england vs bangladesh

I mean it's just the smallest bit cathartic to be having a conversation with yourself on a forum whilst England wickets tumble around you and you know the Aussies will be mercilessly ridiculing you for the next four years for the abject failure of your cricket team.

Taylor you twat, what sort of pathetic shot was that? Jesus.

Lost by 15 runs. I'm supporting Afghanistan for the final match.

Hmmm....That was especially awful but to be honest entirely what we deserved.  The only reason we were still in the tournament at all is because it is pretty much custom designed to make it impossible for us to go out in the first round - and we went out in the first round.  In fact since we were unceremoniously dumped out of the terrible 1999 World Cup at home the ICC woke up to the disaster of losing major media markets in the first round.  That's why you have these interminable group stages - to make sure England, India and Australia can overcome any early poor performance.  They've been making it easier and easier for us to qualify and we've still failed to do it in 3 of the last 4 tournaments.  That should say something.  It's not as if we've been a bad side full stop for most of that time - we've been consistently one of the top 3 test nations in the world for most of that time and we've one the T20 World Cup.  But our ODI form has been shocking.  There is consistent evidence to suggest the reason we keep failing is nothing to do with underperformance - we are just simply not one of the top 8 ODI teams in the World anymore.  We didn't just lose to Aus, NZ and SL; we were absolutely crushed in those games. Bangladesh offerred us a get out of jail free card and we fluffed that too - arguably by quite distance.  15 runs is not that close and it was only a desperate rear guard that prevented it being a lot more comfortably for Bangladesh.  I think we need to do the following;

1.  Stop overrating our own players. Our players have a much higher profile than a lot of the opposition players but that doesn't mean they're any better; they just have a massive media machine around them.  The hype around Morgan from players, media, fans has been ridiculous over the years.  The guy broke into the team and provided innovation other English batsmen had never shown while delivering a number of breathtaking performance.  But then it all tailed off massively and for the last 2 years he's been an inconsistent and, at times, poor performer.  Yet still I regularly hear 'Morgan is one of the best ODI batsmen in the World', 'form is temporary, class is permanent' etc.  It seems to me that Morgan presents evidence of a guy who has been completely found out and had his confidence destroyed.  What did we do? Make him captain on the back of a media campaign.  All that's done is draw more attention to his struggles.  KP was often referred to as 'World Class one day player' etc but how many games did he actually win that mattered and was he really that consistent? Yes he was the best we had but if you want truly World Class look at AB De Villiers, look at Brendon MCcullum, look at Kumar Sangakarra, Dhoni etc.  It's not just about volume of runs it's about quality of runs - when do they deliver? We have a very narrow world view of the game that puts England players in a pedestal higher than they deserve to be. There's a reason we haven't done very well for a long time - our players really aren't very good at this.  You still hear people harking back to the golden age of Ben Hollioake (RIP) and Nick Knight for crying outloud - it's just ridiculous the extent to which we overrate pretty average players based on 1 or 2 memorable performances early in their careers.  Being a World Class ODI player is about consistently delivering under pressure - I don't think any of our players have fit that bill over the last 10 years.  They've crumpled under pressure constantly.

2.We still confuse Test performance with ODI performance, particularly with bowlers for some reason. Broad and Anderson are World Class Test bowlers but they've never been the equivalent quality in ODI's really.  Intermittantly successful at best.  Same went for Grame Swann come the end of his career.  We need to take a look at what bowlers need to do in ODI's in order to be successful and develop them accordingly. 

3.  We chronically underestimate the opposition if they're not Australia, India, SA or (sometimes) Pakistan.  This is the flipside of overrating our own players.  I was stunned by the number of fans, media and players that were talking about Sri Lanka as if they were a team we should be beating.  This is a team that made the final of the last World Cup, the final of the last ICC Trophy, won the last World T20 Cup, just beat us in a home test series, have the best ODI batsman of his generation, the best spinner in the tournament, oodles of experience and somehow we convinced ourselves we were not underdogs because they had a few holes in their bowling attack (I was definitely guilty on that one).  What about the holes in our whole bloody lineup?! Says everything that Angelo Matthews is often treated as an after thought when English cricket people talk about Sri Lanka and has been referred to as a fairly average player.  England would kill to have Angelo Matthews in our side; in fact he would walk in as captain.  The idea that we should assume we should be winning against a side that has Dilshan, Sangakarra, Jayawardene, Matthews and Herath when we have nobody in our team who comes close to touching them in terms of talent and experience is just ridiculous and shows a 30 year out of date attitude.  They have consistently shown over 30 years that they are better than us yet we still find it hard to properly respect that.  Similar with Bangladesh.  Now obviously England should be beating Bangladesh, who also had a pretty lousy tournament up to this point, but the gap between the two sides is nowhere near as big as we'd like to think it is.  Shaqib Al Hasan has consistently come near the top of the rankings for ODI players, Tamin Iqbal and Mortaza are proven match winners etc.  They have players who would get in our side yet still we act like they are an associate not fit to lace our shoes.  I'm fairly sure the reason we made the bizarre decision to bowl first is that we fancied Anderson and Broad to blow them away - just assumed that our bowlers would be too good for them.  That's back to back World Cups Bangladesh have beaten us in now; maybe we'll take them more seriously now.  The evidence of constant thumpings at the hands of Sri Lanka while still maintaining the same patronising attitude suggests probably not.  We overestimate the flaws in opposition sides and underestimate our own so much.

4.  Our tactics are prehistoric and don't even play to our strengths (though I'm struggling to identify what exactly they are right now).  We react to developments in ODI cricket far too late.  The rule change to take an extra fielder from the outfield has had a massive effect on the game - other sides clearly anticipated this and changed tactics accordingly, we were still opening the batting with Alistair Cook in January.

5.  We marginalise ODI cricket and yet still expect to be competitive at the World Cup.  Most countries play more games, more competitive tournaments and treat it as their primary international team.  We don't and that might not be a bad thing if you are a Test fan like me.  But Graeme Swann has said that players in England's Test players hate playing ODI cricket - they find it dull and the English public doesn't seem to care much about it.  It also doesn't do anything to a players profile really.  Contrast that with India where quite clearly performance in the ODI team makes you a stratospheric superstar.  The passion is just completely different.  A lot of our players see ODI's as a gateway into Test Cricket rather than an end in itself.  That's quite a big cultural problem and you can't just expect to rock up at a World Cup and do well if you've treated ODI's as a second order format.

6.For god's sake get rid of all the 'Team England' drivel.  It creates this 'us' and 'them' mentality in which you are either in the club or outside of the club.  Those outside the club feel that what they do is irrelevant as they'll not get a look in so it is demotivating.  Those inside the club are so desperate to stay there that if they start struggling it gets worse and worse because the financial consequences of dropping out are so massive.  There's also a tendency in that system for coaches and selectors to keep backing failure because otherwise it calls their judgement into question.  The old 'form is temporary, class is permanent' bollocks is trotted out to a ludicrous extent.  Somebody like Morgan would have been well served by being dropped out of the system 12-18 months when it was clear he was struggling. That would have taken the pressure off him and allowed him to start from a positive base of winning his place back in the side rather than playing 18 months in a cycle of misery.  Also would somebody please (and I'm on my knees begging here) put a stop to the utter bulls*** that streams out of the mouths of anyone connected with the England cricket team or the higher echelons of the ECB.  Whether, players, coaches or admin they all come across as soulless middle managers and they don't seem to ever express any joy in what they do even when winning.  Take a leaf out of Australia's book - appoint a Darren Lehman like character and shelve all that utter meaningless self-justifying rubbish and inject some soul back into English cricket.

7. Please leave the recreational format of the game alone.  This is nothing to do with the development of players.  It is to do with the management of those players once they get into county systems.

Yes - I think that seems like a reasonable way forward.  I like the idea of Gillespie being coach - sadly I think all English coaches have swallowed the Andy Flower joy extraction handbook.  If Ashley Giles becomes the next coach they might as well book the England players in for therapy now.....To be honest though half the problem is the focus on the coach.  Cricket's not football - it's far more about individual battles within a game and that's to do with players self-motivating and knowing their own game far more than grand strategy (and we don't seem very good at that anyway).  The idea you could appoint a genius coach who would transform everything seems way off beam to me.  Most members of the great Aussie side are pretty dismissive of John Buchnan's attempts to present himself as some kind of svengali and who can even remember who coached the Windies to greatness? The obsession with the coach is part of the problem which is exactly why a figure who strips everything back to basics and focuses on back his players rather than overcomplicating things would be excellent.  Gillespie would seem a nice fit - the guy speaks English unlike most ECB brainwashed coaches.

I think the following are finished with ODI's;

Anderson (surely time to get as much Test Cricket as possible out of him from now on).
Bopara (doesn't seem much point in persevering with a guy who's not quite made it).
Bell (although I do feel a bit sorry for him.  He's done reasonably well at this World Cup and he's always had the potential to be a top ODI player.  England have not helped him in the slightest by completely messing him about.  He's been forced into so many different roles over the years that I find it hard to be too harsh on him).
Morgan (sorry, he just looks done to me).

Broad is an interesting one.  Maybe it is a physical issue - it's a bit worrying that he has looked off the pace since the surgery he has at the end of last season.  A bit young to completely dismiss I think but maybe time to sit out for a bit.

The young players need games.  Moeen has been a dissapointment at this tournament.  I think he'll go back down the order.  Root is probably going to be the next captain of this team which makes sense as he's of that generation.  Stokes will presumably come back in from the naughty step and we'll see if he's learned anything.  The bowling does look weak though that's the problem.  Not sure about Rashid as an option - he's not exactly young anymore either.  But I think building a side around Hales, Root, Taylor, Ali, Stokes and Buttler would be a decent start.  The bowling situation would be a bit more fluid I think.

Sorry - I wasn't implying you didn't realise how old Rashid was, just stating that it's reason why he wouldn't neccesarily fit.  He's another one who's been royally messed around by England really.  I'm ambiguous - a bit of me would like him to be given a shot and another bit wonders if actually he'd be better off where he is now rather than getting involved in all that again.  Not really convinced that he has quite enough to offer with bat or ball to make it at the international level.  I'd say his batting is not as good as, say, Samit Patel and as a bowler it strikes me he's up against it as a leggy in the modern game.  I think ODI rules are stacked against wrist spinners now with the extra fielder taken away.  I can't see any but the very, very best surviving with the margin of error so low.  On the other hand - what the hell? he'd be well motivated and it would represent a belated apology from England for almost destroying his career.  I'd really like Rashid to make it.

Moeen is immensely frustrating and he always has been.  I watched Moeen's first game for Warwickshire when he was 17 and he was unbelieveably impressive but it's taken him so long to find the consistancy to get here.  He is just one of those guys who will look a million dollars and give his wicket away.  He is a very loose player and I think he needs to engage brain a little bit more in the middle.  I actually like him as an opener to be honest but there's no doubt he's struggled there.  Maybe a finisher is a more logical position for him.

The fact that Stokes is considered a trouble maker says everything really.  We're not talking Jessie Ryder here - his greatest crime seems to be being a normal guy in his early 20s and that didn't fit with Flower era definition of cricketer as carbon copy automoton.  Changing the culture could have a big impact on whether he fulfills that potential or not.

Of course they should pay more attention to the County game but that would clash with the 'Team England' ethic.  I worry for this year's Ashes - Australia seem to be getting better and better.....

A battering at home to New Zealand would end Moores' reign. Just in time for the Ashes.