|
Post by a more piratey game on Aug 2, 2017 23:18:37 GMT
so...
gasincider says that the stadium news isn't new, the only new thing is that it has got out (and thanks to Browner for putting it out there)
there is 'internet noise' about worse to come/the club losing £1.6m and the owners wanting out
Wael tweeting that he is still committed
swissgas thinking/worrying about the £10m charge on the Mem - and Dwayne Sports' £4 in paid-up capital
your theories please?
|
|
Deleted
Joined: January 1970
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Aug 2, 2017 23:24:15 GMT
But why pay approx 300k for nicholls and 100k for sercombe? Why bother with the 5 year deal for dc. WHy build up the u-21 squad and employ extra coaches etc if wael want out? dosnt make sense to me.
|
|
|
Post by DudeLebowski on Aug 2, 2017 23:51:25 GMT
If only people were melting down this much & asking as many questions, when the sleep deprived golem had us millions of bucks in debt to pay day lenders & driving the club into very near oblivion.....
Mental fanbase we have.
|
|
|
Post by thecuregalore94 on Aug 3, 2017 0:02:43 GMT
As blueiris points out, Wael wouldn't authorise transfers that are statements of intent like Sercombe and Nichols if he didn't have a long-term plan and commitment to the club. He wouldn't make huge investment into the academy and DC's role if he wanted out.
Wael is here to stay, that is the best thing for the club and we owe him our support as the owner of our club. The man is a highly successful businessman with a vision based in making the best of the city of Bristol for the club's benefit. He saw the potential in the area, he envisioned taking us onwards and upwards with cash injection, but most importantly he saw the passion in the fanbase. We would not be fulfilling our duty as Gasheads if we treated this golden opportunity as Higgs 2.0. The UWE was always going to be troublesome, anything that goes takes years without pushing through and stumbles through the Courts is a bad path to take. Wael will have a backup plan, and personally I would leap at the opportunity to have the Mem developed large scale and keep the soul of the club rather than have an MK Dons franchise arena.
|
|
Peter Parker
Global Moderator
Richard Walker
You have been sentenced to DELETION!
Joined: May 2014
Posts: 4,920
|
Post by Peter Parker on Aug 3, 2017 1:29:54 GMT
Im not saying worse wont come out, but i dont think people can have it every which way.
Either the owners have been sitting on the UWE news or they havent? If they have hang long for? You dont authorise the investment in all areas of the club (whether loans or not) in recent months if they new the stadium was a dead duck for that long.
Wael is the face of the family and the real interested party in BRFC. Again if Hani is the big money man, why sign off on all this expenditure, if he is the one who was so say negotiating UWE. He would know the real details, so wouldnt exactly be spending the money whilst be fed s**t from others on the team.
Ignore the Hamer speak. He is always here to say things. Whatever the negotiating terms, the family and/or Hani would/should have known how close they ever were to a deal, so i dont particularly buy pulling out of the club given their program of 'investment'
Hope all is cleared up later regarding the bigger picture. I dont expect much detail re UWE on whether it was costs/leasehold/freehold and I hope it was just kept quiet, whilst over avenues have been explored
I dont think anyone is suprised UWE is dead. Nick Higgs legacy stadium is finally trashed after all the s**t to get us to this point.
If worse is to come, what have we really lost more than we would have 18 months ago when the old board had no f**king money and the club was dead in the water?
|
|
|
Post by a more piratey game on Aug 13, 2017 18:52:06 GMT
my theory so far.....
SH thought it was a 'done deal' a few months back - hence he said the same to the bloke who used to be Cast in Stone. But it didn't turn out to be true
UWE are so disorganised/fragmented that they had noone who could actually negotiate for them all. Rovers got fed up with that and, with the planning permission time-bound, decided to stop wasting their own time
2 creditors heard about that - one or both of whom might be in a position to lose money as a result - and either they/a contact of theirs or someone at UWE (or maybe a bit of both) leaked it. The leak still doesn't really make sense - maybe it was a last ditch effort to get some clarity?
Rovers panicked and put out a brief factual statement
UWE has been the centrepiece to the investment 'project', and delays with UWE have put the training ground plans (as well as maybe other things) on hold for a while/Wael
Wael has a greater reputational as well as emotional investment than the rest of his family. He's not about to give up as fallen at the first hurdle. His job is now a CEO's job - to find a way forward that will keep all parties on board. We all wish very good luck to him with that
UWE are shocked by the news, and still trying to work out what to do. As well as being unable to hold them all together, their front man wasn't exactly telling that all that they needed to know either
|
|
Deleted
Joined: January 1970
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Aug 13, 2017 19:18:18 GMT
my theory so far..... SH thought it was a 'done deal' a few months back - hence he said the same to the bloke who used to be Cast in Stone. But it didn't turn out to be true UWE are so disorganised/fragmented that they had noone who could actually negotiate for them all. Rovers got fed up with that and, with the planning permission time-bound, decided to stop wasting their own time 2 creditors heard about that - one or both of whom might be in a position to lose money as a result - and either they/a contact of theirs or someone at UWE (or maybe a bit of both) leaked it. The leak still doesn't really make sense - maybe it was a last ditch effort to get some clarity? Rovers panicked and put out a brief factual statement UWE has been the centrepiece to the investment 'project', and delays with UWE have put the training ground plans (as well as maybe other things) on hold for a while/Wael Wael has a greater reputational as well as emotional investment than the rest of his family. He's not about to give up as fallen at the first hurdle. His job is now a CEO's job - to find a way forward that will keep all parties on board. We all wish very good luck to him with that UWE are shocked by the news, and still trying to work out what to do. As well as being unable to hold them all together, their front man wasn't exactly telling that all that they needed to know either Great post that reads as potentially a genuinely plausible summary of goings on behind the scenes at the moment, my son and I walked past WAQ on Tueday night behind the family enclosure, he was giving a speech to the entire u21 squad flanked by Mildy and Chris Hargreaves, he was saying how he is looking forward to getting more involved in seeing the workings of the academy first hand and how he was looking forward to watching the lads in matches, strange speech to make if he is looking to get away from the club, he didn't need to organise the gathering and talk to them.
|
|
|
Post by PessimistGas on Aug 13, 2017 19:18:30 GMT
As blueiris points out, Wael wouldn't authorise transfers that are statements of intent like Sercombe and Nichols if he didn't have a long-term plan and commitment to the club. He wouldn't make huge investment into the academy and DC's role if he wanted out. Wael is here to stay, that is the best thing for the club and we owe him our support as the owner of our club. The man is a highly successful businessman with a vision based in making the best of the city of Bristol for the club's benefit. He saw the potential in the area, he envisioned taking us onwards and upwards with cash injection, but most importantly he saw the passion in the fanbase. We would not be fulfilling our duty as Gasheads if we treated this golden opportunity as Higgs 2.0. The UWE was always going to be troublesome, anything that goes takes years without pushing through and stumbles through the Courts is a bad path to take. Wael will have a backup plan, and personally I would leap at the opportunity to have the Mem developed large scale and keep the soul of the club rather than have an MK Dons franchise arena. It was the sale of the Mem to Sainsbury's that stumbled through the courts, not UWE. Wael has admitted they don't have a back up plan but will be looking into the Mem. No idea of timescales or costs though.
|
|
|
Post by PessimistGas on Aug 13, 2017 19:22:03 GMT
my theory so far..... SH thought it was a 'done deal' a few months back - hence he said the same to the bloke who used to be Cast in Stone. But it didn't turn out to be true UWE are so disorganised/fragmented that they had noone who could actually negotiate for them all. Rovers got fed up with that and, with the planning permission time-bound, decided to stop wasting their own time 2 creditors heard about that - one or both of whom might be in a position to lose money as a result - and either they/a contact of theirs or someone at UWE (or maybe a bit of both) leaked it. The leak still doesn't really make sense - maybe it was a last ditch effort to get some clarity? Rovers panicked and put out a brief factual statement UWE has been the centrepiece to the investment 'project', and delays with UWE have put the training ground plans (as well as maybe other things) on hold for a while/Wael Wael has a greater reputational as well as emotional investment than the rest of his family. He's not about to give up as fallen at the first hurdle. His job is now a CEO's job - to find a way forward that will keep all parties on board. We all wish very good luck to him with that UWE are shocked by the news, and still trying to work out what to do. As well as being unable to hold them all together, their front man wasn't exactly telling that all that they needed to know either Great post that reads as potentially a genuinely plausible summary of goings on behind the scenes at the moment, my son and I walked past WAQ on Tueday night behind the family enclosure, he was giving a speech to the entire u21 squad flanked by Mildy and Chris Hargreaves, he was saying how he is looking forward to getting more involved in seeing the workings of the academy first hand and how he was looking forward to watching the lads in matches, strange speech to make if he is looking to get away from the club, he didn't need to organise the gathering and talk to them. I think Wael is genuine guy whose heart is in it, but he doesn't hold the purse strings. I think it more likely that the scalr of the financial commitment required has become cleaerer and things have changed with the family.
|
|
Deleted
Joined: January 1970
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Aug 13, 2017 19:36:08 GMT
Great post that reads as potentially a genuinely plausible summary of goings on behind the scenes at the moment, my son and I walked past WAQ on Tueday night behind the family enclosure, he was giving a speech to the entire u21 squad flanked by Mildy and Chris Hargreaves, he was saying how he is looking forward to getting more involved in seeing the workings of the academy first hand and how he was looking forward to watching the lads in matches, strange speech to make if he is looking to get away from the club, he didn't need to organise the gathering and talk to them. I think Wael is genuine guy whose heart is in it, but he doesn't hold the purse strings. I think it more likely that the scalr of the financial commitment required has become cleaerer and things have changed with the family. Perhaps he is a Waelter Mitty type character who has got in to deep ? who knows ? only time will tell.
I have heard a couple of stories about his father being angry with him a few months ago, the funniest one of those stories probably isn't true though.
|
|
Deleted
Joined: January 1970
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Aug 13, 2017 20:14:12 GMT
But why pay approx 300k for nicholls and 100k for sercombe? Why bother with the 5 year deal for dc. WHy build up the u-21 squad and employ extra coaches etc if wael want out? dosnt make sense to me. Most transfer fees are paid over the life of the players contract so on the drip so to speak. As to the answers to your other questions my guess is that there has been a shift of power since the takeover and the commitment to the club isn't how Wael intended. Back to the transfer fees and that rattled creditors who are poised with issuing a winding up order payment isn't made very soon. That threat is possibly why Dwane Sports placed a charge over the stadium recently.
|
|
|
Post by a more piratey game on Aug 13, 2017 20:16:04 GMT
anyone got any theories about what the 'worse is to come' bit was all about?
|
|
Deleted
Joined: January 1970
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Aug 13, 2017 20:17:33 GMT
my theory so far..... SH thought it was a 'done deal' a few months back - hence he said the same to the bloke who used to be Cast in Stone. But it didn't turn out to be true UWE are so disorganised/fragmented that they had noone who could actually negotiate for them all. Rovers got fed up with that and, with the planning permission time-bound, decided to stop wasting their own time 2 creditors heard about that - one or both of whom might be in a position to lose money as a result - and either they/a contact of theirs or someone at UWE (or maybe a bit of both) leaked it. The leak still doesn't really make sense - maybe it was a last ditch effort to get some clarity? Rovers panicked and put out a brief factual statement UWE has been the centrepiece to the investment 'project', and delays with UWE have put the training ground plans (as well as maybe other things) on hold for a while/Wael Wael has a greater reputational as well as emotional investment than the rest of his family. He's not about to give up as fallen at the first hurdle. His job is now a CEO's job - to find a way forward that will keep all parties on board. We all wish very good luck to him with that UWE are shocked by the news, and still trying to work out what to do. As well as being unable to hold them all together, their front man wasn't exactly telling that all that they needed to know either Correct regarding your first sentence AMPG.
|
|
Deleted
Joined: January 1970
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Aug 13, 2017 20:18:43 GMT
anyone got any theories about what the 'worse is to come' bit was all about? My guess was that was regarding any winding up order being served.
|
|
|
Post by a more piratey game on Aug 13, 2017 20:27:22 GMT
But why pay approx 300k for nicholls and 100k for sercombe? Why bother with the 5 year deal for dc. WHy build up the u-21 squad and employ extra coaches etc if wael want out? dosnt make sense to me. Most transfer fees are paid over the life of the players contract so on the drip so to speak. As to the answers to your other questions my guess is that there has been a shift of power since the takeover and the commitment to the club isn't how Wael intended. Back to the transfer fees and that rattled creditors who are poised with issuing a winding up order payment isn't made very soon. That threat is possibly why Dwane Sports placed a charge over the stadium recently. but winding up petitions are only for companies that can't pay their debts, not those that won't? from a government site: You can apply to the court to close or ‘wind up’ a company if it can’t pay its debts. This is also known as compulsory liquidation. To wind up a company you must: be owed £750 or more be able to prove that the company can’t pay you You need to fill in forms and send them to the right court to apply to wind up a company. Your application to the court is known as a ‘winding-up petition’. If you’re successful: the company assets are sold any legal disputes are settled the company collects money it’s owed funds are paid to you and any other creditors
|
|
|
Post by a more piratey game on Aug 13, 2017 20:28:37 GMT
more on the same subject....
What is a winding up petition?
A winding up petition (WUP) is a legal notice put forward to the court by a creditor. The creditor petitions to the court to have a company liquidated as a way of enforcing payment of a debt, as they believe the company is insolvent.
This is by far the most serious action that can be taken against your company and it is often preceded by a statutory demand. So what can be done about it? Often the company has broken any trust the creditor had, payment deals have failed, cheques have bounced and generally, directors have not kept their word to pay. Even though your company may have tried very hard to meet payment deadlines, your customers have been slow to pay, or sales have been lower than planned.
So the creditor reacts with the "nuclear" option. Of course, sometimes it's not as simple as that; in some cases, we have seen creditors issue malicious petitions as a means of trying to settle disputes. We can advise how to deal with this. In Scotland, a threat of a winding up petition is even more dangerous to a company, so read our page on the procedural differences.
|
|
Deleted
Joined: January 1970
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Aug 13, 2017 20:31:04 GMT
Most transfer fees are paid over the life of the players contract so on the drip so to speak. As to the answers to your other questions my guess is that there has been a shift of power since the takeover and the commitment to the club isn't how Wael intended. Back to the transfer fees and that rattled creditors who are poised with issuing a winding up order payment isn't made very soon. That threat is possibly why Dwane Sports placed a charge over the stadium recently. but winding up petitions are only for companies that can't pay their debts, not those that won't? from a government site: You can apply to the court to close or ‘wind up’ a company if it can’t pay its debts. This is also known as compulsory liquidation. To wind up a company you must: be owed £750 or more be able to prove that the company can’t pay you You need to fill in forms and send them to the right court to apply to wind up a company. Your application to the court is known as a ‘winding-up petition’. If you’re successful: the company assets are sold any legal disputes are settled the company collects money it’s owed funds are paid to you and any other creditors Legal advice and credit checks have been completed.
|
|
|
Post by a more piratey game on Aug 13, 2017 20:36:38 GMT
but winding up petitions are only for companies that can't pay their debts, not those that won't? from a government site: You can apply to the court to close or ‘wind up’ a company if it can’t pay its debts. This is also known as compulsory liquidation. To wind up a company you must: be owed £750 or more be able to prove that the company can’t pay you You need to fill in forms and send them to the right court to apply to wind up a company. Your application to the court is known as a ‘winding-up petition’. If you’re successful: the company assets are sold any legal disputes are settled the company collects money it’s owed funds are paid to you and any other creditors Legal advice and credit checks have been completed. that probably doesn't cost much and, in my view, probably isn't worth much and, if the debt is subject to completion of the sale of the Mem, probably isn't due. Although if it isn't subject to that, it does explain the charge on the Mem the debts are small amounts of money given the overall scale of things though - a few hundred thousand pounds. I'm struggling to believe that the family/DS would let things topple over for that so my guess is that the creditors have been winding people up, but won't be causing any company to be wound up
|
|
Angas
Joined: May 2014
Posts: 2,066
|
Post by Angas on Aug 13, 2017 20:38:55 GMT
but winding up petitions are only for companies that can't pay their debts, not those that won't? from a government site: You can apply to the court to close or ‘wind up’ a company if it can’t pay its debts. This is also known as compulsory liquidation. To wind up a company you must: be owed £750 or more be able to prove that the company can’t pay you You need to fill in forms and send them to the right court to apply to wind up a company. Your application to the court is known as a ‘winding-up petition’. If you’re successful: the company assets are sold any legal disputes are settled the company collects money it’s owed funds are paid to you and any other creditors Legal advice and credit checks have been completed. Did the legal advice suggest there was at least a 60% chance of success?
|
|
|
Post by laughinggas on Aug 13, 2017 20:39:37 GMT
Oh goodie a theory thread, well there appears to be ni chance of a factual thread!
|
|