the last 20 years singularly refusing to play that role and instead acting as a cheerleader for previous regimes despite their unpopularity among many fans. Too often it felt like the SC were representing the board/club/owners to the fans not the other way round. So it's hard to take their new sense of critical engagement seriously - especially as they don't seem to be terribly good at it and many of its key movers seem to maintain the attitude of an 8 year old child in a playground when challenged - 'if you don't like it then bring your own ball in, I'm going home'. The Supporters Club’s constitution will have to be changed as currently it is mostly about supporting BRFC and the club’s aims.
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Deleted
Joined: January 1970
Posts: 0
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Post by Deleted on Jun 13, 2019 17:00:47 GMT
Think I may join, just so that I can go and watch this in action. We know it's at 7-30, all we don't know is the date! I am sure it is on the same night as the Prescot Cables FC Supporters AGM so you will be busy up North so you cant be at the Mem the same night thank goodness.
Must admit since the Supporters Club has lost their influence/support of BRFC I cannot see much progress being made to heal the wounds. Just continue buying the 50/50 tickets.
Doubt it, the Prescot Cables AGM is around Feb time. Not a chance of me buying 50/50 tickets at the moment. These owners have found a way to lose money on a scale never seen before in the club's history, I'm happy to pay for match tickets but beyond that I'm not subsidising their reckless running of the club.
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Post by johnmalyckyj on Jun 13, 2019 21:27:36 GMT
Well I was there last night. Like Manc for the sake of my own mental health I now try to avoid the message boards as much as I can. I went into the meeting "cold" because I didn't know what the latest rumour or popular opinion was. Very quickly it became apparent that there were a few people with a clear agenda against the current Board. It is also clear now that the Supporters Club and Presidents Club have issues with the Board. The reality is that the owners may do what they want, the days of lobbying individual members of the Board with a particular point of view to further a cause are long gone. The simple fact is that both of these supporters groups need to find a new role to make themselves relevant not just to the Board but to the fan base. It wasn't the best presented AGM I have attended and if I am honest a bit toe curling at times, this feeling came both from the floor and the top table who did not cover themselves in glory. However when a Board of Directors is faced with a few individuals who seem hell bent on causing the maximum amount of embarrassment then you have recipe for disaster. When an individual suggests to the President of a company that he knows what his brother thinks about the internal affairs of that organisation then inevitably things will be difficult. I say that as a vociferous critic of the previous regime, but my opinions and questions to them were evidence based. None of the criticisms or questions I heard last night were evidenced based. In the end I felt that the Board dealt with most of the questions fairly and honestly but there were a couple of gaps that I felt were left hanging. The Supporters Club had a legitimate question about the issue of their share certificates in respect of the Share Scheme but they should have raised it within the official business and they should have insisted it be recorded within that time, I didn't find the response entirely convincing. I was concerned about the lack of participation by the Supporters Club Board representative during the meeting and would suggest that there maybe a link between that and the issue of the certificates, why has he not been able to resolve that issue? We had a passage during the meeting when a couple of individuals complained about spending, but when challenged about what their specific worries were they were not able to explain them. Did they really want a return to the rank incompetence of the previous regime.....errr no coherent response. There was also criticism that Board members were not actually Rovers supporters, well welcome to the new reality of professional football...... I found myself thinking that if I was in the position of Wael given the level of hostility from a few individuals I would be asking myself what I was doing wasting my time and money in this enterprise. Well he gave the answer towards the end of the meeting rounding on his critics. I still feel that the club is now in better hands then it was under the previous regime, but I felt less easy than I did 12 months ago last night but that was partly due to what I consider to be a poorly chaired meeting. The simple fact is that there are no local business people who are willing to fund Football League clubs incurring the level of annual losses that a club such as ours as was the case in the "old days". if you can find them, then good luck. Kind regards John Malyckyj Excellent write up and I don't disagree with what you have to say. Apart from the bit in bold. I do not believe that the Club should be racking up losses. At all. We have had average gates of around 8,662 over the last 4 years. I accept that there were outgoings associated with the failed UWE deal - but the annual losses are horrific. I am 100% behind a sustainable approach which sees us operate on an even keel. If that means tier 4 football in the short term - so be it. The old paradigm of Directors chucking a hundred grand a year in to balance the books has gone. Football hyper-inflation (largely bloated salaries for average players and parasitic agents) is with us and the current 'model' (for our Club and others) is totally unsustainable. I think we will see a raft of Clubs going to the wall as financial reality kicks in. I don't want us to be one of those Clubs. Our current owners do not appear to have a grasp of how to run professional organisation. I give you the London Office my learned friend. They have no credible strategy.ot And I'll leave it at that. Wael said that for every £1 of income received, 97p was spent on the playing staff........ I agree with your view that football clubs should be run at a break-even level, that was part of the reason for the disastrous split of 2006. However the demands of supporters dictate otherwise, they want success on the pitch. The future of Bristol Rovers Football Club was gambled away by the previous regime, who allowed the club to plunge out of the Football League to deliver a stadium project that would have been a fig-leaf in the sense that I suspect we would have finished up in a Coventry City type situation eventually. Two successive promotions and stability in Division One is not enough for some as we saw the other evening.... I'm out of here again, if I didn't have so much going on in other parts of my life I'd be tempted to kick a few arses once more. The fan base is not being represented properly at board level and I say that with a heavy heart. The Supporters Club needs to re-invent itself and fast or withdraw from the board room because I really don't see the point, it's all very well to be complaining about share certificates but if the owners don't see the relevance then the Share Scheme should be folded. Someone needs the balls to say it. Regards John Malyckyj
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Post by Topper Gas on Jun 13, 2019 21:36:53 GMT
Excellent write up and I don't disagree with what you have to say. Apart from the bit in bold. I do not believe that the Club should be racking up losses. At all. We have had average gates of around 8,662 over the last 4 years. I accept that there were outgoings associated with the failed UWE deal - but the annual losses are horrific. I am 100% behind a sustainable approach which sees us operate on an even keel. If that means tier 4 football in the short term - so be it. The old paradigm of Directors chucking a hundred grand a year in to balance the books has gone. Football hyper-inflation (largely bloated salaries for average players and parasitic agents) is with us and the current 'model' (for our Club and others) is totally unsustainable. I think we will see a raft of Clubs going to the wall as financial reality kicks in. I don't want us to be one of those Clubs. Our current owners do not appear to have a grasp of how to run professional organisation. I give you the London Office my learned friend. They have no credible strategy.ot And I'll leave it at that. Wael said that for every £1 of income received, 97p was spent on the playing staff........ I agree with your view that football clubs should be run at a break-even level, that was part of the reason for the disastrous split of 2006. However the demands of supporters dictate otherwise, they want success on the pitch. The future of Bristol Rovers Football Club was gambled away by the previous regime, who allowed the club to plunge out of the Football League to deliver a stadium project that would have been a fig-leaf in the sense that I suspect we would have finished up in a Coventry City type situation eventually. Two successive promotions and stability in Division One is not enough for some as we saw the other evening.... I'm out of here again, if I didn't have so much going on in other parts of my life I'd be tempted to kick a few arses once more. The fan base is not being represented properly at board level and I say that with a heavy heart. The Supporters Club needs to re-invent itself and fast or withdraw from the board room because I really don't see the point, it's all very well to be complaining about share certificates but if the owners don't see the relevance then the Share Scheme should be folded. Someone needs the balls to say it. Regards John Malyckyj Can anybody understand how we can spend 97% of our income on players wages when SCMP rules restrict it to 55% of our turnover? What's the difference between income and turnover? The latest on Gaschat from Knowall suggests the takeover rhetoric isn't going to go away anytime soon: "Yes there is something happening but Wael is not the architect. He may claim it for himself, but make no mistake the one to applaud is not him. I wish him no ill because he stepped in when someone had to, and in my view we must thank him, but he has not been able to progress the Club further. In due course the truth will out, and I hope people will get behind those who are driving this. If they do, then the future is good"
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Deleted
Joined: January 1970
Posts: 0
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Post by Deleted on Jun 13, 2019 23:36:17 GMT
If Wael said that then I'm pretty sure he was mistaken.
That figure of £97 per £100 was used for all staff wages, not just players I thought?
But even then, it sounds high. 3% for literally everything else? Really?
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Post by toteend3 on Jun 14, 2019 6:41:12 GMT
Now that we've had a bit of fun pretending to be upset that the date etc of the AGM wasn't made public, can I just remind everybody that back on May 16th, in the 'New owners being announced last October' thread, AMPG stated the date that the AGM was being held. Nobody cared then, but for some reason we've all decided to get twitchy about it now. Almost as if there's not much going on in the football world to keep us entertained. Apart of course from girlies playing in shorts when they should be wearing skirts. Girlies wearing skirts, goodness gracious, how's about that then guys and girls - as it appens bloody spiffing idea old boy!
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eppinggas
Administrator
Ian Alexander
Don't care
Joined: June 2014
Posts: 8,053
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Post by eppinggas on Jun 14, 2019 8:19:27 GMT
Excellent write up and I don't disagree with what you have to say. Apart from the bit in bold. I do not believe that the Club should be racking up losses. At all. We have had average gates of around 8,662 over the last 4 years. I accept that there were outgoings associated with the failed UWE deal - but the annual losses are horrific. I am 100% behind a sustainable approach which sees us operate on an even keel. If that means tier 4 football in the short term - so be it. The old paradigm of Directors chucking a hundred grand a year in to balance the books has gone. Football hyper-inflation (largely bloated salaries for average players and parasitic agents) is with us and the current 'model' (for our Club and others) is totally unsustainable. I think we will see a raft of Clubs going to the wall as financial reality kicks in. I don't want us to be one of those Clubs. Our current owners do not appear to have a grasp of how to run professional organisation. I give you the London Office my learned friend. They have no credible strategy.ot And I'll leave it at that. Wael said that for every £1 of income received, 97p was spent on the playing staff........ I agree with your view that football clubs should be run at a break-even level, that was part of the reason for the disastrous split of 2006. However the demands of supporters dictate otherwise, they want success on the pitch. The future of Bristol Rovers Football Club was gambled away by the previous regime, who allowed the club to plunge out of the Football League to deliver a stadium project that would have been a fig-leaf in the sense that I suspect we would have finished up in a Coventry City type situation eventually. Two successive promotions and stability in Division One is not enough for some as we saw the other evening.... I'm out of here again, if I didn't have so much going on in other parts of my life I'd be tempted to kick a few arses once more. The fan base is not being represented properly at board level and I say that with a heavy heart. The Supporters Club needs to re-invent itself and fast or withdraw from the board room because I really don't see the point, it's all very well to be complaining about share certificates but if the owners don't see the relevance then the Share Scheme should be folded. Someone needs the balls to say it. Regards John Malyckyj Top post. Hope you have time to contribute to the debate in the future. UTG.
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