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Post by johnjohnblue on Jan 25, 2019 16:35:39 GMT
There is a matter that appears to have gone completely under the radar with regards to the apparent failure of the UWE Stadium project. I am not aware of it being reported upon, or any explanations requested by Rovers, UWE or any part of the media, and it troubles me greatly. Perhaps someone out there can help me out.
However, before I get to it, I wish to give a short preamble to clarify the context and why I think it is so important.
I am one of those Rovers supporters who see Rovers as potentially a very big club. This is quite feasible given that Bristol is not only a prosperous city, but also the largest city in the southern half of Britain, excluding London. I believe that the fundamental reason why this has not been achieved is ultimately down to stadium issues which have dogged the club since the sale of Eastville some 70 years ago. The solution to this is not redevelopment of the Memorial Stadium simply because it is in the wrong place. You simply can not get large crowds in and out of that area. This fact has been publicly acknowledged by Nick Higgs and the Al-Qadis in the past, although I am aware that strange statements contradicting this were made following the official withdrawal from the UWE stadium project in August 2017. The solution and game changer always has been the development of the UWE stadium, and I'm sure this was the intention of the Al-Qadis when they bought into the club. The UWE stadium project made logistical sense from every perspective, and really was a game changer as it would have removed the infrastructure limits on Rovers progressing as a club. So much so, I feel that the publicly made statements as striving to establish Rovers as a championship club were actually unambitious, although there may have been sensible reasons for this. I believe that Premiership status could ultimately been achieved. Thereby opening all sorts of additional commercial possibilities, and dare I say it, actually challenging the near monopoly of west country professional sport being achieved by Bristol Sport Ltd.
So why didn't the UWE Stadium happen? We have all heard the public statements made in August 2017. I have to be honest and admit that I didn't find them very illuminating, but this could be due to my lack of comprehension of the English language. I do recall Steve Hamer making it clear that it was not down to money. So why didn't it happen? Us members of the public are left to speculate. Well, I'm not speculating or indulging in libelous tittle tattle, in accordance with the rules of this forum. So this brings me to my question of fact that I think needs a very public explanation. It is simple. Why was a Director of Bristol Sport Ltd sitting on the UWE Board of Governors and participating in the confidential meetings involving the UWE stadium project? This situation ran from the inception of the stadium project at least until late 2016. This may have continued longer but UWE Board of Governor meeting minutes were not made public from approx November 2016 onwards. This is a clear conflict of interests, yet this matter has never been brought to public notice. Surely I am not the only person aware of this, or unhappy with this state of affairs? Why have the media (or Rovers) never called out UWE or Bristol Sport for an explanation. Without this the implications are quite worrying.
For the record, the Director Of Bristol Sport in question is Chris Booy, Chairman of Bristol Rugby (or Bears).
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Post by a more piratey game on Jan 25, 2019 16:50:25 GMT
hello johnjohn,
firstly, which of the many putative takeovers are you representing?
to answer your questions to the best of my ability;
1) We have all heard the public statements made in August 2017. I have to be honest and admit that I didn't find them very illuminating, but this could be due to my lack of comprehension of the English language. I do recall Steve Hamer making it clear that it was not down to money.
I think that's due to Steve Hamer's ability with the English language - to use lots of words and say nothing useful I'm afraid. Steve Crazy Gang Hamer assured us that the landing lights were on. I think he was referring to the alternative site at Filton, because at UWE it seems they weren't
2) Why was a Director of Bristol Sport Ltd sitting on the UWE Board of Governors and participating in the confidential meetings involving the UWE stadium project? This situation ran from the inception of the stadium project at least until late 2016. This may have continued longer but UWE Board of Governor meeting minutes were not made public from approx November 2016 onwards. This is a clear conflict of interests, yet this matter has never been brought to public notice. Surely I am not the only person aware of this, or unhappy with this state of affairs? Why have the media (or Rovers) never called out UWE or Bristol Sport for an explanation. Without this the implications are quite worrying. For the record, the Director Of Bristol Sport in question is Chris Booy, Chairman of Bristol Rugby (or Bears).
I think, based on my dodgy memory, that CB is a Merchant Venturer, and they are involved in everything in Bristol. If it wasn't him, it could have been another of them. But conflict of interest is nothing new. The fact that it hasn't previously been flagged is interesting though. Good spot. I wonder what people who really understand matters will make of this
it could be construed that buying the snake was only the smaller of steps taken to corner the local market for Bristol Sport (1982) Ltd
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Deleted
Joined: January 1970
Posts: 0
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Post by Deleted on Jan 25, 2019 16:52:35 GMT
Booy left the Board of Governors a year before the collapse of the deal...
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Post by a more piratey game on Jan 25, 2019 16:54:18 GMT
Booy left the Board of Governors a year before the collapse of the deal... there you go, ruining a perfectly good story with some of your so-called facts maybe he left a placeholder person though
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Post by badbloodash on Jan 25, 2019 16:56:54 GMT
Booy left the Board of Governors a year before the collapse of the deal... In all intents and purposes the deal collapsed after Sainsburys pulled out
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Post by Blue Mist on Jan 25, 2019 16:57:19 GMT
An interesting and fair point but UWE are entitled to have who they like on their BoD and i imagine he was brought in as a consultant.
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Deleted
Joined: January 1970
Posts: 0
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Post by Deleted on Jan 25, 2019 16:58:27 GMT
An interesting and fair point but UWE are entitled to have who they like on their BoD and i imagine he was brought in as a consultant. It's a Board of Governors, completely different to a Board of Directors. The Directorate report to the Governors.
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Post by Blue Mist on Jan 25, 2019 16:58:44 GMT
An interesting and fair point but UWE are entitled to have who they like on their BoD and i imagine he was brought in as a consultant. and then there’s the real facts above.
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Deleted
Joined: January 1970
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Post by Deleted on Jan 25, 2019 17:55:51 GMT
If he was that much of a negative influence then the deal would not have got off the ground in the first place surely? The fact it was able to be established in principle before being handed over to what was considered at the time to be a safe pair of hands in the form of the Al Qadi's leads me to believe that at this point it is on the Al Qadi's first and foremost to explain why the stadium never happened. But thanks to confidentiality we will probably never know the reasons why or who the 'bad guy' really was.
The only thing we know for definite is that it isn't going to happen and it was all a waste of time, effort and money on the part of Higgs and Co.
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Post by droitwichgas on Jan 25, 2019 18:10:24 GMT
"Why have the media (or Rovers) never called out UWE or Bristol Sport for an explanation. Without this the implications are quite worrying."
Surely there's no public explanation required as the ALQ's will know why they couldn't agree a deal with the UWE, the chances are it's ,ore down to the ALQ's being unable to rasis the finance, or not wanting to lease rather purchase the land, so I doubt they'll want those facts ever made public?
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Deleted
Joined: January 1970
Posts: 0
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Post by Deleted on Jan 25, 2019 18:28:05 GMT
Booy left the Board of Governors a year before the collapse of the deal... In all intents and purposes the deal collapsed after Sainsburys pulled out My reading of it is that Sainsbury's were never 'in'. My opinion is that it was all tactical, securing locations to prevent to competition from grabbing them and then, in favourable market conditions developing them. I see we now have 2 new similar outlets on Muller Rd. I'm sure the Gloucester Rd traders are excited to see the increase in sales this is sure to bring.
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Post by a more piratey game on Jan 27, 2019 16:20:50 GMT
An interesting and fair point but UWE are entitled to have who they like on their BoD and i imagine he was brought in as a consultant. It's a Board of Governors, completely different to a Board of Directors. The Directorate report to the Governors. interesting observation which got me googling this. It looks like there is a Board of Governors, an Academic Board, a Directorate, and Committees established by the Board of Governors in commercial terms, it looks to me that broadly; the Board of Governors = Company Board the Directorate = Executive Committee the Academic Board = Operations Committee. In effect it is senior among other Committees reporting to the Board, although called a Board, with its own sub-committees, for some regulatory reason rather than just 'another committee' reporting to the Board of Governors is that about how you see it chewy? also, at which level do you think Rovers would have had day-to-day contact with regard to their plans?
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Post by Blue Mist on Jan 27, 2019 17:03:14 GMT
It's a Board of Governors, completely different to a Board of Directors. The Directorate report to the Governors. interesting observation which got me googling this. It looks like there is a Board of Governors, an Academic Board, a Directorate, and Committees established by the Board of Governors in commercial terms, it looks to me that broadly; the Board of Governors = Company Board the Directorate = Executive Committee the Academic Board = Operations Committee. In effect it is senior among other Committees reporting to the Board, although called a Board, with its own sub-committees, for some regulatory reason rather than just 'another committee' reporting to the Board of Governors is that about how you see it chewy? also, at which level do you think Rovers would have had day-to-day contact with regard to their plans? FTR When I mentioned the truth above I meant the corrections that Chewy rightly posted, not my own comments which were wrong.
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Deleted
Joined: January 1970
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Post by Deleted on Jan 27, 2019 17:55:59 GMT
It's a Board of Governors, completely different to a Board of Directors. The Directorate report to the Governors. interesting observation which got me googling this. It looks like there is a Board of Governors, an Academic Board, a Directorate, and Committees established by the Board of Governors in commercial terms, it looks to me that broadly; the Board of Governors = Company Board the Directorate = Executive Committee the Academic Board = Operations Committee. In effect it is senior among other Committees reporting to the Board, although called a Board, with its own sub-committees, for some regulatory reason rather than just 'another committee' reporting to the Board of Governors is that about how you see it chewy? also, at which level do you think Rovers would have had day-to-day contact with regard to their plans? It’s probably best not to try and compare educational establishments with other forms of business. If anything the Governors are more similar to a small group of share holders in the business. The directorate will come to them and the Governors are the checks and balances. They have an idea of how they want the university to operate, however the directorate are there to apply it. Interestingly with the review of university fees in this country, the reduction in government funding, potential drop in EU students and other things I think we’ll see the university more attractive in trying to increase revenue from different sources.
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Post by a more piratey game on Jan 27, 2019 18:12:43 GMT
interesting observation which got me googling this. It looks like there is a Board of Governors, an Academic Board, a Directorate, and Committees established by the Board of Governors in commercial terms, it looks to me that broadly; the Board of Governors = Company Board the Directorate = Executive Committee the Academic Board = Operations Committee. In effect it is senior among other Committees reporting to the Board, although called a Board, with its own sub-committees, for some regulatory reason rather than just 'another committee' reporting to the Board of Governors is that about how you see it chewy? also, at which level do you think Rovers would have had day-to-day contact with regard to their plans? It’s probably best not to try and compare educational establishments with other forms of business. If anything the Governors are more similar to a small group of share holders in the business. The directorate will come to them and the Governors are the checks and balances. They have an idea of how they want the university to operate, however the directorate are there to apply it. Interestingly with the review of university fees in this country, the reduction in government funding, potential drop in EU students and other things I think we’ll see the university more attractive in trying to increase revenue from different sources. interesting - ta in my experience lots of businesses are really run by Executive Committees, especially ones that are subsidiaries of larger groups, so that main boards serve as checks and balances in a similar way. Someone can write an MBA paper on the comparison, or might have done so already I take it that Rovers were working mainly with someone who had the ear of the Directorate then. I wonder who was driving it from UWE's perspective
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kingswood Polak
Without music life would be a mistake
Joined: May 2014
Posts: 10,236
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Post by kingswood Polak on Jan 27, 2019 19:46:58 GMT
There is a matter that appears to have gone completely under the radar with regards to the apparent failure of the UWE Stadium project. I am not aware of it being reported upon, or any explanations requested by Rovers, UWE or any part of the media, and it troubles me greatly. Perhaps someone out there can help me out. However, before I get to it, I wish to give a short preamble to clarify the context and why I think it is so important. I am one of those Rovers supporters who see Rovers as potentially a very big club. This is quite feasible given that Bristol is not only a prosperous city, but also the largest city in the southern half of Britain, excluding London. I believe that the fundamental reason why this has not been achieved is ultimately down to stadium issues which have dogged the club since the sale of Eastville some 70 years ago. The solution to this is not redevelopment of the Memorial Stadium simply because it is in the wrong place. You simply can not get large crowds in and out of that area. This fact has been publicly acknowledged by Nick Higgs and the Al-Qadis in the past, although I am aware that strange statements contradicting this were made following the official withdrawal from the UWE stadium project in August 2017. The solution and game changer always has been the development of the UWE stadium, and I'm sure this was the intention of the Al-Qadis when they bought into the club. The UWE stadium project made logistical sense from every perspective, and really was a game changer as it would have removed the infrastructure limits on Rovers progressing as a club. So much so, I feel that the publicly made statements as striving to establish Rovers as a championship club were actually unambitious, although there may have been sensible reasons for this. I believe that Premiership status could ultimately been achieved. Thereby opening all sorts of additional commercial possibilities, and dare I say it, actually challenging the near monopoly of west country professional sport being achieved by Bristol Sport Ltd. So why didn't the UWE Stadium happen? We have all heard the public statements made in August 2017. I have to be honest and admit that I didn't find them very illuminating, but this could be due to my lack of comprehension of the English language. I do recall Steve Hamer making it clear that it was not down to money. So why didn't it happen? Us members of the public are left to speculate. Well, I'm not speculating or indulging in libelous tittle tattle, in accordance with the rules of this forum. So this brings me to my question of fact that I think needs a very public explanation. It is simple. Why was a Director of Bristol Sport Ltd sitting on the UWE Board of Governors and participating in the confidential meetings involving the UWE stadium project? This situation ran from the inception of the stadium project at least until late 2016. This may have continued longer but UWE Board of Governor meeting minutes were not made public from approx November 2016 onwards. This is a clear conflict of interests, yet this matter has never been brought to public notice. Surely I am not the only person aware of this, or unhappy with this state of affairs? Why have the media (or Rovers) never called out UWE or Bristol Sport for an explanation. Without this the implications are quite worrying. For the record, the Director Of Bristol Sport in question is Chris Booy, Chairman of Bristol Rugby (or Bears). I am positive many knew but just don’t bother to ask questions. We are probably the most apathetic supporters of all imo
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LPGas
Stuart Taylor
Joined: May 2014
Posts: 1,240
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Post by LPGas on Jan 28, 2019 12:11:09 GMT
The deal as brokered by Higgs gave away more than the present owners thought appropriate. Firstly our present owners wanted to buy the land, and another strip of land on which to build a hotel and some retail outlets. Uwe said no. Higgs had a greed the following all of which the present board disagreed with. Rovers to lay a car park. UWE to have 50% of the takings from the car park including match days and 25% of all food and drink outlets. Rovers to build jogging track, creche and gym that could be used by students. The stadium was to be named the UWE Community Stadium, and so Rovers would not get any income from naming rights. We wanted to buy the land and have a football ground, they looked upon it as part of the university. That is the basic reasons it fell through. As we know Universities are more than rich ( money making machines) and they saw an opportunity to obtain something at a cut price
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Post by laughinggas on Jan 28, 2019 13:30:59 GMT
Can't help thinking that Filton is a missed opportunity. Given the transport infrastructure going in for the arena, this would have ticked a lot of boxes.
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Post by a more piratey game on Jan 28, 2019 15:19:38 GMT
Can't help thinking that Filton is a missed opportunity. Given the transport infrastructure going in for the arena, this would have ticked a lot of boxes. do you think that was the other location, that had reached a dead end after time and money was spent, Wael tweeted about before Christmas?
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harrybuckle
Always look on the bright side
Joined: May 2014
Posts: 5,394
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Post by harrybuckle on Jan 28, 2019 15:42:21 GMT
Civil Service Sports Club site in Filton Avenue is it now being sold for housing reputed to worth £25m is this correct ? Where are our fans going to park now on matchdays ?
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