faggotygas
Byron Anthony
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Post by faggotygas on May 6, 2017 15:28:42 GMT
We would be in a similar situation to Yeovil without a bigger ground, we would have to overspend to stay in the Championship and so have no money to spend on developing the club. Look, I am others are suggesting that we spend money in line with our income, and that any extra is invested in developing the club. You are suggesting boom & bust. Or what we spent 10 years doing, bust and bust some more. Just spending seldom works, unless you get lucky or have massive sums that you are willing to chuck at it. Someone said a few days back that Chelsea has swallowed a billion quid so far, and counting. Very true, to guarantee promotion you don't have to spend more than anyone else, you have to spend double everyone else. Any lower and you are gambling with short term success if you win, and financial disaster if you lose
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on May 6, 2017 16:01:45 GMT
Yeovil had no money but still spent. If we used the burton model even relegation wouldnt have to hurt us as a club. If we try to tread water while we wait for the ground etc i see trouble just around the corner but others dont agree so hey ho Perhaps that's because we're not all manic depressive, everything you post on both forums is always doom & gloom, until we see what players DC brings in we're no idea what budget he's been given to work with. If he can bring similar quality players to what he brought in during January then there's no reason why we can mount a Play Off/promotion push next season. I think if you read through my last say 20 posts you would find the "doom and gloom" statement untrue though i havnt checked.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on May 6, 2017 16:13:07 GMT
Or what we spent 10 years doing, bust and bust some more. Just spending seldom works, unless you get lucky or have massive sums that you are willing to chuck at it. Someone said a few days back that Chelsea has swallowed a billion quid so far, and counting. Very true, to guarantee promotion you don't have to spend more than anyone else, you have to spend double everyone else. Any lower and you are gambling with short term success if you win, and financial disaster if you lose So its just the same rovers as our whole history then? no money to spend and when we get a decent team/manager combination every 20 years or so it lasts about 3 years then back to obscurity. I suppose it all hinges on a new ground but anybody could see at the end of this season that we need serious investment on the playing side with no goalkeeper,dominant centre-half and strikers not top league 1 quality.
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Peter Parker
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Post by Peter Parker on May 6, 2017 16:28:51 GMT
How many more months do we have to read this.
I dont think the Al-Qadis are here to run a second rate third division club. They might not be going to spend squillions, but they are putting foundations in for the club to build on. Something that (outside of purchaing The Mem) hasnt really happened in 30+ years since losing Eastville.
Throwing good money after bad on the playing side hasnt done anything in the past 15 years.
I dont 'beleive' everything DC says when it comes to budgets and the like. I think he is always trying to downplay expectations slightly
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kegandeg
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Post by kegandeg on May 6, 2017 16:56:18 GMT
We still had unsold tickets v Millwall not many granted but nothing in place to sell them why because we are still Mickey mouse as a club these small things make a big difference we couldn't state the match was a complete sell out because we haven't got the infastructure to sell the last few tickets future supporters need to see the signs and a complete sell out would tell future supporters we mean business !
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faggotygas
Byron Anthony
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Post by faggotygas on May 6, 2017 17:22:31 GMT
Very true, to guarantee promotion you don't have to spend more than anyone else, you have to spend double everyone else. Any lower and you are gambling with short term success if you win, and financial disaster if you lose So its just the same rovers as our whole history then? no money to spend and when we get a decent team/manager combination every 20 years or so it lasts about 3 years then back to obscurity. I suppose it all hinges on a new ground but anybody could see at the end of this season that we need serious investment on the playing side with no goalkeeper,dominant centre-half and strikers not top league 1 quality. ok, first of all our demise was not due to underspending, we had one of the best budgets in league 2 and we made a big loss every year. It was due to misspending. Second, there are more than 2 alternatives. I don't believe we should risk the club on overspending to get to the championship, when we don't have the facilities to stay there.
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Post by droitwichgas on May 6, 2017 17:29:04 GMT
How many more months do we have to read this. I dont think the Al-Qadis are here to run a second rate third division club. They might not be going to spend squillions, but they are putting foundations in for the club to build on. Something that (outside of purchaing The Mem) hasnt really happened in 30+ years since losing Eastville. Throwing good money after bad on the playing side hasnt done anything in the past 15 years. I dont 'beleive' everything DC says when it comes to budgets and the like. I think he is always trying to downplay expectations slightly If they do go ahead and develop The Colony and build the UWE isn't spend millions just what they are going to do? It probably won't actually be their own personal money but if it all goes wrong they'll be the big losers. As far as DC's "budget" comments isn't he trying to do the opposite this summer by trying to build up the impression Wael might give him a decent budget, as I can't see he can announce in a week or two Wael's let me down, budget wise, if he doesn't get what he wanted/knew he wouldn't be getting anyway.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on May 6, 2017 18:27:13 GMT
How many more months do we have to read this. I dont think the Al-Qadis are here to run a second rate third division club. They might not be going to spend squillions, but they are putting foundations in for the club to build on. Something that (outside of purchaing The Mem) hasnt really happened in 30+ years since losing Eastville. Throwing good money after bad on the playing side hasnt done anything in the past 15 years. I dont 'beleive' everything DC says when it comes to budgets and the like. I think he is always trying to downplay expectations slightly If they do go ahead and develop The Colony and build the UWE isn't spend millions just what they are going to do? It probably won't actually be their own personal money but if it all goes wrong they'll be the big losers. As far as DC's "budget" comments isn't he trying to do the opposite this summer by trying to build up the impression Wael might give him a decent budget, as I can't see he can announce in a week or two Wael's let me down, budget wise, if he doesn't get what he wanted/knew he wouldn't be getting anyway. We were told that there were meetings in London with investors, that was last summer I think, so we don't know at this stage whose money will be used to build UWE.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on May 6, 2017 18:36:10 GMT
Very true, to guarantee promotion you don't have to spend more than anyone else, you have to spend double everyone else. Any lower and you are gambling with short term success if you win, and financial disaster if you lose So its just the same rovers as our whole history then? no money to spend and when we get a decent team/manager combination every 20 years or so it lasts about 3 years then back to obscurity. I suppose it all hinges on a new ground but anybody could see at the end of this season that we need serious investment on the playing side with no goalkeeper,dominant centre-half and strikers not top league 1 quality. Seriously, invest a bit of time looking into how 2nd tier clubs generate their income and how much of it comes from gate receipts, you'll feel a lot better when you see the numbers Of course more bums on seats is better, as long as the money they generate is spent wisely, but it's not as important at that level as it is further down the pyramid. We'll need a ground that holds at least 20,000 when we get promoted to the PL though
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on May 6, 2017 20:20:51 GMT
So its just the same rovers as our whole history then? no money to spend and when we get a decent team/manager combination every 20 years or so it lasts about 3 years then back to obscurity. I suppose it all hinges on a new ground but anybody could see at the end of this season that we need serious investment on the playing side with no goalkeeper,dominant centre-half and strikers not top league 1 quality. Seriously, invest a bit of time looking into how 2nd tier clubs generate their income and how much of it comes from gate receipts, you'll feel a lot better when you see the numbers Of course more bums on seats is better, as long as the money they generate is spent wisely, but it's not as important at that level as it is further down the pyramid. We'll need a ground that holds at least 20,000 when we get promoted to the PL though Some clubs have simply been driven to better things by a wealthy owner,,,,man city,chelsea,bournemouth,forest green rovers,bristol manor farm,peterborough utd,eastleigh,fleetwood,wigan and of course lets not forget bristol city.
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Post by o2o2bo2ba on May 6, 2017 20:47:37 GMT
After reading some well meaning and reasoned opinions I thought I'd chip in.
I don't think dc, wael et al came here to be content with top ten finish as the apex of their achievements.
I do think however, if we had made play offs EVERYONE would have been gunning for us to go up. And at some point, we did indeed flirt with this notion.
I'm certainly not scared of second tier football, I've been through it before, more than once. So I know the club can sustain such a position.
We're not scared of anything about Championship football.
What we need to be is pragmatic, patient and sensible. Little by little players are running their time with us which is the right way to progress. It means we're getting better and better, all within a budget, all going the right direction, learning all the time.
I think this is the right way. This is the right time. And if e keep the same management team, spine of team and structure of the club, we can be competitive at every level in Championship, Bristol and who knows, maybe even south of England.
Can't wait for the next step of the journey to begin..
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on May 6, 2017 21:28:11 GMT
Seriously, invest a bit of time looking into how 2nd tier clubs generate their income and how much of it comes from gate receipts, you'll feel a lot better when you see the numbers Of course more bums on seats is better, as long as the money they generate is spent wisely, but it's not as important at that level as it is further down the pyramid. We'll need a ground that holds at least 20,000 when we get promoted to the PL though Some clubs have simply been driven to better things by a wealthy owner,,,,man city,chelsea,bournemouth,forest green rovers,bristol manor farm,peterborough utd,eastleigh,fleetwood,wigan and of course lets not forget bristol city. Do you really want to leave the club dependant on a benefactor, or would you rather have a self sustaining model? To address your examples; Chelsea and Bournemouth, show me the source of the money and I'll give you an answer. 1982 Ltd, the points-per-pound return is dreadful, Lansdown has thrown enough money at it to build a small hospital, and they just about avoided relegation to the same division as us, again. Wigan, we'll be playing them next year. FGR, let's see what happens there when they have to manage with wage restrictions. The owner is prepared to gamble on a new stadium and hope that people come to watch a League team, so far he's spending every year but has no new stadium and no League football. See what's happened there, it's a big clue, spending does not guarantee success. Peterborough, can't remember them exactly setting the football world on fire recently. Man City, use a stadium owned by the local council, and still the owner has spent well over a billion pounds, utter madness. What do you think happens if the owner walks away? Fleetwood are punching above their weight, but so have many other clubs without the owner losing a fortune, it's not the only way. Eastleigh, seriously? On the other hand, Solihull Moors, haven't got two pennies to rub together, average crowds around the 1000 mark, but are properly run, and oh look, are competing with FGR and finished the season 2 points behind Eastleigh.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on May 6, 2017 21:44:46 GMT
Some clubs have simply been driven to better things by a wealthy owner,,,,man city,chelsea,bournemouth,forest green rovers,bristol manor farm,peterborough utd,eastleigh,fleetwood,wigan and of course lets not forget bristol city. Do you really want to leave the club dependant on a benefactor, or would you rather have a self sustaining model? To address your examples; Chelsea and Bournemouth, show me the source of the money and I'll give you an answer. 1982 Ltd, the points-per-pound return is dreadful, Lansdown has thrown enough money at it to build a small hospital, and they just about avoided relegation to the same division as us, again. Wigan, we'll be playing them next year. FGR, let's see what happens there when they have to manage with wage restrictions. The owner is prepared to gamble on a new stadium and hope that people come to watch a League team, so far he's spending every year but has no new stadium and no League football. See what's happened there, it's a big clue, spending does not guarantee success. Peterborough, can't remember them exactly setting the football world on fire recently. Man City, use a stadium owned by the local council, and still the owner has spent well over a billion pounds, utter madness. What do you think happens if the owner walks away? Fleetwood are punching above their weight, but so have many other clubs without the owner losing a fortune, it's not the only way. Eastleigh, seriously? On the other hand, Solihull Moors, haven't got two pennies to rub together, average crowds around the 1000 mark, but are properly run, and oh look, are competing with FGR and finished the season 2 points behind Eastleigh. Each club i mention is relative to their previous status,ive played against eastleigh in £30 a week football in the 1980"s now their full time ditto forest green,wigan were non league for years. Our friends city are made now because they have a new ground a bigger fan base and it wont matter if he sells up they will most likely be a championship club in the next decade. What im saying is yes build the club up by improving the infrastructure and hopefully moving to a new ground but dont allow the team to badly fail and risk making all the other elements[ground,academy etc] irrelevant. I mean wael is wealthy is he not?
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on May 6, 2017 21:56:06 GMT
Do you really want to leave the club dependant on a benefactor, or would you rather have a self sustaining model? To address your examples; Chelsea and Bournemouth, show me the source of the money and I'll give you an answer. 1982 Ltd, the points-per-pound return is dreadful, Lansdown has thrown enough money at it to build a small hospital, and they just about avoided relegation to the same division as us, again. Wigan, we'll be playing them next year. FGR, let's see what happens there when they have to manage with wage restrictions. The owner is prepared to gamble on a new stadium and hope that people come to watch a League team, so far he's spending every year but has no new stadium and no League football. See what's happened there, it's a big clue, spending does not guarantee success. Peterborough, can't remember them exactly setting the football world on fire recently. Man City, use a stadium owned by the local council, and still the owner has spent well over a billion pounds, utter madness. What do you think happens if the owner walks away? Fleetwood are punching above their weight, but so have many other clubs without the owner losing a fortune, it's not the only way. Eastleigh, seriously? On the other hand, Solihull Moors, haven't got two pennies to rub together, average crowds around the 1000 mark, but are properly run, and oh look, are competing with FGR and finished the season 2 points behind Eastleigh. Each club i mention is relative to their previous status,ive played against eastleigh in £30 a week football in the 1980"s now their full time ditto forest green,wigan were non league for years. Our friends city are made now because they have a new ground a bigger fan base and it wont matter if he sells up they will most likely be a championship club in the next decade. What im saying is yes build the club up by improving the infrastructure and hopefully moving to a new ground but dont allow the team to badly fail and risk making all the other elements[ground,academy etc] irrelevant. I mean wael is wealthy is he not? We disagree. I'm with Wael. A sustainable model is the way ahead. If 1982 can survive without Lansdown's money, who will cover the losses every year? Awkward question, I get that, but one worth asking. Of course, there could be another Venky family member looking to invest. Maybe we can car share when we play Blackburn away next season? Not sure what the point is about Eastleigh, you know they are 2 divisions below us and stumbled to a mid-table finish? Can you not see the pattern, the higher up the pyramid you go the higher the stakes and the greater the risk? The manager has a formula, it seems to work and it doesn't involve throwing big sums at duff old pros with knee knack or players with an attitude like O'Toole, I'm more than relaxed with the thought that he'll sit down with Wael and they'll work out a sustainable budget that strengthens the squad for next season.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on May 6, 2017 22:53:35 GMT
Each club i mention is relative to their previous status,ive played against eastleigh in £30 a week football in the 1980"s now their full time ditto forest green,wigan were non league for years. Our friends city are made now because they have a new ground a bigger fan base and it wont matter if he sells up they will most likely be a championship club in the next decade. What im saying is yes build the club up by improving the infrastructure and hopefully moving to a new ground but dont allow the team to badly fail and risk making all the other elements[ground,academy etc] irrelevant. I mean wael is wealthy is he not? We disagree. I'm with Wael. A sustainable model is the way ahead. If 1982 can survive without Lansdown's money, who will cover the losses every year? Awkward question, I get that, but one worth asking. Of course, there could be another Venky family member looking to invest. Maybe we can car share when we play Blackburn away next season? Not sure what the point is about Eastleigh, you know they are 2 divisions below us and stumbled to a mid-table finish? Can you not see the pattern, the higher up the pyramid you go the higher the stakes and the greater the risk? The manager has a formula, it seems to work and it doesn't involve throwing big sums at duff old pros with knee knack or players with an attitude like O'Toole, I'm more than relaxed with the thought that he'll sit down with Wael and they'll work out a sustainable budget that strengthens the squad for next season. Lets agree to disagree,,dc will leave soon imo
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Peter Parker
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Richard Walker
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Post by Peter Parker on May 7, 2017 4:52:20 GMT
We disagree. I'm with Wael. A sustainable model is the way ahead. If 1982 can survive without Lansdown's money, who will cover the losses every year? Awkward question, I get that, but one worth asking. Of course, there could be another Venky family member looking to invest. Maybe we can car share when we play Blackburn away next season? Not sure what the point is about Eastleigh, you know they are 2 divisions below us and stumbled to a mid-table finish? Can you not see the pattern, the higher up the pyramid you go the higher the stakes and the greater the risk? The manager has a formula, it seems to work and it doesn't involve throwing big sums at duff old pros with knee knack or players with an attitude like O'Toole, I'm more than relaxed with the thought that he'll sit down with Wael and they'll work out a sustainable budget that strengthens the squad for next season. Lets agree to disagree,,dc will leave soon imo Maybe he will, and then maybe you can say I told you so But the season has only just finished and a couple of people are posting negatives and concerns. Maybe there are some and I am ot saying they shouldnt be discussed, but the way and timing of the posting makes me feel some havent enjoyed anything this year. Its your right to post your thoughts, but its awfully depressing to read it so soon after the season and the thought of reading it every day....
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on May 7, 2017 9:04:19 GMT
We disagree. I'm with Wael. A sustainable model is the way ahead. If 1982 can survive without Lansdown's money, who will cover the losses every year? Awkward question, I get that, but one worth asking. Of course, there could be another Venky family member looking to invest. Maybe we can car share when we play Blackburn away next season? Not sure what the point is about Eastleigh, you know they are 2 divisions below us and stumbled to a mid-table finish? Can you not see the pattern, the higher up the pyramid you go the higher the stakes and the greater the risk? The manager has a formula, it seems to work and it doesn't involve throwing big sums at duff old pros with knee knack or players with an attitude like O'Toole, I'm more than relaxed with the thought that he'll sit down with Wael and they'll work out a sustainable budget that strengthens the squad for next season. Lets agree to disagree,,dc will leave soon imo We can disagree, but you'll still be wrong, just spending may work, but it fails more often than succeeds. If the manager is about to walk out then surely the owner should keep the purse strings pulled tight until he knows who will be in charge next season. Or maybe they should have a meeting and get all of these things agreed? Once you've thought things through and have a coherent argument be sure to let us know You really do sound like a barrel of laughs, wonder why you bother at all, I mean, in a few billion years this section of the Milky Way is going to collide with the Andromeda galaxy and we'll all be torn to pieces by unimaginable gravitational forces anyway. I'm just going to go and sit in the park and wait for the inevitable........
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on May 7, 2017 9:34:57 GMT
Lets agree to disagree,,dc will leave soon imo We can disagree, but you'll still be wrong, just spending may work, but it fails more often than succeeds. If the manager is about to walk out then surely the owner should keep the purse strings pulled tight until he knows who will be in charge next season. Or maybe they should have a meeting and get all of these things agreed? Once you've thought things through and have a coherent argument be sure to let us know You really do sound like a barrel of laughs, wonder why you bother at all, I mean, in a few billion years this section of the Milky Way is going to collide with the Andromeda galaxy and we'll all be torn to pieces by unimaginable gravitational forces anyway. I'm just going to go and sit in the park and wait for the inevitable........ Brexit😂
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on May 7, 2017 10:43:33 GMT
Lets agree to disagree,,dc will leave soon imo We can disagree, but you'll still be wrong, just spending may work, but it fails more often than succeeds. If the manager is about to walk out then surely the owner should keep the purse strings pulled tight until he knows who will be in charge next season. Or maybe they should have a meeting and get all of these things agreed? Once you've thought things through and have a coherent argument be sure to let us know You really do sound like a barrel of laughs, wonder why you bother at all, I mean, in a few billion years this section of the Milky Way is going to collide with the Andromeda galaxy and we'll all be torn to pieces by unimaginable gravitational forces anyway. I'm just going to go and sit in the park and wait for the inevitable........ you dont have to talk down to people just because they have a different viewpoint to yourself. For at least 2 years to were telling everyone on here that darrell clarke was a clown so remember your not always right.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on May 7, 2017 11:29:21 GMT
We can disagree, but you'll still be wrong, just spending may work, but it fails more often than succeeds. If the manager is about to walk out then surely the owner should keep the purse strings pulled tight until he knows who will be in charge next season. Or maybe they should have a meeting and get all of these things agreed? Once you've thought things through and have a coherent argument be sure to let us know You really do sound like a barrel of laughs, wonder why you bother at all, I mean, in a few billion years this section of the Milky Way is going to collide with the Andromeda galaxy and we'll all be torn to pieces by unimaginable gravitational forces anyway. I'm just going to go and sit in the park and wait for the inevitable........ you dont have to talk down to people just because they have a different viewpoint to yourself. For at least 2 years to were telling everyone on here that darrell clarke was a clown so remember your not always right. No, I'm not always right, far from it, happy to be corrected, no problem with that whatsoever, in fact I like it, it means you are being made to think a little. Take whatever viewpoint you like, but be prepared to defend it. The evidence is that spending beyond your means just leads to boom and bust, ask Higgs. We've already done what was said about Clarke, if you need to be corrected again let's do it via PM, I suspect that people are bored rigid by the same stuff being thrown back and forth. The body of evidence does not support what you want Wael to do, it's reckless and doesn't build a foundation for a stable club. You carry on saying the same thing, the evidence is still there and still does nothing to support your position, and I still don't think you've looked into SCMP.
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